Anyone buying GM Stock in IPO?

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by fielderLS3

Because nothing involving the government is ever, ever, ever short term. History has proven that once the government wraps its tentacles around anything, it never lets go, it keeps squeezing harder.

The financial company GM is going after did fine because it charged high enough interest rates to make a profit by taking on the risk.

I should probably clarify that this individual finance company is not my concern. I am worried about GM owning any finance company because the temptation to give out loans to people at rates too low to cover people's credit risk to keep the cars moving will at some point be too much to resist. GM is a car company, not a finance company, and when I see GM looking to get into the finance business again, I see them repeating the same old mistakes that got them in trouble with GMAC. I fear they are sowing the seeds of yet another "rob Peter to pay Paul" business plan.

Then why are they even going to bother selling GM in the first place? I mean, if the objective to 'keep squeezing harder and harder', why would they bother giving up any control?

As for GMAC, a lot of their problems came mostly from mortgages not cars. I sure hope GM has learned from their mistake of letting their captive finance company going too far beyond its core competence. And buying an independant company (vs buying back GMAC/Ally) seems like they have learned. Lets see how long their memory is.

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Then why are they even going to bother selling GM in the first place? I mean, if the objective to 'keep squeezing harder and harder', why would they bother giving up any control?

GM was offered taxpayer money to help gets back on its feet. A much better alternative than GM being no longer active in the automotive industry.

As for GMAC, a lot of their problems came mostly from mortgages not cars. I sure hope GM has learned from their mistake of letting their captive finance company going too far beyond its core competence. And buying an independant company (vs buying back GMAC/Ally) seems like they have learned. Lets see how long their memory is.

Only time will tell.

[monstertodd]

I don't own GM and neither do you. The govt purchased GM with money created out of thin air by the federal reserve. The money doesn't exist, it never did, it's fake money. If anybody owns GM it's the federal reserve.

The govt simply acquired GM (nationalized) through a take over using fake money, and is now stealing money (taxes) from you and me to pay back the money that didn't exist in the first place.

[All-Or-Nothing]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

What about Freddie Mac / Fannie Mae? They own 90 something percent of all mortgages now. /irony

Freddie Mac and Fanni Mae were delisted from the NYSE.

[Brokinarrow]

Yeah, I'll definitely be jumping on it... um one thing though... I've never bought stock before Someone want to give me a crash course? I wouldn't be putting a whole lot into it right now, just want to buy a few shares as I get the money to do so...

[djsnoflake]

I will buy a few to say I have them, not really as a get rich plan. If you want to make money, invest in resources. There are more people using them, and less stocks to tap from every day.

[Craig]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

I'm no market expert, but I doubt any serious investor is going to look twice at a GM stock offering. This last time GM got in trouble all of the secured creditors got nothing and the unsecured creditors got everything. This is in complete violation of the bankruptcy laws.

Breaking it down, people with investments in the company (like old folks investing their retirement, or working stiffs with 401k's) who are required by law to be first in line in bankruptcy proceedings got robbed of everything. It was handed over to a bunch of unsecured creditors (unions).

What makes you think that it won't happen the next time?

While I would probably disagree with many of your views this particular post cannot be repeated often enough. The actions of GM leading up to and during the bailout were nothing short of criminal and appalling to anyone with a sense of how fair and honest business should be done. They behaved no differently than a deadbeat who maxes out every line of credit available to them with the express purpose of defaulting, then hid behind the government while giving loyal bondholders the middle finger. Meanwhile Obama demonized GM creditors as "greedy" and "selfish" for daring to have the audacity to expect money loaned in good faith would actually be paid back.

If you're looking for stock market returns it's not like there aren't literally hundreds of thousands of other companies you can invest in. If you're new to investing as some here have stated then steer clear, FAR clear of this one as it will be a darling of the hedge funds and high frequency prop trading desks. If you're unaware of how these guys (and the stock market of the 21st century in general) work then you will almost undoubtedly lose your shirt. In the long run you will be far better off investing in boring old blue chips that have a history of increasing dividends and actually repaying their debts. Johnson & Johnson, Chevron, ADP, McDonalds, and Pepsi are a few that come to mind and are among those that I own. They're not sexy, they're not exciting but over time you will significantly outperform the market indexes thanks to the power of compounding dividends. Investing in volatile growth stocks like this one will undoubtedly be only works if you know when to buy and when to sell, which is a lot more difficult for the average retail investor than anybody thinks it is.

