Toyota Obstructed Justice - Page 4

Stew · 09-21-2010, 04:51 PM

The Hyundai thing I have to wonder about too. I have been in a few of the newer Hyundais and they are very nice, hell, almost bought an 06 Sonata before i got my Jeep.

As for Toyota, they have been hiding stuff for years, the first gen Tundra was junk, the sludging engines, the rusting Tacomas, so much bad. THe worst is the fact they just won't admit to it and FIX it. That and they simply make bland appliances. What happened to the Supra, Celica (not that last gen thing), MR2 turbos (again not that MR2 Spyder thing), the trucks when they didn't have a name.

*The_Blur* · 09-21-2010, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeHasReturned

First of all, this "blatantly illegal behavior" is somewhat shady in its own. As LOWDOWN said

Anyways, that's besides the point. I'm not as concerned about Toyota, since everyone has decided to jump on the "Kill Toyota" bandwagon without any facts or proof. But I'm still curious as to why you think Hyundai is such "garbage," which was the gist of your last post.

I see that you disagree. Obviously, there is nothing I can do to convince you that concealing documents of evidence from the government is both illegal and unethical.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stew

The Hyundai thing I have to wonder about too. I have been in a few of the newer Hyundais and they are very nice, hell, almost bought an 06 Sonata before i got my Jeep.

As for Toyota, they have been hiding stuff for years, the first gen Tundra was junk, the sludging engines, the rusting Tacomas, so much bad. THe worst is the fact they just won't admit to it and FIX it. That and they simply make bland appliances. What happened to the Supra, Celica (not that last gen thing), MR2 turbos (again not that MR2 Spyder thing), the trucks when they didn't have a name.

Likewise, we have different opinions on Hyundai quality. I won't go further into that because it is neither the original subject nor important.

On the other hand, it is clear as day that we agree on Toyota. They have yet to admit any wrongdoing by behaving unethically and illegally. They concealed evidence about their vehicles' dangers, claimed faults less significant than reality, and took advantage of arbitration to avoid recalls that could have saved lives.

HeHasReturned · 09-21-2010, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Blur

I see that you disagree. Obviously, there is nothing I can do to convince you that concealing documents of evidence from the government is both illegal and unethical.

That's funny, because that's not what the article is saying.

Quote:

Now, the new arbitrator has ruled that the documents will be admissible - but the ruling does not suggest that either Toyota or Biller acted illegally or legally, as the case will now move to a formal trial for that determination.

*DGthe3* · 09-21-2010, 05:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeHasReturned

That's funny, because that's not what the article is saying.

Of course they're not going to out-and-out say it before the actual court case. But this is what the article is about:

Quote:

finding evidence Toyota hired Dimitrios to destroy and hide incriminating safety documents regarding rollover lawsuits.

HeHasReturned · 09-21-2010, 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Of course they're not going to out-and-out say it before the actual court case. But this is what the article is about:

Fine then. But I'll reserve judgement until the case.

a_Username · 09-21-2010, 06:34 PM

It really sucks that Toyota's main prosecutors will be using NHTSA's data... NHTSA has no idea what they're doing lol.

*Mr. Wyndham* · 09-21-2010, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a_Username

It really sucks that Toyota's main prosecutors will be using NHTSA's data... NHTSA has no idea what they're doing lol.

Maybe...but they've been pushing this ever since it happened, when the issue could have been dropped. There is a glimmer of hope....

*Mr. Wyndham* · 09-26-2010, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Deep10

who cares. most people will still buy toyota over American...

Actually...the number of people who buy foreign vehicles (while still too large) is a little overplayed. The majority of the US auto market share is American. GM consistently sells more vehicles than toyota, alone. And I think Ford is catching up.

*DGthe3* · 09-26-2010, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

Actually...the number of people who buy foreign vehicles (while still too large) is a little overplayed. The majority of the US auto market share is American. GM consistently sells more vehicles than toyota, alone. And I think Ford is catching up.

