75,000 2010 Prius orders...my philosophical quandry

[GrnMchin]

Yes with the battery life and extra cost it's really not saving a lot, but it is an idea that could provide a better choice in the near future. The car doesn't fit my the type of driving (Freeway) and no it's not attractive and yes I'm buying a Camaro, but thinking that the car is a waste is ignorant. Just ask anyone in the 50's if they though Toyota and all the other Japanese cars would last and I 100% guarantee they would have said no. Detroit is failing and the market is leaning to what the other manufactures have done I would love to see GM and the Volt make it and might even buy on in a few years. Just a thought.

[lil_chef]

Originally Posted by fdjizm

or you guys just accept that people may possible enjoy other attributes of cars rather than horsepower and 1/4 mile times?

Great new features like Auto accelerating to top speed without being able to stop the car. cause prius' have 10x more attitude than the camaro!!!!!!!!

[Rogue Leader]

This whole stereotype comparison here is tough. What I will say is yes you can stereotype any car, but IN MY EXPERIENCE many Prius drivers do have said smug show off I'm green attitude. Also in my experience I've seen plenty of white trash and rednecks cruising around in Camaros. Not to go nuts but I've seen a lot of the stereotypes out there (pricks in BMWs etc....)

The difference here is that IN MY EXPERIENCE the smug attitude of said Prius drivers (SOME not all) extends beyond the vehicle, and in so much as they believe you are evil or bad or a loser or whatever for not wanting to own a Prius, and not understanding that driving around trying to get the best gas mileage possible is NOT the greatest thing since sliced bread. That smug attitude has extended to believing you are a neanderthal for not wanting to go their way. Its almost like a cult. THATS the problem. You wanna be "green" and all that crap, fine, but don't attempt to force your belief on me. Everyone likes different things thats why theres a million types of music, millions of different tv shows and movies, and hobbies, etc......

[09'Z28]

Originally Posted by fdjizm

you just made a judgement call on thousands of people you DO NOT KNOW, you sir fail.

Originally Posted by 09'Z28

Oh and the "stereotype" that they are all smug isn't really a stereotype here, it's just the truth.

I said the people here (I guess I should have been more specific and said in my small town) and here there aren't thousands of people with Priuses, there are probably 20-30 tops

[TFord]

so many people are misled. all these prius' aren't going to lower our carbon footprint. Its like its a big political ploy, they give the automotive industry hell using cars as a way of seeming green. Now toyota, and honda is just banking on the people's ignorance. As if driving one of these crap pods will "really" help the environment. All the information is out there in public records for everyone to see, but people would rather rely on the media and toyota/honda propaganda. The EPA gives a detailed report of our carbon foot print. In 2007 if there were no cars in america, our carbon footprint would have been reduced by 20-30%. So when you go home and plug in your prius/insight into the power grid, your still still attributing to that 70%.

[MLL67RSSS]

Originally Posted by fdjizm

so in lamens terms your saying prius's arent reliable, right? you would be hard pressed to argue with the thousands of prius owners.

First off it's "layman".
What I am saying is no car is perfect. When they do have problems like all cars do it will likely be harder and more time consuming to diagnose and more expensive to fix. I guess we'll see in 10 or 15 years how many are still on the road. Wonder how many expensive battery packs they'll have gone through.

BTW: Did you actually read the article I linked? Seems like there are a few hundred Prius owners that certainly wouldn't call their car "reliable". Some won't even drive them anymore.
Here is the link again:http://www.seattleweekly.com/2009-04...erfect-prius/1

[patriotpa]

Originally Posted by TFord

so many people are misled. all these prius' aren't going to lower our carbon footprint. Its like its a big political ploy, they give the automotive industry hell using cars as a way of seeming green. Now toyota, and honda is just banking on the people's ignorance. As if driving one of these crap pods will "really" help the environment. All the information is out there in public records for everyone to see, but people would rather rely on the media and toyota/honda propaganda. The EPA gives a detailed report of our carbon foot print. In 2007 if there were no cars in america, our carbon footprint would have been reduced by 20-30%. So when you go home and plug in your prius/insight into the power grid, your still still attributing to that 70%.