As for this one, I can't see how anyone in good conscience can do business with a company that operates in this way, as an investor or even as a customer for that matter. I will not invest one penny of my hard earned money in the "new" GM nor will I ever purchase a new vehicle from them again. I will concede that it's pretty unlikely they'll pull a stunt like this again but for me it's a matter of principle.

[FenwickHockey65]

Originally Posted by Craig

While I would probably disagree with many of your views this particular post cannot be repeated often enough. The actions of GM leading up to and during the bailout were nothing short of criminal and appalling to anyone with a sense of how fair and honest business should be done. They behaved no differently than a deadbeat who maxes out every line of credit available to them with the express purpose of defaulting, then hid behind the government while giving loyal bondholders the middle finger. Meanwhile Obama demonized GM creditors as "greedy" and "selfish" for daring to have the audacity to expect money loaned in good faith would actually be paid back.

If you're looking for stock market returns it's not like there aren't literally hundreds of thousands of other companies you can invest in. If you're new to investing as some here have stated then steer clear, FAR clear of this one as it will be a darling of the hedge funds and high frequency prop trading desks. If you're unaware of how these guys (and the stock market of the 21st century in general) work then you will almost undoubtedly lose your shirt. In the long run you will be far better off investing in boring old blue chips that have a history of increasing dividends and actually repaying their debts. Johnson & Johnson, Chevron, ADP, McDonalds, and Pepsi are a few that come to mind and are among those that I own. They're not sexy, they're not exciting but over time you will significantly outperform the market indexes thanks to the power of compounding dividends. Investing in volatile growth stocks like this one will undoubtedly be only works if you know when to buy and when to sell, which is a lot more difficult for the average retail investor than anybody thinks it is.

As for this one, I can't see how anyone in good conscience can do business with a company that operates in this way, as an investor or even as a customer for that matter. I will not invest one penny of my hard earned money in the "new" GM nor will I ever purchase a new vehicle from them again. I will concede that it's pretty unlikely they'll pull a stunt like this again but for me it's a matter of principle.

So you're here...why?

[1bad65]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Doesn't matter, since they aren't running GM.

I think when the President hand-picks the CEO, the Government is in fact running the company.

[1bad65]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

The person who insited on selling the Volt at a loss if necessary, has been quoted as saying "Man made global warming is a crock of sh*t". So perhaps they have other concerns ...

And GM's current CEO, Ed Whitacre, said this when he was chosen as CEO: "“I don’t know anything about cars. A business is a business, and I think I can learn about cars.”

[FenwickHockey65]

Originally Posted by 1bad65

And GM's current CEO, Ed Whitacre, said this when he was chosen as CEO: "“I don’t know anything about cars. A business is a business, and I think I can learn about cars.”

Neither did Mulally.

[1bad65]

Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65

Neither did Mulally.

Mulally didn't need a bailout. Nor is he running around touting an electric car that his company is selling at a loss.

You GM guys sometimes crack me up. If Ford's CEO had came out and said he didn't know anything about cars and if Ford had spent years and years and tons and tons of money developing a car that they admit will lose money, you guys would be calling them the world's greatest buffoons. But since it's GM, you guys are defending them.

[Moose]

Originally Posted by 1bad65

Mulally didn't need a bailout. Nor is he running around touting an electric car that his company is selling at a loss.

You GM guys sometimes crack me up. If Ford's CEO had came out and said he didn't know anything about cars and if Ford had spent years and years and tons and tons of money developing a car that they admit will lose money, you guys would be calling them the world's greatest buffoons. But since it's GM, you guys are defending them.

If the purpose of posting is to cause a reaction leading to internet BS, it'll be dealt with very shortly.

[1bad65]

Originally Posted by Moose

If the purpose of posting is to cause a reaction leading to internet BS, it'll be dealt with very shortly.

Well, I didnt start this thread, I'm just replying politely and on topic. Had Ford made those same decisions I spoke of, I'd be on here disagreeing with their decisions. Good decisions are good decisions and bad decisions are bad decisions, no matter if the company making them has a blue oval or a bowtie.