School shooting in CT - Page 17

Brutal SS · 12-17-2012, 04:26 PM

Everyone focuses on guns and it's pretty ignorant. People kill people everyday with cars, but we're not talking about banning cars.

I am a mental health professional, and I work in a maximum security environment, with people who do the most heinous acts you can imagine.

We should be having conversations about mental illness instead, because that's what this is really about. That IS the problem; it's not the instrument that is culpable, but the mind that is attached to the hand that wields it.

CHMSC · 12-17-2012, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brutal SS

Everyone focuses on guns and it's pretty ignorant. People kill people everyday with cars, but we're not talking about banning cars.

I am a mental health professional, and I work in a maximum security environment, with people who do the most heinous acts you can imagine.

We should be having conversations about mental illness instead, because that's what this is really about. That IS the problem; it's not the instrument that is culpable, but the mind that is attached to the hand that wields it.

very well put!

Dznts · 12-17-2012, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CHMSC

very well put!

smarbrit · 12-17-2012, 05:39 PM

What a sad thread. 26 people are dead, 20 children that now have no future and you guys are debating your rights to own and carry guns??

I'm so thankful I live in Canada where I don't worry about the guy beside me having a bad day and pulling a gun on me. Why, because we do have stricter gun laws. I've owned guns in the past, really don't care for them, to each their own. We have shootings here, but they are either domestic violence cases or more often, gang related. One new years eve a couple of years ago, gun fire broke out behind our office building, a guy was shot dead in the alley, was a gang member. Would me owning and carrying a gun that day have made a difference? Hell no.

Could you honestly live with yourselves killing someone regardless of the situation you are all so prepared for?? Soldiers come back from war with PTSD, why, because they've killed, they've seen the horror of war and you think an average Jo could live with this?

My heart aches for the families who have lost their babies and spouses, loved ones. Such a horrible day! That said, I refuse to watch the media coverage to sensationalize the killer.

It seems like fear based sensationalism creates fear based reactions. He might own a gun, so I should too in case he goes off his rocker, I can take him down. What if he lost it but had no access to a gun, would you still need yours?

Just such a sad thread.

HookemHorns · 12-17-2012, 05:51 PM

@smarbrit - did you realize that more babies are killed through abortion than guns? Did realize that more people have been killed by cars than guns? The liberals are making this about guns and not about the problem. Did you realize that thousand of gun owners killed nobody today?

Unfortunately you are misinformed and quite frankly need to stay in Canada.

smarbrit · 12-17-2012, 06:08 PM

I am not misinformed, I'm stating simply that this thread started as a result of a mass shooting in an elementary school killing young children and for the last 3 pages of this thread that I read back through has been focused on individual rights to bear arms and the reasons thought to be justified in doing so, not about the children, not about their families, not about those affected, but your ongoing debate about owing guns.

Drunk drivers kill, children are aborted, people od on drugs, people die, yes. Those children had no chance because a lunatic attacked them as his mother had the right to own guns.

Mental illness is completely misunderstood both by those affected and those treating it. I know, my step son is battling mental illness, recently came off his mess bec he thinks he can handle it. As a family we are doing all we can to keep him on them, but he poses no danger to society or us.

Yep, misinformed.

Brutal SS · 12-17-2012, 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smarbrit

I am not misinformed, I'm stating simply that this thread started as a result of a mass shooting in an elementary school killing young children and for the last 3 pages of this thread that I read back through has been focused on individual rights to bear arms and the reasons thought to be justified in doing so, not about the children, not about their families, not about those affected, but your ongoing debate about owing guns.

Drunk drivers kill, children are aborted, people od on drugs, people die, yes. Those children had no chance because a lunatic attacked them as his mother had the right to own guns.

Mental illness is completely misunderstood both by those affected and those treating it. I know, my step son is battling mental illness, recently came off his meds bec he thinks he can handle it. As a family we are doing all we can to keep him on them, but he poses no danger to society or us.

Yep, misinformed.

This is exactly what I mean. When there are known mental health problems in a person and then there is a change in behavior, such as med non-compliance, it is then time to intervene beforehand, not after something happens. Unfortunately, however, that is one of the areas in which the mental health system is broken. Education is an issue too; the VA Tech shooter's mother decided he needed an exorcism versus inpatient psychiatric treatment.

Im sure that the mother of the Sandy Hope shooter did not think her son would ever be capable of doing something like this, as partially evidenced by the fact that she is the one who introduced him to guns and took him to the shooting range in an attempt to 'bond'. She did not use good judgment to say the least.

To me, she should have had adequate support in her life with raising a mentally ill child from mental health services, who would have educated her about having firearms around someone who has the potential to be unstable. Maybe this particular tragedy could have been avoided.

But, that's my point; mental health services need to be expanded, and more resources allocated to the treatment of mental illness. More research needs to be conducted, and authorities have to be able to intervene earlier in psychiatric crises.

