Looks like Ford is making a 6.2L pushrod motor

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by meanmike

Yeah one truck versus two right. Get rid of that GMC and see what happen's, I bet they dont all switch to Chevy.

Company sales matter more than individual division sales in this comparison. Just because the (using this as example, IDK if it's true or not) traverse beats the MKX, doesn't mean chevrolet beat the whole company.

[syr74]

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

a) We weren't talking about "existing trucks". We were talking about trucks that are not available for purchase yet. Since I happen to own a GM vehicle with a 6.2L engine that makes better numbers, we can assume that if it was an important issue then GM could drop the same engine in a truck and trump the Ford.

Doesn't really work like that. Truck engines are tuned differently for a reason. Keep in mind, the 6.2L Ford makes those numbers on regular unleaded in run of the mill truck trim. If this was meant to be a high performance engine it wouldn't be making these numbers

Originally Posted by Captain Awesome

b) Twin cam engines are in general more costly to build and maintain. They have more bearnings and more timing chains which are expensive compared to pushrods and lifters.

SOHC engines are actually some of the least expensive engine designs to make because of their very simple valvetrain. And I'm not giving you any credit for the chain since the truth is that chains are cheap, although bearings can add expense. Basically you've got an extra camshaft and the bearings that cam has to ride on.

In a pushrod engine you've still got to account for all the extra little parts OHC engines don't need like lifters, the more complex springs needed to counteract float, pushrods, etc....and you get sixteen of each of them. These things stop being as cheaper when you're talking about sixteen of everything. I'm not seeing this huge advantage in cost here and the Ford makes much better power on regular unleaded.

[meanmike]

Originally Posted by a_Username

Company sales matter more than individual division sales in this comparison. Just because the (using this as example, IDK if it's true or not) traverse beats the MKX, doesn't mean chevrolet beat the whole company.

Your absolutely right. However we were'nt talking about sale's we were talking about power and what a truck can pull/haul, and since he did'nt have anything good to argue he had to bring in the sale's of two truck's vs one.

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by meanmike

Yeah one truck versus two right. Get rid of that GMC and see what happen's, I bet they dont all switch to Chevy.

Actually, try 3 vs 1. The Avalanche gets counted as a full size pickup as well. Regardless, Ford tried to even things up a bit with the Lincoln Mark LT a few years ago. Didn't work out so well and I believe its been discontinued. Their sales hardly mattered.

But if you want to take strictly about sales numbers, by brand last year it was 500k Chevy full size trucks (465k Silverados plus 35k Avalanches) and 169k GMC Sierras vs 515k F-150s and 5k Lincoln Mark LT's. So on the corporate level, it works out to 669k for General Motors Corp. vs 520k for Ford Motor Company.

[2ndgenz28]

Originally Posted by Blownhotrodder

The overhead cam motors are anemic.

I chuckle many times

[DropTheGloves]

In regards to when the Raptor is available, it is available now. The 6.2 engine is not currently offered, however, there is an option that would allow customers to spend 3k more, and to upgrade the engine. The 6.2 however, will be offered as an option soon. A little more about the truck...I believe it is on 38's...I could be wrong, so don't quote me. It also is much wider than the normal F150. So they have had to do the same thing that the larger f scale trucks have, which is having the mirrors sticking out further. The Raptors suspension is also the best of the best. The Raptor has Fox Racing shocks.

When it comes down to performance, that s/c chevy truck would not even stand a chance. In fact, even if Chevy concept did come to fruition, the Ford guys could use the excuse that you guys have an equally large engine, and have to use a supercharger lol. On that note, the Raptor would blow it's doors off every time. In fact, chevy/gmc/ect... has never made a truck that could compete with a ford performance truck. Ford has made the SVT Lightning, and now the Raptor, which is also made by SVT. So this truck is far from being a joke.

End of story.

[Captain Awesome]

Originally Posted by meanmike

Yeah one truck versus two right. Get rid of that GMC and see what happen's, I bet they dont all switch to Chevy.

Think of the GMC as a Higher Trim Level Silverado.

But in response to your suggestion of dropping the GMC...

2008 Sales
-------------------
Silverado 465,065
Sierra: 168,544
Total: 633,609

F-Series: 515,513

...According to these numbers, if they dropped GMC then nearly 40% of the GMC customers would have to abandon the Silverado AND would have to defect TO the F-150, just to make the sales EQUAL. Not gonna happen.

Keep playin' catch-up.

[boxmonkeyracing]

Originally Posted by DropTheGloves

In regards to when the Raptor is available, it is available now. The 6.2 engine is not currently offered, however, there is an option that would allow customers to spend 3k more, and to upgrade the engine. The 6.2 however, will be offered as an option soon. A little more about the truck...I believe it is on 38's...I could be wrong, so don't quote me. It also is much wider than the normal F150. So they have had to do the same thing that the larger f scale trucks have, which is having the mirrors sticking out further. The Raptors suspension is also the best of the best. The Raptor has Fox Racing shocks.

When it comes down to performance, that s/c chevy truck would not even stand a chance. In fact, even if Chevy concept did come to fruition, the Ford guys could use the excuse that you guys have an equally large engine, and have to use a supercharger lol. On that note, the Raptor would blow it's doors off every time. In fact, chevy/gmc/ect... has never made a truck that could compete with a ford performance truck. Ford has made the SVT Lightning, and now the Raptor, which is also made by SVT. So this truck is far from being a joke.

End of story.

hmmm I guess the cyclone wasn't a performance truck. . .granted wasn't a full sized truck but still a performance truck. too bad I had to reach all the way back to the early 90's. . .hmm wonder what got ford thinking about performance trucks like the lightning and such?