Nice post but for one thing:

The whole "carbon footprint" thing (CO2 as a pollutant) is PURE B.S. Co2 is to plants as oxygen is to animals. No CO2 No plants. No plants No animals (us). Wanna see a pollutant? Wreck a Prius and start a battery leak/fire. Water won't put it out.

Global warming is based on junk science and is a scam.

[LadyinBlue]

Right you are, patriotpa.

Global warming is a junk science scam meant to scare people into making foolish, expensive decisions that actually benefit only those who keep perpetuating the falsehoods.

Have a good laugh at the green global warming/smog rating sticker that will come with your new Camaro. Then put it in an envelope, mail it to Al Gore and tell him where he can stick it.

I did. It was fun.

[InventoryGuy]

Originally Posted by AngryAmish

That right there should tell you more then you need to know about your buyer base.

You're right. These are mainly people who currently own Prius, and are basing their orders off of the track record of the current car they are driving every day and have utmost confidence in the manufacturer making them.

Are you trying to ridicule the Prius buyer based off of ordering a car before driving? How many of the Camaro pre-orders even saw the car before ordering. And you didn't have a proven history to base your purchase off of.

Bit hipocritical don't ya think.

so many people are misled. all these prius' aren't going to lower our carbon footprint. Its like its a big political ploy, they give the automotive industry hell using cars as a way of seeming green. Now toyota, and honda is just banking on the people's ignorance. As if driving one of these crap pods will "really" help the environment. All the information is out there in public records for everyone to see, but people would rather rely on the media and toyota/honda propaganda. The EPA gives a detailed report of our carbon foot print. In 2007 if there were no cars in america, our carbon footprint would have been reduced by 20-30%. So when you go home and plug in your prius/insight into the power grid, your still still attributing to that 70%.
__________________

Ignornace at it's finest, glad you are making my point. First off your logic is flawed in your whole argument. So you saying because it doesn't make a HUGE impact it should not be done? It is proven the Hybrid driving lowers you overall footprint. Do the research. It also lowers the country's depenancy of fossil fuels UNTIL a good alternative can be found. Every little bit helps on both fronts. By your logic I shouldn't be teaching my kids to recycle because they are contributing so little to the cause. Fact is, if we can help reduce fossil fuel dependancy AND lower emissions ( it has to lowers emission because the gas power plant only runs in certain instances) then it is a good thing. If you can purchase a car that can do that AND fit in your budget then why is that wrong? I know it is a driving preferance but some of you people are making it seem like they are just plain idiots.

Secondly, you obviously know nothing aout Hybrids since Prius has a regenarative braking system that charges your battery while decelerating and braking making it a stand alone unit with no recharging needed from the outside. So it doesn't add to polluting but pulling off the grid. And if you read the info about the charging system for the Volt and simialr technology it is equivilent to using a light bulb or something small like that. Very small amount being pulled off the grid and MUCH lower than running a motor would use, both in emissions AND using fossil fuels to make the power. And to add further fuel to the fire so to speak, I knwo many Prius owners (once again because I interact with so many) use a power company that uses none fossil fuel energy. I for one use Green Mountain Energy which is a similar company. So even if the technology comes to wher eyou are plugging in your Hybrid, don't you think if someone uses that tachnology they will also be using a power company for their home that doesn't use fossil fuels as well?

Wreck a Prius and start a battery leak/fire. Water won't put it out.

Do research on Prius wrecks and the battery system and how it is stored before posting please.

