Classic muscle or Modern Muscle ? - Page 3 - Camaro5 Chevy Camaro Forum / Camaro ZL1, SS and V6 Forums

DRKS1D3 · 11-23-2016, 08:21 AM

The 60's and 70's were before my time, but my Dad had a '69 Nova SS (auto) 396 and a '70 Nova SS (4 speed) with a built 350 putting out ~425hp. He has told me that he loved those cars to death and it was a fun time, but this new muscle is something else. We live ~200 miles apart and every summer he drives the ZL1 out so we can enjoy some car shows together. The ZL1 rides and handles like a precision instrument and also gets >20MPG highway. He says that he never would of dreamt of driving those Nova's that far. Power for days, but they rode and handled like a buckboard wagon and on top of that, they got 8-10MPG. It is a great time to be a car guy!

aris · 11-23-2016, 10:33 AM

I have one of each. A 67' Camaro (with all the fancy DSE bells and whistles, custom subframe, minitub, quadra-link, forged wheels, stroked LS3, T56, etc., etc.), and a 2015 Z/28 (stock).

I love the 67', but honestly the Z/28 is just better in every way. If I had to have only one, it would be the Z/28. I have no intention of selling the 67' though.

_aJ_ · 11-23-2016, 12:52 PM

I think everybody should have both. There's something you get from driving an old muscle/classic car that even something as great as our Z28's can't provide.
My 54 3100 with a duramax/allison drivetrain.

My 69 Chevelle with a turbo LS.

But of course I do love the Z28

hjdca · 11-23-2016, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hjdca

Here you go . My '70 SS396, original block, but, very built with a nasty cam and exhaust. I wish I could put a cam like that in my Z/28.. My Chevelle is lowered with an Eibach suspension, but, the Z/28 is slammed !

Here is more of a closeup of my '70 Chevelle SS396. It is an original SS396 car with original motor, original fathom blue color, ivory interior color, but, restomod... The motor is built, big heads, big cam, big exhaust, big carb, TKO 600, etc... with some spray.
Regarding Torque, just on motor with original 3:73 gears and the 12 bolt, the Chevelle SS396 (bored 30 over) and Z/28 LS7 motors seem very similar. I have not rev'd the Z/28 yet past 4.5K (still on break in), but, the LS7 is definitely a great muscle car motor. Chevy did it right by putting the LS7 in the Z/28. When I am rowing the Z/28, it always makes me think and compare it to rowing my Chevelle and that is exactly what I want. The LS7 definitely gives the Z/28 a big block muscle car feel.... Different than a power adder feel ... My brother took the cool pic..

Curts14 · 11-23-2016, 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

I know where you're coming from (and BTW happy belated birthday from another old November baby).

It's a tougher call for me. I miss the simplicity of the original muscle, pony, and sports cars and their generally "lighter" styling. But I much prefer the performance levels available with the new, especially the cornering and braking capabilities . . . but not most of the complexity and extraneous feature content that has come with it. The 'old' doesn't have enough of what's 'new', and the 'new' has too much of it, if you know what I mean.

I might just have to build a "Pro-Touring" car with a heavy dose of road course track day intent.

1955 is a good enough starting point for at least a couple of reasons that should really strike home with people here - the 1955 'shoebox' Chevy, and the introduction of the original SBC. Both became huge impacts on hotrodding and the car culture.

Norm

Happy Birthday to you too, Norm.

KJZ28 · 11-23-2016, 08:27 PM

I have had classic and modern. I like driving my cars 365 days a year. When I was driving classics daily it was always a headache. I really adore my 2010 SS. If I had extra money I would get the new ZL1. I would really like a Corvette but the roads around here are not conducive to daily driving one. The ZL1 has the ground clearance I need.

ritchet · 11-23-2016, 09:05 PM

I have thought of this when ever I see the raffle with the new and classic car on Velocity. I determined that if I won I would keep the new one and sell the old one. I guess that answers this question.

serviceguy · 11-24-2016, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ritchet

I have thought of this when ever I see the raffle with the new and classic car on Velocity. I determined that if I won I would keep the new one and sell the old one. I guess that answers this question.

I think it takes a special appreciation of classic muscle, car to car, modern muscle and all the performance goodies is far superior. it's crazy to think that classic muscle car values are nearly the same as modern performance. Speaks volumes of what demand is, and what people are willing to pay.

