GM AUGUST 2010 SALES DOWN 11%, 184,921 UNITS SOLD

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by LOWDOWN

Since Pontiacs were never sold in China, we'll never know, will we? Strictly a GM decision...good, bad, or otherwise...

And ALL these Buicks being sold in China are assembled and sourced WHERE? The direct benefits for North Americans?

GM, being a less-than-50% owner of their Chinese operations (by law!), is therefore making half the money they could/should if that investment was made HERE, per comparable unit, and is forced to reinvest the vast majority of those profits in CHINA to expand operations and engineer to "local" specifics... It's kinda like NUMMI in reverse...

Great corporate policy, a little less so for North Americans, the reason the company still exists...

This forum REALLY MAKES me sad sometimes.

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by LOWDOWN

You're making THREE key points, here, based on WHAT?

1) Have you got published proof of the Buick profits/unit vs. Pontiac? Taking into account the monies they MUST pay the Chinese as a MAJORITY stakeholder?
Its a well known fact that premium cars selling for 25k-35k have a lot more profit than entry cars selling for 15k-25k. In China, Buicks are sold at a comparable price to what they are sold for over here yet the build cost is ridiculously low. Even if you cut the profit in half due to the ownership situation, its still very big.

2) Majority of Pontiac's collective sales were NOT fleet... That's an "urban legend".
You're right, I shouldn't have used 'majority'. Regardless, they still had a high percentage of fleet volume for the brand, more than what Buick had.

3) Pontiac's lack of product development and identity were WHO'S FAULT? Susan Docherty? Or GM's management board?!
Doesn't matter who's to blame. Buick had more good stuff coming than Pontiac. When the time came to completely re-assess the company, thats what the situation was and it couldn't be changed for several years. Wishing and hoping for things to be different doesn't change how things were.

4) Since you keep harping on Buick's success elsewhere, was Pontiac EVER CONSIDERED in "other markets"? And if not, why not? WITH FACTS, please, NOT conjecture...
I don't know, I don't work for GM and I don't have any of their market data. And I'm guessing, neither do you. But I would assume they didn't market the brand internationally because it would compete with Chevrolet and/or their other regional brands such as Vauxhall.

Sadly...very sadly, just as they did to Olds' 300,000 owners circa 2000, and Pontiac's 300,000 owners circa 2008, Buick is the only non-Chev show in town for "regular" folks. And that was, again, whose fault?
Olds died in 2004 btw, not 2000. There are a dozen reasons why Plymouth, Olds, Pontaic, Saturn, and Mercury were killed off. But they're largely the same reasons for each brand. In the end, they didn't make enough business sense for their parent companies to keep them going.

Can we get back on topic now please?

[FenwickHockey65]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Can we get back on topic now please?

Good luck with that.

[bpmurr]

Here comes Cash for Clunkers 2 to save the auto industry again!!!

Those inflated numbers for last year shouldn't even be looked at. The big three are doing better.

[Markal]

Sorry, comparing one year to another is rediculous. The question is....are they making money or losing it? I work for a major home retailer. Our sales are down from last year and previous years. Still, we do over 2 million in sales a month at 30-40% markup, well, you do the math. Sales are down but, profit is still there. Business places too much imphasis on increased sales and improvement over "last year" (comp.or growth). The greed level is too high. Money is being made, just not as much as board members want. How much is enough? I've had enough of overpaid board members and corporate greed. Overpaid atheletes, overpaid singing artists and overpaid movie actors....all make everything more expensive for me! If sales are down prices should go down but, not in todays world....greed rules. Wow, sale more at a lower cost and increase profits (more sales at a resonable profit margin).....what a concept! Hope it catches on soon!!! Greed sucks....

[LOWDOWN]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Can we get back on topic now please?

Sadly, BOTH are dismal topics...

The Olds reference to Year 2000, and Pontiac in 2008, are the last complete calendar years each "enjoyed" before the ax fell, respectively. Over 1/2 a million North Americans, who placed their confidence and wallets in GM's hands those years (and millions in their respective lead-up years), summarily dismissed. Nice.

Let's face it, squarely...GM's future, and concentration of efforts, is elsewhere. North America is becoming a "red-headed stepchild"... Manufacturers of ALL manner of commodities are/have moved off-shore and, regardless of historically massive incentive$ present, sales are tanking hand-in-hand with the economy and standard of living, here...

[chain777]

Is it 11% or 25%? I've seen other numbers reported:


http://www.dailyfinance.com/story/au...gust/19615768/


http://online.wsj.com/mdc/public/pag...tml#autosalesA

[assasinator]

man, i hate to see cadillac sales so low. worries me.

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by LOWDOWN

Sadly, BOTH are dismal topics...

If you don't like the topic, don't post a reply

Originally Posted by chain777

Is it 11% or 25%? I've seen other numbers reported:


http://www.dailyfinance.com/story/au...gust/19615768/


http://online.wsj.com/mdc/public/pag...tml#autosalesA

GM's core brands of Chevy, GMC, Cadillac, and Buick sales are down 11%. But Pontiac, Hummer, and Saturn are down to about 250 units combined for Aug 2010, vs 39,000 for last August. Then there is Saab which they sold so none of the 290 cars get included in GM's total anymore. Add it all up, and GM's actual sales vs last year are down 25%. But for the brands they are still selling, they're down 11%. Only posting the core brands is a bit deceptive, usually both sets get reported.

[chain777]

Gotcha, that makes sense. I just didn't understand the discrepancy.

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by LOWDOWN

Sadly, BOTH are dismal topics...

The Olds reference to Year 2000, and Pontiac in 2008, are the last complete calendar years each "enjoyed" before the ax fell, respectively. Over 1/2 a million North Americans, who placed their confidence and wallets in GM's hands those years (and millions in their respective lead-up years), summarily dismissed. Nice.

Let's face it, squarely...GM's future, and concentration of efforts, is elsewhere. North America is becoming a "red-headed stepchild"... Manufacturers of ALL manner of commodities are/have moved off-shore and, regardless of historically massive incentive$ present, sales are tanking hand-in-hand with the economy and standard of living, here...

You are so misinformed it's a little bit ridiculous IMO.

[Captain Awesome]

"WHY CAN'T THEY MAKE A COROLLA?!?!?!?!?!"

[TOBY J]

Iwould be very careful if you choose to buy the newsoon to be released GM stock. The price will come out very inflated.