New truck reliability going "downhill"

[ariZona28]

Originally Posted by 102SS

The problem wasn't just axing the V8 it was getting rid of base models and lower trim units.

Almost all the trucks across every ones lineup are loaded out now.

60.70,80k is not in a lot of people budget for a truck.

This is SPOT ON! For 2/3s of the price of a new "truck" I'm running this entire setup. Sure, the 2500 doesn't have heated seats, lane departure warning, backup cameras or any other amenities that allow 5ft tall soccer moms to squeeze into the closest parking spaces at Costco but it's still VERY comfortable and more than capable of meeting my requirements. And when I'm at the track with the hood up the 8.1L gets nearly as much attention as the LS3 in my C5 Z. Yeah, it only gets 8 to 10 mpg but I'm happy to increase my carbon footprint whenever I get the opportunity.

[102SS]

Originally Posted by ariZona28

This is SPOT ON! For 2/3s of the price of a new "truck" I'm running this entire setup. Sure, the 2500 doesn't have heated seats, lane departure warning, backup cameras or any other amenities that allow 5ft tall soccer moms to squeeze into the closest parking spaces at Costco but it's still VERY comfortable and more than capable of meeting my requirements. And when I'm at the track with the hood up the 8.1L gets nearly as much attention as the LS3 in my C5 Z. Yeah, it only gets 8 to 10 mpg but I'm happy to increase my carbon footprint whenever I get the opportunity.

Nice looking truck and a great tow rig

[lbls1]

Originally Posted by 102SS

The problem wasn't just axing the V8 it was getting rid of base models and lower trim units.

Almost all the trucks across every ones lineup are loaded out now.

60.70,80k is not in a lot of people budget for a truck.

This is so true. I never imagined a Chevy truck costing as much as a Mercedes. The dealers were aggressive in their pricing as well.

Without going to the highest optioned truck but staying moderate with the mid trims and options, you are still looking at mid 50's to 60k on a new truck! That is well over the budget for a lot of people.

[Capricio]

Originally Posted by ariZona28

Sure, the 2500 doesn't have heated seats, lane departure warning, backup cameras or any other amenities that allow 5ft tall soccer moms to squeeze into the closest parking spaces at Costco

For about $300 and some scraped knuckles you could easily get yourself a single DIN floating touchscreen head unit with a reverse cam and guidelines, android auto, carplay, bluetooth, usb, etc. I think a light "tech refresh" on these old vehicle helps to stave off the desire to get into something new.

[ariZona28]

Originally Posted by Capricio

For about $300 and some scraped knuckles you could easily get yourself a single DIN floating touchscreen head unit with a reverse cam and guidelines, android auto, carplay, bluetooth, usb, etc. I think a light "tech refresh" on these old vehicle helps to stave off the desire to get into something new.

LOL! Yeah, no.

[FarmerFran]

The average price of a new car is about $49,000. Trucks have been more "expensive" for years now. Hell, go price a Tahoe, Suburban, Grand Wagoneer ETC... we like our big expensive vehicles.

Anyone of the 3 - Ford, GM, RAM are freaking super nice in top trim. RAM won CAR of the year before because of it.

Us American's "Have it our way!" and I love it.

[102SS]

Originally Posted by FarmerFran

The average price of a new car is about $49,000. Trucks have been more "expensive" for years now. Hell, go price a Tahoe, Suburban, Grand Wagoneer ETC... we like our big expensive vehicles.

Anyone of the 3 - Ford, GM, RAM are freaking super nice in top trim. RAM won CAR of the year before because of it.

Us American's "Have it our way!" and I love it.

I am not saying they shouldn't sell loaded out vehicles.

We just need the low buck ones on the lot as well.

Those big Lux SUV's cost as much as a new Vette and more

[FarmerFran]

Originally Posted by 102SS

I am not saying they shouldn't sell loaded out vehicles.

We just need the low buck ones on the lot as well.

Those big Lux SUV's cost as much as a new Vette and more

The slate is going to sell like mad

[Capricio]

Originally Posted by FarmerFran

The slate is going to sell like mad

...or, then again, maybe not.

https://www.theautopian.com/the-slat...ok-a-huge-hit/

To be sure, EV incentives would bring the Slate’s price down below $20,000, which is cheap for any new car, but given the precarious nature of the $7,500 new clean-vehicle incentive, it’s possible this new Slate will cost consumers over $27 big ones when it launches in late 2026. And $27+ grand for a car with no paint, no infotainment system, and no radio is just not competitive at all.

[Guava]

I've had the following trucks:
2000 S10 4 cylinder
2008 Silverado V8
2011 Avalanche V8 (still have this)
2017 Colorado V6
2018 Colorado ZR2 V6
None of these have had any problems mechanically, never left me stranded.


Currently DD a 2024 Canyon Denali, 4 cylinder turbo. Got it in Oct 2024, now has over 20,000 miles. Smooth as can be, awesome interior. Only 1 issue, battery died a month in. Dealer charged it up, no other problems since.