We also need a better understanding of human psychology--both at the level of the brain and at the level of genetics, so that we might identify genetic markers that would indicate certain disorders before they fully manifest.

Taking rights away from mentally healthy and responsible people is not the answer, because those ambitions will do nothing to solve the problem.

CHMSC · 12-17-2012, 07:26 PM

It was truly sad what happened to those kids and teachers. The worst part is that shooting could have been prevented. If the mother would have just bought a safe and kept the guns out of reach from her son. Or used common sense and not had any around her son with a mental illness.

Once again Brutal SS your are right.

My dad was shot and killed. Do I blame the guns? NO!! It was the mentally deranged drug addict's fault. He should of not been able to own a gun. Although, he would of anyway since the gun was illegally purchased.

There have been several shootings that could of been avoided if the parents would use common sense and either never owned guns or kept them in a GUN SAFE.

SlingShot · 12-17-2012, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HookemHorns

@smarbrit - did you realize that more babies are killed through abortion than guns? Did realize that more people have been killed by cars than guns? The liberals are making this about guns and not about the problem. Did you realize that thousand of gun owners killed nobody today?

Unfortunately you are misinformed and quite frankly need to stay in Canada.

Open your eyes, guns is part of the problem ...

techinny · 12-17-2012, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SlingShot

Open your eyes, guns is part of the problem ...

A gun by itself will harm no one, but put the gun in a person's hand, you have something to worry about!

Dznts · 12-17-2012, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by techinny

A gun by itself will harm no one, but put the gun in a person's hand, you have something to worry about!

driyac · 12-17-2012, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brutal SS

This is exactly what I mean. When there are known mental health problems in a person and then there is a change in behavior, such as med non-compliance, it is then time to intervene beforehand, not after something happens. Unfortunately, however, that is one of the areas in which the mental health system is broken. Education is an issue too; the VA Tech shooter's mother decided he needed an exorcism versus inpatient psychiatric treatment.

Im sure that the mother of the Sandy Hope shooter did not think her son would ever be capable of doing something like this, as partially evidenced by the fact that she is the one who introduced him to guns and took him to the shooting range in an attempt to 'bond'. She did not use good judgment to say the least.

To me, she should have had adequate support in her life with raising a mentally ill child from mental health services, who would have educated her about having firearms around someone who has the potential to be unstable. Maybe this particular tragedy could have been avoided.

But, that's my point; mental health services need to be expanded, and more resources allocated to the treatment of mental illness. More research needs to be conducted, and authorities have to be able to intervene earlier in psychiatric crises.

We also need a better understanding of human psychology--both at the level of the brain and at the level of genetics, so that we might identify genetic markers that would indicate certain disorders before they fully manifest.

Taking rights away from mentally healthy and responsible people is not the answer, because those ambitions will do nothing to solve the problem.

This.

driyac · 12-17-2012, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smarbrit

What a sad thread. 26 people are dead, 20 children that now have no future and you guys are debating your rights to own and carry guns??

I'm so thankful I live in Canada where I don't worry about the guy beside me having a bad day and pulling a gun on me. Why, because we do have stricter gun laws. I've owned guns in the past, really don't care for them, to each their own. We have shootings here, but they are either domestic violence cases or more often, gang related. One new years eve a couple of years ago, gun fire broke out behind our office building, a guy was shot dead in the alley, was a gang member. Would me owning and carrying a gun that day have made a difference? Hell no.

Could you honestly live with yourselves killing someone regardless of the situation you are all so prepared for?? Soldiers come back from war with PTSD, why, because they've killed, they've seen the horror of war and you think an average Jo could live with this?

My heart aches for the families who have lost their babies and spouses, loved ones. Such a horrible day! That said, I refuse to watch the media coverage to sensationalize the killer.

It seems like fear based sensationalism creates fear based reactions. He might own a gun, so I should too in case he goes off his rocker, I can take him down. What if he lost it but had no access to a gun, would you still need yours?

Just such a sad thread.

So let me ask you this. IF I am standing in front of you with a Machete and you just happen to be close to a kitchen knife. Are you not prepared to fight for your life? Tell me DO you really care about PTSD at that moment?

Absolutely not.

Hell this kid could have made a damn pipe bomb and we would be sitting here with who knows how many more dead children and blaming what BOMBS? those are already outlawed.

The point here is to stop focusing on gun, gun controls, balh blah blah. But instead focus on moving forward.

News Flash AMERICA IS A VIOLENT NATION! This will never go away. Whether you take our guns or not. We will always be violent.

Supercharged SS · 12-17-2012, 08:11 PM

Guys, Everyone is entitled to their thoughts, opinions, and views but in the proper arena. Not here. The thread was made about the 26 people we lost. We buried twolittle kids today. A week before Christmas. In caskets the size of a suit case. There will be more tomorrow, and the rest of the wk. I know being removed from this its not the same for you and I understand and respect that. But in equal respect, the innocent kids are the ones who trick or treat at my house, play with my dogs, love seeing the camaro sitting in the driveway or in town. I hope you understand.