The_Raging_Bull · 11-24-2016, 12:09 PM

Three of my favorite things..my best friend friend/wife for going on 28 years, and the two LS7's that we get to go eeny, meeny, miny, moe with every weekend to pick which one we're going to drive ....until its too cold.

Like Justified I'm down south, though he's got the better end in DFW.

To the OP I've driven them all, the LS7 in an '09 Z06 and the '15 Z/28 rev great to 7K, and above 4000...well hang on. The Hemi's rev great, but feel ponderous on the road, They ought to at 4100+lbs.

And older muscle, look great, but their power bands are woefully short of modern engines. The tow best NA cars are the ones I've got...the LS7 is THE greatest engine Chevy ever designed.. read this article by HIb Halverson; called THE RUTHLESS PURSUIT OF POWER: THE MYSTIQUE OF THE C6 CORVETTE LS7 ENGINE
it details the engine development and the fixes applied to fix valve guide issues seen in Z06's due to engine head suppliers not doing enough or proper inspection.

http://www.corvetteactioncenter.com/...te-ls7-engine/

If I'm honest the Z06 is just blazing fast at 3160 lbs, but the Z/28 feels more fun - visceral and it torches Vette coupes... I'd love to have the Camaro .391 setup in my '09 rear end.While my girl likes the vette due to it smoother handling..that is DSVV shocks; but personally thats what I love bout the Z >>is the rumbling I'm gonna kick your a attitude it exudes.

Good luck in you choice, a Z in either Z06 or Z/28 persuasions ...well just zoom zoom zoom.

redcoats1976 · 11-24-2016, 05:49 PM

had a big block 66 pontiac,modded with headers,4v carb and cam for 25 years.sorry to say it but my 2015 RS is as quick,faster on top end,gets 3x the gas mileage,and is whisper quiet.im staying with modern muscle.

Raven87 · 11-28-2016, 06:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Raging_Bull

Three of my favorite things..my best friend friend/wife for going on 28 years, and the two LS7's that we get to go eeny, meeny, miny, moe with every weekend to pick which one we're going to drive ....until its too cold.

Like Justified I'm down south, though he's got the better end in DFW.

To the OP I've driven them all, the LS7 in an '09 Z06 and the '15 Z/28 rev great to 7K, and above 4000...well hang on. The Hemi's rev great, but feel ponderous on the road, They ought to at 4100+lbs.

And older muscle, look great, but their power bands are woefully short of modern engines. The tow best NA cars are the ones I've got...the LS7 is THE greatest engine Chevy ever designed.. read this article by HIb Halverson; called THE RUTHLESS PURSUIT OF POWER: THE MYSTIQUE OF THE C6 CORVETTE LS7 ENGINE
it details the engine development and the fixes applied to fix valve guide issues seen in Z06's due to engine head suppliers not doing enough or proper inspection.

http://www.corvetteactioncenter.com/...te-ls7-engine/

If I'm honest the Z06 is just blazing fast at 3160 lbs, but the Z/28 feels more fun - visceral and it torches Vette coupes... I'd love to have the Camaro .391 setup in my '09 rear end.While my girl likes the vette due to it smoother handling..that is DSVV shocks; but personally thats what I love bout the Z >>is the rumbling I'm gonna kick your a attitude it exudes.

Good luck in you choice, a Z in either Z06 or Z/28 persuasions ...well just zoom zoom zoom.

Good perspective!

I definitely agree - the LS7 is a serious monster. I've driven several C6Zs and they were all unbelievable. The first one I drove was a 2009 and that drive lives with me still today - it was just that impressive.

When I found out GM was putting the LS7 in the Gen 5 Z/28 I was thrilled.

Like you said - whether in a Z/28 or a Z06, the LS7 is a blast to drive.

JUSTIFIED · 11-28-2016, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Raging_Bull

Three of my favorite things..my best friend friend/wife for going on 28 years, and the two LS7's that we get to go eeny, meeny, miny, moe with every weekend to pick which one we're going to drive ....until its too cold.

Like Justified I'm down south, though he's got the better end in DFW.

To the OP I've driven them all, the LS7 in an '09 Z06 and the '15 Z/28 rev great to 7K, and above 4000...well hang on. The Hemi's rev great, but feel ponderous on the road, They ought to at 4100+lbs.

