The 'Ring...riiight.

[Mr. Wyndham]

http://www.speedsportlife.com/2008/1...itter-porsche/

I found this article especially enlightening. I still find the ring times, personally, interesting...but what they say is true -- until some third party oversees these fast laps...they mean nothing.

[CamaroSpike23]

hmmmm.

[manimsoblack]

makes too much sense.

[djsnoflake]

long read, but worthwhile

[syr74]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

http://www.speedsportlife.com/2008/1...itter-porsche/

I found this article especially enlightening. I still find the ring times, personally, interesting...but what they say is true -- until some third party oversees these fast laps...they mean nothing.

I have been saying this for ages. Every automaker claims every other automaker cheats, and they are all probably correct.

To put it more simply, look at the amazingly large number of people who cheat in sanctioned racing series and get caught, then imagine the potential size of the much, much larger body of folks who actually get away with cheating in those sanctioned racing series, then imagine how much prevelant cheating would be if there was no sanctioning body there to try and stop them from cheating.....of course people cheat at the Ring.

Nothing is more useless than a lap time from the Ring.

[MrIcky]

It's not useless, it just has to be considered a ballpark. If you start arguing about .5 seconds then you aren't getting it. But if you group all the cars between 7:20 and 7:40, you know that's good competition. That is a good read though, I've been trying to learn more about this ever since Porsche called Nissan out.

[syr74]

Originally Posted by MrIcky

It's not useless, it just has to be considered a ballpark. If you start arguing about .5 seconds then you aren't getting it. But if you group all the cars between 7:20 and 7:40, you know that's good competition. That is a good read though, I've been trying to learn more about this ever since Porsche called Nissan out.

I think you seriously underestimate the level of cheating that could be and almost certainly is involved. Ring numbers are useless and those of us who never put any faith in them have no problem saying so.

[CamaroSpike23]

Originally Posted by syr74

I have been saying this for ages. Every automaker claims every other automaker cheats, and they are all probably correct.

To put it more simply, look at the amazingly large number of people who cheat in sanctioned racing series and get caught, then imagine the potential size of the much, much larger body of folks who actually get away with cheating in those sanctioned racing series, then imagine how much prevelant cheating would be if there was no sanctioning body there to try and stop them from cheating.....of course people cheat at the Ring.

Nothing is more useless than a lap time from the Ring.

There are two types of people in this world.
Cheaters and losers. - Smokey Yunick

[syr74]

Originally Posted by CamaroSpike23

There are two types of people in this world.
Cheaters and losers. - Smokey Yunick

Good chance that none of us realizes just how right Smokey actually was.

[Zabo]

Originally Posted by syr74

Good chance that none of us realizes just how right Smokey actually was.

x2.. :(

[TheCaptain]

Originally Posted by Speedsportlife

Their potential buyers, weaned on Gran Turismo games and generally rather enamored of meaningless driving statistics, would accept no less. Never mind that the average GT-R owner would find himself being lapped by Showroom Stock Chevy Cobalts during a trackday; they’re a numbers crowd, they’re addicted to numbers, they repeat the numbers endlessly on the Internet, they love the numbers.

Yea Cobalts! Woot!