BTW: Did you actually read the article I linked? Seems like there are a few hundred Prius owners that certainly wouldn't call their car "reliable". Some won't even drive them anymore.
Here is the link again:http://www.seattleweekly.com/2009-04...erfect-prius/1

It is common knowledge that no product can make everyone happy. the best any manufacturer can do is make a product to try to fit the demographic they are selling to. A few hundred out of over a million is in many people's opinion very acceptable numbers for customer discontent. I think you would agree that such a small fraction of a percent of unhappy customers in a GM model line would not have GM looking for bailout money.

I got a warning about my last post which is ok. Probably get banned for this one, which is fine too. But I just get tired of people posting based of pure speculation and prejudice.

DAMN IT, I WILL WIN AN AGRUMENT ON THE INTERNET

For the record, I do not drive a Hybrid. I would not dirve a prius because it does not fit my driving style. As long as I see some improvement in the production of the Camaro I will own one. I am actually giving Gm a break an trying to look past that they are producing a car with hiccups on the intial first production run. EVERY car manufacturer will have some issues when creating a whole new platform to sell cars from.

[MrIcky]

Originally Posted by Rallysport

I didn't know that a fad had a "number" attached to it......

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

How many Mood Rings and Pet Rocks did they sell in the 1970's? How many Pokemon games were sold in the 90's?

OK, well then the first production Prius was a 1997 model year and they just rolled to 2010. So take away the number made and talk about a 14 year model life. I'd say 14 year model run is pretty solidly beyond fad (we're now on Generation 4) and Prius' will clearly be in production for at least the next 4 years. I think Chevy bet on this being a fad and that's why they don't have a seat at the grown-ups table 15 years after the EV1.

All of the information I can find on reliability (despite the posts that get hyped here) are that Prius' are among the most reliable and trouble free cars on the market (TrueDelta, Consumer Reports). The getting in a wreck and causing fires isn't 100% accurate- I actually got the safety bulletin and it doesn't apply to Generation 3 or higher Prius. The safety bulletin was for caustic chemicals that required hazmat trained firecrews to do clean ups. Nothing really backs up the fire claim that I can find.

As far as the Global Warming issues, the more I research the more I discover misinformation on BOTH sides of the debate. So I'm going to stay out of it except to say: ya plants need CO2, but there would be plenty of CO2 without any cars, or people for that matter.

So:

"The whole "carbon footprint" thing (CO2 as a pollutant) is PURE B.S. Co2 is to plants as oxygen is to animals. No CO2 No plants. No plants No animals (us)."

-is a silly argument.

[Brokinarrow]

Originally Posted by fdjizm

or you guys just accept that people may possible enjoy other attributes of cars rather than horsepower and 1/4 mile times?

you obviously didn't read that Insight review someone posted on here it was quite brutal, i'll see if i can find it.

But really, how much more pollution is put into the air to ship those things over here from Japan?

*edit: Found it! Enjoy http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showth...hlight=Insight

[Design1stCode2nd]

Jeremy Clarkson is an entertainer not a car reviewer, he's paid to be funny, nothing more.

[09'Z28]

Originally Posted by InventoryGuy

A few hundred out of over a million is in many people's opinion very acceptable numbers for customer discontent.

Ok, I'm pretty sure you didn't read the article he posted now, normally a few hundred of the customers discontent is ok with a car, but the people in the link he posted were discontent because the car put their/other peoples lives in danger. The cars would speed up without the gas peddle even being depressed (one of the examples no one was even in the car) and the car wouldn't slow down even with the brake fully depressed. I don't know about you but I don't find that to be acceptable.

[67 GTO]

Originally Posted by 09'Z28

Ok, I'm pretty sure you didn't read the article he posted now, normally a few hundred of the customers discontent is ok with a car, but the people in the link he posted were discontent because the car put their/other peoples lives in danger. The cars would speed up without the gas peddle even being depressed (one of the examples no one was even in the car) and the car wouldn't slow down even with the brake fully depressed. I don't know about you but I don't find that to be acceptable.

If these saftey issues concerned a GM product or for that matter any domestic vehicle it would have been reported in great detail. I wonder why the mainstream media hasn't picked up on these issues