And older muscle, look great, but their power bands are woefully short of modern engines. The tow best NA cars are the ones I've got...the LS7 is THE greatest engine Chevy ever designed.. read this article by HIb Halverson; called THE RUTHLESS PURSUIT OF POWER: THE MYSTIQUE OF THE C6 CORVETTE LS7 ENGINE
it details the engine development and the fixes applied to fix valve guide issues seen in Z06's due to engine head suppliers not doing enough or proper inspection.

http://www.corvetteactioncenter.com/...te-ls7-engine/

If I'm honest the Z06 is just blazing fast at 3160 lbs, but the Z/28 feels more fun - visceral and it torches Vette coupes... I'd love to have the Camaro .391 setup in my '09 rear end.While my girl likes the vette due to it smoother handling..that is DSVV shocks; but personally thats what I love bout the Z >>is the rumbling I'm gonna kick your a attitude it exudes.

Good luck in you choice, a Z in either Z06 or Z/28 persuasions ...well just zoom zoom zoom.

Nice pic and really great that your wife enjoys them too. Mine does as well. She'll even drive the Z from time to time. She grew up with brothers who drove hopped up Stangs and Camaros.

JUSTIFIED · 11-28-2016, 11:34 AM

I'd truly like to have one of each, but have a few other hobbies (mainly motorcycling) that keep me pretty busy when not working or playing around in my Z and can't afford to sink $$ in a classic right now.

I rode in a '69 Z/28 a few months ago and it was a blast, but the owner has put a lot of $$ into it and it still needs some work. As mentioned, one of each would be nice, but not sure I want the extra hassle. It's not just the money, it's the time spent on the maintenance and whatnot. I'd rather be out on my bike or cruising in the modern Z/28 (when not working...) :-)

chase@ridetech · 11-29-2016, 10:07 AM

In my opinion, out of the box the Modern Muscle is the way to go for the no worries driving experience but if you are willing to spend some time and money on the Classic Muscle cars you can have modern muscle wrapped in the body of a classic. Most of the cars we have here at Ridetech are Pre-72 but they have been modernized with our suspension components, have fuel-injection, updated ac/heat, new wiring, bigger brakes, tighter steering boxes, etc. We have the classic look with the modern dependability and drivability.

11-23-2016, 08:21 AM	#29
DRKS1D3 Drives: '17 Corvette Grand Sport M7 Join Date: May 2012 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 3,748	The 60's and 70's were before my time, but my Dad had a '69 Nova SS (auto) 396 and a '70 Nova SS (4 speed) with a built 350 putting out ~425hp. He has told me that he loved those cars to death and it was a fun time, but this new muscle is something else. We live ~200 miles apart and every summer he drives the ZL1 out so we can enjoy some car shows together. The ZL1 rides and handles like a precision instrument and also gets >20MPG highway. He says that he never would of dreamt of driving those Nova's that far. Power for days, but they rode and handled like a buckboard wagon and on top of that, they got 8-10MPG. It is a great time to be a car guy! __________________ MY RIDE: 2017 CORVETTE GRAND SPORT--TRIPLE BLACK, 7 SPEED MANUAL, VARARAM TCR-7 INTAKE, BORLA CATLESS X-PIPE, CARBON FIBER STAGE 2 AERO, MGW SHORT-THROW SHIFTER SOLD2011 TRIPLE BLACK SS CONVERTIBLE--6 SPEED MANUAL, MANY MODS, 455 RWHP/435 RWTQ DAD'S RIDE: 2012 ZL1 #1866--BLACK, 6 SPEED MANUAL, EXPOSED CF HOOD, POLISHED WHEELS, SUNROOF, ROTO-FAB INTAKE "Silly Americans, taking from the rich and giving to the poor only works in fairy tales. Success is earned here!".

11-23-2016, 08:27 PM	#34
KJZ28 Drives: 2018 Buick Regal TourX Join Date: Aug 2015 Location: North of NYC Posts: 546 View My Garage	I have had classic and modern. I like driving my cars 365 days a year. When I was driving classics daily it was always a headache. I really adore my 2010 SS. If I had extra money I would get the new ZL1. I would really like a Corvette but the roads around here are not conducive to daily driving one. The ZL1 has the ground clearance I need. __________________ SOLD: 2010 2SS/RS L99-A6 K&N CAI, Speed Engineering Long Tube Headers, Stainless Works hi-flow cats, Flowmaster American Thunder Cat-back. Tuned by Corvettes of Westchester. 1/LE rear suspension conversion, Bilstein B6 Stuts/shocks.