I'm sure if someone started an adult discussion, not pointing fingers, not casting blame, it would be acceptable. But please, in another place.

Thanks. I hope I didn't offend anyone.

12-17-2012, 04:26 PM	#225
Brutal SS Drives: 2019 Camaro 2SS 1LE Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Dinwiddie, Va. Posts: 1,901	Everyone focuses on guns and it's pretty ignorant. People kill people everyday with cars, but we're not talking about banning cars. I am a mental health professional, and I work in a maximum security environment, with people who do the most heinous acts you can imagine. We should be having conversations about mental illness instead, because that's what this is really about. That IS the problem; it's not the instrument that is culpable, but the mind that is attached to the hand that wields it. __________________

12-17-2012, 07:26 PM	#232
CHMSC ROAD COURSE JUNKIE Drives: 2012 SS/RS LS3 Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Somewhere Posts: 4,868 View My Garage	It was truly sad what happened to those kids and teachers. The worst part is that shooting could have been prevented. If the mother would have just bought a safe and kept the guns out of reach from her son. Or used common sense and not had any around her son with a mental illness. Once again Brutal SS your are right. My dad was shot and killed. Do I blame the guns? NO!! It was the mentally deranged drug addict's fault. He should of not been able to own a gun. Although, he would of anyway since the gun was illegally purchased. There have been several shootings that could of been avoided if the parents would use common sense and either never owned guns or kept them in a GUN SAFE. __________________

12-17-2012, 05:39 PM	#228
smarbrit Drives: 2012 Camaro 2SS/RS IOM Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Calgary, AB Posts: 771	What a sad thread. 26 people are dead, 20 children that now have no future and you guys are debating your rights to own and carry guns?? I'm so thankful I live in Canada where I don't worry about the guy beside me having a bad day and pulling a gun on me. Why, because we do have stricter gun laws. I've owned guns in the past, really don't care for them, to each their own. We have shootings here, but they are either domestic violence cases or more often, gang related. One new years eve a couple of years ago, gun fire broke out behind our office building, a guy was shot dead in the alley, was a gang member. Would me owning and carrying a gun that day have made a difference? Hell no. Could you honestly live with yourselves killing someone regardless of the situation you are all so prepared for?? Soldiers come back from war with PTSD, why, because they've killed, they've seen the horror of war and you think an average Jo could live with this? My heart aches for the families who have lost their babies and spouses, loved ones. Such a horrible day! That said, I refuse to watch the media coverage to sensationalize the killer. It seems like fear based sensationalism creates fear based reactions. He might own a gun, so I should too in case he goes off his rocker, I can take him down. What if he lost it but had no access to a gun, would you still need yours? Just such a sad thread.

12-17-2012, 05:51 PM	#229
HookemHorns Drives: 2023 Camaro ZL1 Red Hot Convertible Join Date: May 2011 Location: Arkansas Posts: 859	@smarbrit - did you realize that more babies are killed through abortion than guns? Did realize that more people have been killed by cars than guns? The liberals are making this about guns and not about the problem. Did you realize that thousand of gun owners killed nobody today? Unfortunately you are misinformed and quite frankly need to stay in Canada.

12-17-2012, 06:08 PM	#230
smarbrit Drives: 2012 Camaro 2SS/RS IOM Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Calgary, AB Posts: 771	I am not misinformed, I'm stating simply that this thread started as a result of a mass shooting in an elementary school killing young children and for the last 3 pages of this thread that I read back through has been focused on individual rights to bear arms and the reasons thought to be justified in doing so, not about the children, not about their families, not about those affected, but your ongoing debate about owing guns. Drunk drivers kill, children are aborted, people od on drugs, people die, yes. Those children had no chance because a lunatic attacked them as his mother had the right to own guns. Mental illness is completely misunderstood both by those affected and those treating it. I know, my step son is battling mental illness, recently came off his mess bec he thinks he can handle it. As a family we are doing all we can to keep him on them, but he poses no danger to society or us. Yep, misinformed.

12-17-2012, 08:11 PM	#238
Supercharged SS Account Suspended Drives: 2010 Camaro Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Sandy Hook, CT Posts: 11,926	Guys, Everyone is entitled to their thoughts, opinions, and views but in the proper arena. Not here. The thread was made about the 26 people we lost. We buried twolittle kids today. A week before Christmas. In caskets the size of a suit case. There will be more tomorrow, and the rest of the wk. I know being removed from this its not the same for you and I understand and respect that. But in equal respect, the innocent kids are the ones who trick or treat at my house, play with my dogs, love seeing the camaro sitting in the driveway or in town. I hope you understand. I'm sure if someone started an adult discussion, not pointing fingers, not casting blame, it would be acceptable. But please, in another place. Thanks. I hope I didn't offend anyone.