Electric Vehicles

[Wyzz Kydd]

Originally Posted by 6spdhyperblue

Yeah I mean it’s pretty rough bc you have to squeeze between buildings and then tiny parking spots. It would get wrecked lol.

I have a f150 and was recently thinking I’d love taking it to Europe if I moved there but prob wouldn’t due to its size

It's been a few decades since I lived in Germany. I haven't thought about the size issue in years. Very good point.

I can remember trying to navigate the streets in Amsterdam and really struggling. Driving over the Swiss Alps wasn't a picnic either. Scenic, but scary as hell in a 1973 Porsche 911.

[6spdhyperblue]

I don’t like the feeling of getting trapped in tight streets so not for me. Lol

Plenty of rangers tho..even ranger raptors so a midsize would be the way to go..despite my f150 getting better mpg. Although a air cooled 911 sounds pretty good heh

[Wyzz Kydd]

Originally Posted by 6spdhyperblue

I don’t like the feeling of getting trapped in tight streets so not for me. Lol

Plenty of rangers tho..even ranger raptors so a midsize would be the way to go..despite my f150 getting better mpg. Although a air cooled 911 sounds pretty good heh

That car had exactly zero margin of error at the handling limit. I well remember my father doing a 180 while driving over Storm King mountain in NY at about 60 mph. Highest pucker factor I've ever experienced. A little skill and a ton of luck that we didn't go through the wall and over the edge.

[Iron Lung Jimmy]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

My company’s position on EV is very similar to my own…”it is what it is”. I don’t often comment on what I want the future to be, I comment on where the data is telling us it will land.

I agree that "it is what it is"... but what is it? Between govt tax incentives and Tesla slashing their prices, the market is clearly being manipulated so the fact that the Tesla Y is the best selling vehicle in the world means what going forward? Do people love Tesla Y's or are sales being artificially inflated and are unsustainable?

Your own data... or if not yours, data you did not refute... shows that on vehicles without incentives sales are anything from soft to tanking depending on the vehicle. So what does that mean? Is that the true market?

In my job I have to recommend doing, or not doing, really expensive things based on relevant data. So I am pretty good at parsing information and determining what is useful and what is not.

This car sales data is not telling me anything about where the future will land. Add in my personal feelings about the unknowns and I have an opinion, but it is certainly not data based because the data is inherently flawed.

My opinion is that EV's will do just fine, but not because people necessarily want them but that the Govt will do some combination of paying people to buy them and shoving them down our throats.

I suspect that is also your companies position, which is fine, but the data is not telling us that people are clamoring to buy EV's because the data is pretty much worthless.

[Wyzz Kydd]

Originally Posted by Iron Lung Jimmy

I agree that "it is what it is"... but what is it? Between govt tax incentives and Tesla slashing their prices, the market is clearly being manipulated so the fact that the Tesla Y is the best selling vehicle in the world means what going forward? Do people love Tesla Y's or are sales being artificially inflated and are unsustainable?

Your own data... or if not yours, data you did not refute... shows that on vehicles without incentives sales are anything from soft to tanking depending on the vehicle. So what does that mean? Is that the true market?

In my job I have to recommend doing, or not doing, really expensive things based on relevant data. So I am pretty good at parsing information and determining what is useful and what is not.

This car sales data is not telling me anything about where the future will land. Add in my personal feelings about the unknowns and I have an opinion, but it is certainly not data based because the data is inherently flawed.

My opinion is that EV's will do just fine, but not because people necessarily want them but that the Govt will do some combination of paying people to buy them and shoving them down our throats.

I suspect that is also your companies position, which is fine, but the data is not telling us that people are clamoring to buy EV's because the data is pretty much worthless.

I agree, but you will get fanboys who try to argue that ICE vehicles are subsidized as well, though they won't be able to point to any specific vehicles. Instead we hear, 'oh, such and such company got a tax break to locate their factory in such and such place and blah blah.' Apples and oranges.

[snizzle]

Originally Posted by Wyzz Kydd

I agree, but you will get fanboys who try to argue that ICE vehicles are subsidized as well, though they won't be able to point to any specific vehicles. Instead we hear, 'oh, such and such company got a tax break to locate their factory in such and such place and blah blah.' Apples and oranges.

I think those comments originate to the oil industry being subsidized which is true to a degree. I say remove all the subsidies for both and let's play this deal based on product merit alone.

[Iron Lung Jimmy]

Originally Posted by snizzle

I think those comments originate to the oil industry being subsidized which is true to a degree. I say remove all the subsidies for both and let's play this deal based on product merit alone.

Oil industry "subsidies" consist of tax breaks similar to what every other industry get so that's basically an imaginary argument. And the govt is not paying consumers to buy petrol so apples and oranges with regard to EV's

And oil is about way, way more than cars. Our lives would drastically change without it. A surprising amount of stuff we take for granted would be gone. You want oil companies to drill wells.

[Wyzz Kydd]

Originally Posted by Iron Lung Jimmy

Oil industry "subsidies" consist of tax breaks similar to what every other industry get so that's basically an imaginary argument. And the govt is not paying consumers to buy petrol so apples and oranges with regard to EV's

And oil is about way, way more than cars. Our lives would drastically change without it. A surprising amount of stuff we take for granted would be gone. You want oil companies to drill wells.

For sure. Drill baby drill!

[90503]

How hard can it be to forecast and compare EV vs. ICE when manufacturers, states, administrations and countries have set a date to end ICE production, prohibit sales and hobble fossil fuel production and delete ICE choices in the meantime?...lol

[Wyzz Kydd]

Originally Posted by 90503

How hard can it be to forecast and compare EV vs. ICE when manufacturers, states, administrations and countries have set a date to end ICE production, prohibit sales and hobble fossil fuel production and delete ICE choices in the meantime?...lol

I have a pretty safe forecast. Fewer choices, higher prices, more tyranny.

[Gen6cyl]

There are people that can't afford a ev but can afford a ic auto.They don't care that you may not be able to charge it. They only care about o tail pipe emissions and making you obey.

[Wyzz Kydd]

Originally Posted by Gen6cyl

There are people that can't afford a ev but can afford a ic auto.They don't care that you may not be able to charge it. They only care about o tail pipe emissions and making you obey.

Fixed that for you.

[Gen6cyl]

Originally Posted by Wyzz Kydd

Fixed that for you.

I agree. Their wake up call is loud and clear.

[snizzle]

Originally Posted by Iron Lung Jimmy

And the govt is not paying consumers to buy petrol so apples and oranges with regard to EV's

I wouldn't say the government is paying consumers. They are just willing to give you back up to $7500 of your own money they confiscated throughout the year if you buy an EV that qualifies.