11-24-2016, 12:09 PM	#37
The_Raging_Bull Raging Bull Reborn Drives: '09 CGM Z063LZ '15 RH Z/28 #0631 Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Broken Arrow OK Posts: 765 View My Garage	Three of my favorite things..my best friend friend/wife for going on 28 years, and the two LS7's that we get to go eeny, meeny, miny, moe with every weekend to pick which one we're going to drive ....until its too cold. Like Justified I'm down south, though he's got the better end in DFW. To the OP I've driven them all, the LS7 in an '09 Z06 and the '15 Z/28 rev great to 7K, and above 4000...well hang on. The Hemi's rev great, but feel ponderous on the road, They ought to at 4100+lbs. And older muscle, look great, but their power bands are woefully short of modern engines. The tow best NA cars are the ones I've got...the LS7 is THE greatest engine Chevy ever designed.. read this article by HIb Halverson; called THE RUTHLESS PURSUIT OF POWER: THE MYSTIQUE OF THE C6 CORVETTE LS7 ENGINE it details the engine development and the fixes applied to fix valve guide issues seen in Z06's due to engine head suppliers not doing enough or proper inspection. http://www.corvetteactioncenter.com/...te-ls7-engine/ If I'm honest the Z06 is just blazing fast at 3160 lbs, but the Z/28 feels more fun - visceral and it torches Vette coupes... I'd love to have the Camaro .391 setup in my '09 rear end.While my girl likes the vette due to it smoother handling..that is DSVV shocks; but personally thats what I love bout the Z >>is the rumbling I'm gonna kick your a attitude it exudes. Good luck in you choice, a Z in either Z06 or Z/28 persuasions ...well just zoom zoom zoom. __________________ Toy 1 '15 RH Z/28 w/AC & Radio S/N 0631 Toy 2 '09 CGM Z06 3LZ My DD: '17 Ford Mustang GT Her DD: '14 F150 Ecoboost 3.5

11-28-2016, 11:34 AM	#41
JUSTIFIED Drives: 2015 black Z/28 Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: Texas Posts: 1,077	I'd truly like to have one of each, but have a few other hobbies (mainly motorcycling) that keep me pretty busy when not working or playing around in my Z and can't afford to sink $$ in a classic right now. I rode in a '69 Z/28 a few months ago and it was a blast, but the owner has put a lot of $$ into it and it still needs some work. As mentioned, one of each would be nice, but not sure I want the extra hassle. It's not just the money, it's the time spent on the maintenance and whatnot. I'd rather be out on my bike or cruising in the modern Z/28 (when not working...) :-) __________________

11-23-2016, 10:33 AM	#30
aris Drives: Z/28 Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: Bay Area Posts: 280	I have one of each. A 67' Camaro (with all the fancy DSE bells and whistles, custom subframe, minitub, quadra-link, forged wheels, stroked LS3, T56, etc., etc.), and a 2015 Z/28 (stock). I love the 67', but honestly the Z/28 is just better in every way. If I had to have only one, it would be the Z/28. I have no intention of selling the 67' though.

11-23-2016, 12:52 PM	#31
_aJ_ Drives: 2015 Z28 Join Date: May 2015 Location: Midland, Tx Posts: 33	I think everybody should have both. There's something you get from driving an old muscle/classic car that even something as great as our Z28's can't provide. My 54 3100 with a duramax/allison drivetrain. My 69 Chevelle with a turbo LS. But of course I do love the Z28

11-23-2016, 09:05 PM	#35
ritchet Drives: 2015 Camaro 1LS Red Rock Join Date: Dec 2015 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 121 View My Garage	I have thought of this when ever I see the raffle with the new and classic car on Velocity. I determined that if I won I would keep the new one and sell the old one. I guess that answers this question.

11-24-2016, 05:49 PM	#38
redcoats1976 Drives: LT W/2LT,blue metallic Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: central florida Posts: 4,922	had a big block 66 pontiac,modded with headers,4v carb and cam for 25 years.sorry to say it but my 2015 RS is as quick,faster on top end,gets 3x the gas mileage,and is whisper quiet.im staying with modern muscle.

11-29-2016, 10:07 AM	#42
chase@ridetech Drives: 09 GMC Yukon Denali Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: Jasper, Indiana Posts: 77	In my opinion, out of the box the Modern Muscle is the way to go for the no worries driving experience but if you are willing to spend some time and money on the Classic Muscle cars you can have modern muscle wrapped in the body of a classic. Most of the cars we have here at Ridetech are Pre-72 but they have been modernized with our suspension components, have fuel-injection, updated ac/heat, new wiring, bigger brakes, tighter steering boxes, etc. We have the classic look with the modern dependability and drivability.