2013 GT500 Video about TRACTION

[Blackdevil77]

Here's a video I just saw on youtube about the GT500 and a ford rep talking about the traction problems of the previous GT500's, why they decided to go with 285's in the rear and how they plan on overcoming those traction problems.

Sorry if this is a repost...



This thing with it's 650 hp, larger gears hitting 60 in first gear, revving to 7000 rpm ( nearly 1000 higher then the ZL1) and weighing much then the ZL1 is definitely gonna be a threat to the ZL1. Not to mention single piece carbon fiber driveshaft reducing weight and drivetrain power loss.

Boys, time to put the LS9 in the ZL1!!!

[ffrcobra_65]

Job 1 at Ford = GT500 will stay ahead of the ZL1 at any cost. BTW, I spent the holidays in Vegas and visited a friend who works at the old chicken farmer's company. I know, the GT500 is not made there but the "rumor" in the chicken coop is, the '13 GT500 will crush the ZL1. I said, its #s are nice but we won't know until they go head to head. I joked that as long as Carrol doesn't get his hands on it, it should be just fine out of the factory...and if only Jack Roush would be allowed to put his suspension magic on the GT500s for $25k less than what Carroll charges to "supersnake" a GT500...... he didn't like it too much.

[Silverlsinva]

i still dont see any pricing on this car as of yet.

[IOMZL1]

The weight distribution is so bad they cant increase rear tire size or the car won't turn.

Last time I checked race cars have fairly large front tires. (reality check)

Should be a fun face-off when it finally happens.

[eolson]

Well, with that logic, they could just put more weight in back and the car would have 50%/50% weight distribution and weigh the same as the ZL1. Obviously many world class cars have the same or a tiny bit more of a front / rear proportion as the 2013 GT500. It's all in the engineering of the chassis and suspension. Erik

[IOMZL1]

Originally Posted by eolson

Well, with that logic, they could just put more weight in back and the car would have 50%/50% weight distribution and weigh the same as the ZL1. Obviously many world class cars have the same or a tiny bit more of a front / rear proportion as the 2013 GT500. It's all in the engineering of the chassis and suspension. Erik

It is a fact that FWD weight bias creates understeer and he basically said that was the reason for not changing the tires. They went another route - many ways to skin a cat. True, the ZL1 is heavier. Each has their own strengths and weaknesses.

I'm not sure how many world class cars have more FWD weight balance than the GT500. All I'm saying is that he seemed to indicate a larger front tire was a bad thing when in fact it isn't that simple. As you say, it is all in the engineering which is my point. He just wanted to make GM's way of doing things look unrefined when that may not be the case. You don’t see F1 cars with skinny front tires regardless of their near ideal weight distribution.

[rez333]

It's interesting that they think of the GT500 as a balanced sports car. Isn't the Boss 302 the "balanced sports car" and the GT500 the strip monster? Not saying that the GT500 is not a good track car, but it's interesting to speculate on how they are positioning the GT500.

[LimaCharlie]

It's interesting that he referred to the '13 GT500 as the modern day Ford GT. The Ford GT ran mid/high 3's 0-60 and low/mid 11's in the 1/4 mile, which kills the current GT500 and proposed ZL1 specs. Does this mean the '13 car will have similar numbers? If so, what is the MSRP going to be?

[8cd03gro]

Originally Posted by IOMZL1

It is a fact that FWD weight bias creates understeer and he basically said that was the reason for not changing the tires. They went another route - many ways to skin a cat. True, the ZL1 is heavier. Each has their own strengths and weaknesses.

I'm not sure how many world class cars have more FWD weight balance than the GT500. All I'm saying is that he seemed to indicate a larger front tire was a bad thing when in fact it isn't that simple. As you say, it is all in the engineering which is my point. He just wanted to make GM's way of doing things look unrefined when that may not be the case. You don’t see F1 cars with skinny front tires regardless of their near ideal weight distribution.

How do you know the weight distribution of the '13 gt500?

[rez333]

Originally Posted by LimaCharlie

It's interesting that he referred to the '13 GT500 as the modern day Ford GT. The Ford GT ran mid/high 3's 0-60 and low/mid 11's in the 1/4 mile, which kills the current GT500 and proposed ZL1 specs. Does this mean the '13 car will have similar numbers? If so, what is the MSRP going to be?

if the GT500 can do high 3s like the ZL-1, then it can do mid 11s in the 1/4 mile given it's superior rev limit and horsepower. Basically if it can overcome traction, the 650 HP will take over the rest and surely beat the 550HP Ford GT?

[2012ZL1]

Thats not a Ford rep, just some Jibroni...
Besides, Zl1 is still twice the car the 500 is any day of the week.

[PeeBee]

Originally Posted by IOMZL1

It is a fact that FWD weight bias creates understeer and he basically said that was the reason for not changing the tires. They went another route - many ways to skin a cat. True, the ZL1 is heavier. Each has their own strengths and weaknesses.

I'm not sure how many world class cars have more FWD weight balance than the GT500. All I'm saying is that he seemed to indicate a larger front tire was a bad thing when in fact it isn't that simple. As you say, it is all in the engineering which is my point. He just wanted to make GM's way of doing things look unrefined when that may not be the case. You don’t see F1 cars with skinny front tires regardless of their near ideal weight distribution.

Ideal balance for a sports/race car is 40F/60R, not 50/50 as most people seem to think. Even with 50/50 weight distribution a car will tend to understeer.

The Mustang is around 57F/42R roughly, so they have to stick to skinny rears compared to the fronts, to try and reduce the understeer.

That being said... IF I ever get the chance to drive a GT500 in comparison to the Camaro... I wouldn't say no


As for that guy doing the explanation.... Doesn't really convince me, there are too much "erhms" in his explanation, and his eyes are everywhere (something they tought me NOT do to when giving a presentation... Always look at a fixed point, when you don't want to look into a camera/the audience)

[eolson]

I really don't think a 265/40/19 front tire is too thin on this car. We know the weight is 3850, so we have to see what the front/rear numbers are. Again there is lots of world class cars with these front tire widths. The question is, is the harmony between the front/rear weight distribution, total weight, suspension set up, chassis, power with traction control, gear ratios, tire grip, and braking going to lead to significantly superior performance from this 2013 car as opposed to the last version on the same various tracks around the country? We'll see. Erik

[IOMZL1]

Originally Posted by PeeBee

Ideal balance for a sports/race car is 40F/60R, not 50/50 as most people seem to think. Even with 50/50 weight distribution a car will tend to understeer.

Agreed.


I don know the balance of the 2013 but not much is mentioned about weight reduction or a balance shift. It could be different but likely not by more than 1% if that. They have been dialing out U/S since the car came out and a big help to that was the aluminum block engine. Before that it was horrible.

Erik, I agree with you. Not saying ford got the tire or the balance wrong. Just saying they had to go a different route for traction other that tires. This is the nature of thier chassis. For GM it is different.

As for the 'world class cars' comment on tire size, the ZL1 is different from a lot of cars we've ever seen. They are breaking the mold. If they've figured out a way to stuff bigger tires under there and keep the steering feel - advantage ZL1. It is as if this guy is trying to dismiss the larger tires by saying 'we are doing what everyone else is so it is ok'. I guarantee you if they could get bigger tires to work wihout major changes they would have.