Yes and no.

Foreign brands have over 50% of the market share, but the American automakers have a greater share of the US market than European or Asian companies do, maybe. It is pretty close between GM + Ford + Chrysler vs Toyota+Honda+Nissan+Hyundai, though the Americans have the edge right now. However, if you count Chrysler as a European company (due to Fiat ownership) then the Asians sell more in the US than GM and Ford.

*Mr. Wyndham* · 09-27-2010, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Yes and no.

Foreign brands have over 50% of the market share, but the American automakers have a greater share of the US market than European or Asian companies do, maybe. It is pretty close between GM + Ford + Chrysler vs Toyota+Honda+Nissan+Hyundai, though the Americans have the edge right now. However, if you count Chrysler as a European company (due to Fiat ownership) then the Asians sell more in the US than GM and Ford.

I'm still counting Chrysler as American. Apparently, it was okay to do so during the Daimler days...why not now.

As of '08, the three had over 50% share of the US market. Ford and GM share has grown marginally since then.

*The_Blur* · 09-27-2010, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

I'm still counting Chrysler as American. Apparently, it was okay to do so during the Daimler days...why not now.

As of '08, the three had over 50% share of the US market. Ford and GM share has grown marginally since then.

I've been using the same logic. If German ownership leaves Chrysler as American, then so must Italian ownership.

Number 3 · 09-27-2010, 08:21 PM

I might be mistaken, but I thought I read this week Fiat only owned 35% of Chrysler with the government owning the rest???

I believe they were trying to take Ferrari public to raise enough cash to buy their way up to 51%.

Which is more than the "merger of equals" that had Chrysler foreign owned.

LOWDOWN · 09-28-2010, 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

As of '08, the three had over 50% share of the US market. Ford and GM share has grown marginally since then.

Almost... A lot has happened since '08...

Try 45% combined, per August '10...and GM continues to trend down, as it has by about 1% market share per year for the last decade. Currently, GM is trending to a 19% share, and was less than that in August.

http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/f...results-95168/

*DGthe3* · 09-28-2010, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

I'm still counting Chrysler as American. Apparently, it was okay to do so during the Daimler days...why not now.

As of '08, the three had over 50% share of the US market. Ford and GM share has grown marginally since then.

Umm ... GM's market share has gone down several points since 2008. Chrysler has gone down a bit as well. Ford is more or less holding steady.

09-27-2010, 08:21 PM	#54
Number 3 Hail to the King baby! Drives: '19 XT4 2.0T & '22 VW Atlas 2.0T Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Illinois Posts: 12,310 View My Garage	I might be mistaken, but I thought I read this week Fiat only owned 35% of Chrysler with the government owning the rest??? I believe they were trying to take Ferrari public to raise enough cash to buy their way up to 51%. Which is more than the "merger of equals" that had Chrysler foreign owned. __________________ "Speed, it seems to me, provides the one genuinely modern pleasure." - Aldous Huxley

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09-21-2010, 04:51 PM	#43
Stew Drives: 92 Luminadead/01 Dakota/97 F150 4x4 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Eastern, Ky Posts: 3,789	The Hyundai thing I have to wonder about too. I have been in a few of the newer Hyundais and they are very nice, hell, almost bought an 06 Sonata before i got my Jeep. As for Toyota, they have been hiding stuff for years, the first gen Tundra was junk, the sludging engines, the rusting Tacomas, so much bad. THe worst is the fact they just won't admit to it and FIX it. That and they simply make bland appliances. What happened to the Supra, Celica (not that last gen thing), MR2 turbos (again not that MR2 Spyder thing), the trucks when they didn't have a name.

09-21-2010, 06:34 PM	#48
a_Username Drives: 2010 2SS Camaro Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Murfreesboro, TN Posts: 3,890 View My Garage	It really sucks that Toyota's main prosecutors will be using NHTSA's data... NHTSA has no idea what they're doing lol.