Chrysler says it wont repay gov't loans of taxpayer money

[Stew]

Originally Posted by coolman

I know about the plan. What I mean is I think chrysler will be gone. I hope not ,but it doesn't look good. You can't have sales like them and be in business for very long.

It is WAY WAY too early to even think that. This turnaround is going to take time, they know that, they are not going to just kill it. They know sales are going to be down until new prodcut is out there. Give it time, IMHO they will still be around for a long time, but heck, it is just too early to tell.

[garagelogic]

Nobody is really paying the government back anyway. It's not "paying the money back" when you are getting more than the loan amount given back to you in the form of tax breaks.

GM is not, in the strictest sense, paying back taxpayers at all. Rather, it is refunding $6.7 billion of an $18 billion escrow account that was given to it by the government when it emerged from bankruptcy. The rest of that account will be used to cover fourth-quarter losses (including $2.8 billion pledged for the rescue of GM’s major parts supplier, Delphi), repay loans from the Canadian government, and prop up the automaker’s shaky European operations. That escrow account is due to expire in June, at which time GM will repay what remains of the $6.7 billion (as they announced on December 15th). Of course, they will then pocket the estimated $5.6 billion remainder of the escrow account.

And let's be honest, $6.7 billion doesn’t begin to scratch the surface of what GM actually owes the American taxpayers. Over the past 12 months, the Department of the Treasury has given it some $52 billion in the form of cash, loans and the purchase of that 60 percent of the company’s post-bankruptcy equity. Add even more if you take into account the two bailouts of GM’s former lending arm, GMAC, or the $3 billion spent on GM's portion of the “cash for clunkers program,” which doubtless kept the company from posting even deeper losses than what has already been disclosed.

[Captain Vlad]

Originally Posted by Xanthos

What, because the government is going to write you a check if they do pay, right? Once you paid your taxes, that money belongs to the government, not you.
- X

Hush, they'll HEAR you!

[coolman]

Originally Posted by Stew

It is WAY WAY too early to even think that. This turnaround is going to take time, they know that, they are not going to just kill it. They know sales are going to be down until new prodcut is out there. Give it time, IMHO they will still be around for a long time, but heck, it is just too early to tell.

I hope your right. I really do want to get a challenger in the next couple of years, and their new trucks are really good. I guess It's a wait and see. I just don't see how they can keep going with sales #'s like that.

[1320junkie]

Soooo everyone post up how much the lost individually due to the bailouts...lmao

[305pride]

hm. ima miss the chally, and the rest of the srt8 family.

[THUMPER20X]

Theyve been buying time for the past 3 years. Theyll be gone by 2012. Didnt you see the movie? lol

[derklug]

I don't see chrysler in the mix after 2012. Fiat may make inroads using Chryslers dealers, but I think you will see Jeep sold off and then Dodge trucks rolled into Fiat for US sales. Assembly in the US, most components built overseas. Then again, my predictions may be horse$hit.

[Epitaph]

Dang, I wish I could borrow a few billion bux from the gov't, hell, make it a few million & I'll be happy. You guys would never see me again.

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by Stew

Oer the 5 year plan the Challenger is in the works at least through 2014, also it will get a mild refresh that year including the 3.6 V6 in the SE and the 6.4 V8 in the SRT, then according to people that work at the plant, all new transmissions in 2012.

You know what they say, Plans can change.. what is valid today may be gone tomorrow... it's hard to make plans for that far ahead.. that is what they hope to accomplish.. if they are still not making money that will probably change...

[Zabo]

Originally Posted by Skyman 08

You know what they say, Plans can change.. what is valid today may be gone tomorrow... it's hard to make plans for that far ahead.. that is what they hope to accomplish.. if they are still not making money that will probably change...

I could say the same thing about the 'Vert and the Z/28, the new Cadillac ATS/XTS, the Regal..

Hell even the Coyote in the Mustang.

[jrc1122]

This is why the government needs to keep it's nose out of things it has no business being in.

I would rather see a company solve its own problems, than have the infamous government come in to solve it by using my hard earned tax dollars for their pet causes.

Last I checked buying Car companies, and controlling their decisions isn't in the Enumerated Powers of the US Constitution. Thus making it illegal to use my tax dollars to support individual companies. My tax dollars are collected for the sole purpose of paying for things in the enumerated powers, nothing more, nothing less.
Judicial System
Roadways for better exchange of commerce
National Defense (Army/ Navy etc)


I keep checking my copy of the US constitution, and I check on-line, but it hasn't been revised. So until it is (hopefully isn't), I will stand by the fact that Bail Outs = illegal. Along with other major things the government is pushing right now...

But what do I know, I am just an educated, free thinking American citizen.
________
Cl77

[coolman]

Originally Posted by 1320junkie

Soooo everyone post up how much the lost individually due to the bailouts...lmao

I think chrysler owes me about $286.17 and I want it now. I would like to take my wife to a nice place to eat this weekend.

[DGthe3]

This is unfortunate to hear, but I'm not surprised. The best that Chrysler has to offer is now merely class competitive. The worst are complete jokes. Everything else is just below average. Both GM and Ford have just released some very good products recently with more on the way over the next year or two. Chrysler hasn't and won't have much new stuff over the next couple years. What will happen to the Calibre when the Fiesta and Cruze hit the market? Updating their full size cars is a needed step, but they don't have too much direct competition either. Down the road in 2-5 years the Fiat partnership/ownership will begin to inject some life into the company, but I am doubtful that they'll make it that long.

They have nothing to stop the hemorrhaging. Over the last few months they've been doing ~25% worse than the rest of the industry and as their offerings lag further behind the competition their sales will continue to be poor. If they manage to hold out for 2 years, they might be fine. But thats a pretty big if.

Originally Posted by garagelogic

It's not "paying the money back" when you are getting more than the loan amount given back to you in the form of tax breaks.

Yes it is. Paying back a loan is paying back a loan no matter how it happens. A tax break is not a loan, no matter how convenient it may be to think of it as such. Deferred taxes are much closer to a loan, but they still get payed. At any rate, the money given doesn't begin to scratch the surface in the tax revenue generated by GM over the last 100+ years. By the way, keep in mind that this thread is about Chrysler not GM.

Originally Posted by jrc1122

Last I checked buying Car companies, and controlling their decisions isn't in the Enumerated Powers of the US Constitution. Thus making it illegal to use my tax dollars to support individual companies. My tax dollars are collected for the sole purpose of paying for things in the enumerated powers, nothing more, nothing less.

Good thing they're not controlling the decisions at those car companies then.