[lbls1]

Let me add just a bit from my adventures. Average prices on a new car will start at roughly 27k. A moderately optioned car will run just below 40k. Your average traditional sized pick up truck will start at roughly 50k, without the v8 or incentives. Higher optioned trucks =watch out wallet and get ready to cut that check. I wasn't wholly surprised until I factored in the sales tax.

It's an unfortunate state of the market but it is is! What I am afraid of is a slowdown in a car genre or an economic downturn. The mfrs will need to be cautious and keep abreast of the steadily changing market.

[Capricio]

The Big 3 have already surrendered the budget car market, and more and more, they are gravitating to lower volume/higher margin trucks and SUVs.

There isn't exactly an American analogue to any of these British brands, so will the Dodges, Fords and Chevrolets fade into ignominy like so many other Austins, Morrises, Rovers, Triumphs, or Rileys before them? Will our one time standard of the world auto industry soon be reduced to Cadillac and Jeep? Perhaps Corvette?

Only two out of the lowest priced 15, Trax/Envista and Trailblazer, from the big 3. Nothing from Ford or Stellantis, they aren't even trying.

Cheapest New Cars You Can Buy in 2025
2025 Nissan Versa | $21,130
2025 Hyundai Venue | $21,650
2025 Kia Soul | $21,885
2025 Chevrolet Trax | $21,895
2025 Nissan Sentra | $22,730
2025 Nissan Kicks Play | $22,910
2025 Kia K4 | $23,165
2025 Nissan Kicks | $23,220
2025 Hyundai Elantra | $23,320
2025 Toyota Corolla Sedan | $23,545
2025 Volkswagen Jetta | $23,720
2025 Chevrolet Trailblazer | $24,890
2025 Buick Envista | $25,195
2025 Mazda 3 | $25,335
2025 Honda Civic | $25,400

[Capricio]

https://gmauthority.com/blog/2025/07...our-motor-oil/

I don't believe anything the General says anymore. From the comments section:

This is a perfect opportunity to remember that what’s good for GM isn’t necessarily good for you the consumer.

Let’s not forget that GM already specs the 0W40 for the LT1/LT2/LT4/LT5, which covers all the Gen V small blocks in performance vehicles (save the rather unique LT6). In fact they used to spec 5W30 for street and 5W50 for track, and updated new AND existing recommendations to 0W40 as it provides good protection for both. Note that all Gen V V8s have the same clearances, and in fact the heads, valvetrain, cam, and rotating assemblies of an LT1 and L86 have the EXACT same part numbers, the blocks are identical where it counts as well, just different castings for a few external bolt holes though they are still interchangeable.

0W20 and 0W40 have save viscosity when cold, so no increased wear on startup, but 0W40 will maintain higher shear strength and lubricity at high temperatures and loads vs 0W20, which is why they recommend it for sports cars that may see high rpms and track use. Heavier vehicles put more load on the engine, and especially when towing and hauling that will heat the oil just as much if not more.

They spec 0W20 because they can, and the lower viscosity under load makes just enough difference in fuel consumption and therefore emissions that they can add up over millions of vehicles to improve their CAFE and EPA fleet scores. Those same requirements prevent GM from permanently modifying the powertrain configuration in a way may alter those scores after-sale without a defensible reason. This is why disabling auto-stop/start and modes that disable AFM/DFM cannot be set permanently and must be changed every start-up, they have to default to the tested configuration.

GM knows that 0W40 is going to protect the engine more effectively, that’s why they recommend it as a Band-Aid fix to the L87s that MAY have defective finishing on the crank and/or rods, which is also a defensible reason as they can say it benefits the consumer by reducing the likelihood of failure. For engines that they have no reason to believe have the defects, however, they cannot defend recommending a different oil weight which is the ONLY reason they say to still use 0W20, as that’s the configuration the powertrain was certified with for EPA/CAFE standards.

Note that the difference in fuel consumption for oil weight, AFM/DFM, auto-stop/start and similar technologies is not going to make a noticeable difference on a single vehicle for most use cases. It’s only for the specific requirements of the respective test cycles, which may or may not be even remotely close to the way a given driver will use their vehicle, and only makes a difference when added up over millions of vehicles sold per year.

The ONLY theoretical advantage of 0W20 vs 0W40 other than cost/availability is the fact that it takes less friction modifiers and viscosity improvers to make a 0W oil behave like a 20W at temp vs a 40W, so less to break down over the oil’s life. This allows GM to get away with longer oil change intervals while still making it through the warranty period. But if you want your vehicle to last, this is basically GM admitting that you should use 0W40 and change your oil at regular intervals.

Do with that information what you like.

I guess we already knew our LT1s and LT2s have the EXACT same rotating assemblies/crankcases as he L87, the only difference is lower production numbers and the application, which shouldn't drive a different oil prescription, unless it's for policy compliance, not reliability.

[102SS]

AFAIK 0-20 oil is a Ford spec.