GM Email...Anyone else get this?

[The_Blur]

Originally Posted by ALLT4

I get exactly what you're saying and can't figure out why others can't see it. GM needs to initially buy back the stock the from the taxpayers. THEN sell it to investors. Selling stock to the taxpayers twice is getting a free ride and pretty much loan forgiveness.

In college, one of my friends helped me wire my aftermarket sound system in my Cobalt. I paid him in beer. Should I have asked for money for the beer then paid him an hourly wage for his labor?

What I'm saying is that the government opted to barter payment rather than accept cash. This decision was based on the belief that GM's value will rise enough to exceed the likely interest of any loan. Notice that the government took a much smaller portion of Chrysler, a company plagued with uncompetitive or otherwise bland products. It is the government's belief that this company, Chrysler, will be less likely to generate a valuable return when the government sells its stock. GM, however, has a competitive product line that looks more likely to bring success and money. The government wants to protect taxpayer money by making the most out of its investment. This has all been planned very carefully.

[Camaro_Custom_Painted]

Not to detrack from the conversation, but I'm having a hard time figuring out how GM got my email address. Unless it was from this site.

[Indy2010]

Originally Posted by WongBob

Is anyone picking up what I'm putting down? WE gave them the money to bail them out... now WE are going to pay their debt to US off.

Does anyone else see what I'm seeing?!?!

Dont get me wrong... I own nothing but GM products because, well, they are simply the best, but they are double dipping hard on this.

I would also like to personally thank the engineers at Toyota for assisting GM in paying back this loan by making more than a few defective cars.

I understand what you are saying and that point was griped about the most when the loans / stock purchases were approved. I personnally had a very big problem with it. It is very shady if not done correctly (the potential is there to defraud the taxpayer and will most likely happen); but it can be done fairly as long as the government sells the stock for what it paid plus what the money would have brought with interest. Anything less is equal to taxpayers subsidizing GM, a private company. As some others have noted, the taxpayer could actually benefit, but I think it is highly unlikely in this case.

Originally Posted by The_Blur

GM's success shows that the risks posed by bailing out a large company can be a positive thing when that company actually turns around the way it does business. GM is a sleeker, better company, and the products coming out of the new GM are impressive and profitable.

You're completely correct to point out that this was a dangerous decision. It was dangerous to bail out a company, and it would have also been dangerous to just let all of those employees—GM employees, supplier employees—lose their jobs. Keep in mind that multiple manufacturers use some suppliers. If a large percentage of their business goes away, other manufacturers could be affected by the same company going bankrupt, causing a much larger wave of layoffs.

The loss of jobs and layoffs would have been temporary or short term. If there is a demand for a certain number of cars, the demand does not change because a company went out of business. What would have happened is the other car company sales would have increased, causing them to need to expand and hire. Who would they have hired? Most likely the same people who got layed off because they have the experience and would not need as much investment / training. Sure, it would have taken time for the markets to adjust, but adjust they would have. Ford probably would have been the ultimate winner (in the long run). Would there have been a price for the adjustment? Sure. Catastrophe? No.

All that being said. I'm glad GM is still around. I just wish they would have been more honest about their intentions. Everyone knew they would file bankruptcy AFTER receiving bailout money intended to keep them afloat until they "could turn things around". Bankruptcy was inevitable and they knew it.

[SummoneR]

Originally Posted by Camaro_Custom_Painted

Not to detrack from the conversation, but I'm having a hard time figuring out how GM got my email address. Unless it was from this site.

Did you sign up for Onstar vehicle diagnostic reports? That's how., or at least one way.

[Camaro_Custom_Painted]

Originally Posted by SummoneR

Did you sign up for Onstar vehicle diagnostic reports? That's how., or at least one way.

Yes, I'll bet thats it. My apologies for assuming it may have been this site. I should have known better.