Originally Posted by meanmike

None of it really matter's if GM does'nt ever up it's game the F-series will alway's be able to out tow them with or without more power......

I know this is the base trucks but this is were most of us live. so straight off edumnds

F-150 max towing capacity 5900 lbs
silverado 1500 max towing capacity 9100 lbs (that's from the v-6)
2007 silverado 1500 with 3.73 gears installed (bought that way from the factory in 07) 9300 lbs

hmmmmmmmmm. I'm not good with math. someone help me.

[meanmike]

Originally Posted by boxmonkeyracing

hmmm I guess the cyclone wasn't a performance truck. . .granted wasn't a full sized truck but still a performance truck. too bad I had to reach all the way back to the early 90's. . .hmm wonder what got ford thinking about performance trucks like the lightning and such?






I know this is the base trucks but this is were most of us live. so straight off edumnds

F-150 max towing capacity 5900 lbs
silverado 1500 max towing capacity 9100 lbs (that's from the v-6)
2007 silverado 1500 with 3.73 gears installed (bought that way from the factory in 07) 9300 lbs

hmmmmmmmmm. I'm not good with math. someone help me.

Well let me help you then. It's funny that you dont mention the best of both of their capabilities because when you do that the Silverado loses.

Silverado-10,700 pound's

F-150-11,300 pound's with less power. hmmmmmmmmmmm I guess I would'nt want to bring that up either.

And no when it come's to truck's most dont buy the base v-6. Also since you guy's want to go there then we can also bring up the Super Duty's

[boxmonkeyracing]

Originally Posted by meanmike

Well let me help you then. It's funny that you dont mention the best of both of their capabilities because when you do that the Silverado loses.

Silverado-10,700 pound's

F-150-11,300 pound's with less power. hmmmmmmmmmmm I guess I would'nt want to bring that up either.

And no when it come's to truck's most dont buy the base v-6. Also since you guy's want to go there then we can also bring up the Super Duty's

well edmunds I guess is lying then. because I pulled those numbers off their site. I like how thou you always spout numbers and don't have a source. just back it up sometimes and maybe people won't doubt you.

hmm did a little more digging looks like even though I selected what I thought was a 5.4 version it wasn't. it was the 4.6. sorry. most don't buy the base v-6? I know of several businesses in NC that use the v-6 daily.

[meanmike]

Originally Posted by boxmonkeyracing

well edmunds I guess is lying then. because I pulled those numbers off their site. hmm did a little more digging looks like even though I selected what I thought was a 5.4 version it wasn't. it was the 4.6. but didn't the ford just get a refresh? the chevy was refreshed in 07 and if I remember correctly in 07 chevy was top dog for towing. it's going to go back and forth. telling chevy needs to step up their game. . .ford just refreshed so they stepped up theirs now it's time for dodge to and then chevy will again.

most don't buy the base v-6? I know of several businesses in NC that use the v-6 daily.

When I made that statement I was refering to the big boy's not to the half ton's. And no the Silverado dually does'nt even touch the F-350 there's somewhere near a 2,000 or 3,000 lb difference. As for my source, well all you have to do is go to Ford's website. They dont make you search all over the net for their's, it's right on the site............................................. TRY LOOKING BEFORE TYPING


You know this all started because someone made a comment about how much power the Silverado made. I wanted was more info from someone who did'nt know anything as it turned out. This was never suppose to be about what I or anybody else thought was better, but what was available so I could make the right decision for me.

[boxmonkeyracing]

Originally Posted by meanmike

When I made that statement I was refering to the big boy's not to the half ton's. And no the Silverado dually does'nt even touch the F-350 there's somewhere near a 2,000 or 3,000 lb difference.


You know this all started because someone made a comment about how much power the Silverado made. I wanted was more info from someone who did'nt know anything as it turned out. This was never suppose to be about what I or anybody else thought was better, but what was available so I could make the right decision for me.

well all I know is my silverado 07 1500 pulls more then an avg 07 silverado 1500 do to gearing. which makes sense. there are more numbers then advertised numbers. because I didn't know my truck could pull more until I went to trade it in and someone pulled up a chart that had my gear ratio on it and showed me that I was fine.

and btw recheck my post. I realized I didn't want to continue arguing over something so stupid. when obviously the website I was looking at didn't have all the information I was hunting for. edmunds is a joke. can't even select what gear ratio you have. and obviously I did look at their site and pull up the info. that's why I said I SELECTED what looked like the 5.4 but TURNED out to be the 4.3 or whatever the ford is. just like when I went back to the 2007 silverado I have it kept coming up the 4.6 with the max tow rating for it.

and you seriously believe everything posted on ford, chevy, dodge's websites are acurate enough to trust? I mean I've read several things on all those sites that claim best ____. fill in the blank and you can instantly go to another manufactures website or edmunds/motortrend/etc etc and find out that something else out there is better.

[Captain Awesome]

You know this all started because someone made a comment about how much power the Silverado made. I wanted was more info from someone who did'nt know anything as it turned out. This was never suppose to be about what I or anybody else thought was better, but what was available so I could make the right decision for me.

Nice head fake.

You WANTED people to chime in so you could launch into another attack.

You NEVER solicit "info" from anyone to educate yourself. If you did, you wouldn't constantly be trying to "trump" their info with your own slanted data.

You debate like Al Gore.

[Mayhem]

My dad could beat all your dads at the same time.

Especially on the internet.

Are you guys for real??

What is with the macho google copy & paste war. lol Get over it.