[Globemaster]

Originally Posted by Iwantone2

I got this in my email a few minutes ago...

got mine a few minutes ago

[The_Blur]

Originally Posted by Indy2010

I understand what you are saying and that point was griped about the most when the loans / stock purchases were approved. I personnally had a very big problem with it. It is very shady if not done correctly (the potential is there to defraud the taxpayer and will most likely happen); but it can be done fairly as long as the government sells the stock for what it paid plus what the money would have brought with interest. Anything less is equal to taxpayers subsidizing GM, a private company. As some others have noted, the taxpayer could actually benefit, but I think it is highly unlikely in this case.



The loss of jobs and layoffs would have been temporary or short term. If there is a demand for a certain number of cars, the demand does not change because a company went out of business. What would have happened is the other car company sales would have increased, causing them to need to expand and hire. Who would they have hired? Most likely the same people who got layed off because they have the experience and would not need as much investment / training. Sure, it would have taken time for the markets to adjust, but adjust they would have. Ford probably would have been the ultimate winner (in the long run). Would there have been a price for the adjustment? Sure. Catastrophe? No.

All that being said. I'm glad GM is still around. I just wish they would have been more honest about their intentions. Everyone knew they would file bankruptcy AFTER receiving bailout money intended to keep them afloat until they "could turn things around". Bankruptcy was inevitable and they knew it.

I'm glad we can agree that GM is still here. I don't think we can agree on the consequences, though. The loss of American jobs with the liquidation of Chrysler and GM would have led to more jobs overseas where the competition's products are made. From a completely egalitarian standpoint, you're right. Somewhere in the world, the jobs will come back. Let's remember that the competition isn't all made in America, and what incentive is there to make anything in America if two of the three American automakers that did so no longer do anything? The Asian and European brands can make their cars with cheap labor and ship them. The people who have to buy American will buy Ford, but we know that the US market for cars is heavily imported, so very few customers actually prioritize buying American. In order to compete, even Ford would have had to import its products, costing more American jobs.

I'll add that the "temporary" losses of other industries have become fairly permanent. When Wall Street took a turn for the worst 15 September 2008, the layoffs began. I graduated 3 months later and have yet to find employment in my field of study, which ironically enough includes working for the government. Temporary layoffs have become the vocabulary for permanent or long-term unemployment.

[Docknock]

This thread will end bad

[chef-beavis]

I got it, too; at my email for garbage that I supplied to chevymall.com.

[MikeSVX]

Yup. Got the email too.

[Unfair]

Can someone explain the math, how are they done with their 35 billion from the government? i'm seeing single digit numbers being paid back here.

[The_Blur]

Originally Posted by Docknock

This thread will end bad

This thread can stay afloat if we keep the civil tone. It is okay to disagree on Camaro5 as long as we all show respect. Everyone deserves respect here.

[The_Blur]

Originally Posted by Unfair

Can someone explain the math, how are they done with their 35 billion from the government? i'm seeing single digit numbers being paid back here.

The government has decided to take a stake in the company as payment. Due to GM's competitive product line, the government believes that GM stock will return that investment with an initial public offering (IPO) and subsequent sales of government-owned GM stock over a period of time.

[Indy2010]

Originally Posted by The_Blur

...The loss of American jobs with the liquidation of Chrysler and GM would have led to more jobs overseas where the competition's products are made. ... Let's remember that the competition isn't all made in America... The people who have to buy American will buy Ford, but we know that the US market for cars is heavily imported, so very few customers actually prioritize buying American.

Yep, you make a good point. The business would have been divided amongst foreign companies as well, thus there would have been a loss in American jobs.

I'll add that the "temporary" losses of other industries have become fairly permanent. When Wall Street took a turn for the worst 15 September 2008, the layoffs began. I graduated 3 months later and have yet to find employment in my field of study, which ironically enough includes working for the government. Temporary layoffs have become the vocabulary for permanent or long-term unemployment.

Unfortunately, I believe this has happened across the board, not just the automotive industry. Cheap labor has forced all industries to re-evaluate their labor costs. Most companies that I am familiar with are trying to reduce the workforce and maintain production/capacity/capability by being more efficient with what they have. What we really need is for China to become a nation of consumers instead of producers (they are really lopsided).