another GM product goes...

[Evergreen6]

Originally Posted by olrocker

Because the Malibu rides and performs better and is built better. The Equinox is a bucket of Fisher Price plastic

And yet the Equinox outsells it.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by Vtor_ZL1

If I already owned the tooling... just keep in making until no longer profitable. Silly to abandon platform where all tooling is paid for and still selling 400K units a year.


I'm sure they did upside of increased profit for "potential" sales from a more flexible factory as well... and we know what won.

Unless the plant where the tooling resides is already slated to be retooled to build something else. Very much the case here.

[olrocker]

Originally Posted by Evergreen6

And yet the Equinox outsells it.

Because the majority of the American car buying public are idiots and believe all the pr these companies use to push SUVs.

There was a time I was a Honda fan and owned 3 of them. But in the last 10 years before they started cutting them all GM and Ford both were making excellent sedans. The last gen Fusion and current Malibu are every bit as good as the best Camrys and Accords ever made. Maybe better.

You ever get a chance to drive a well maintained last gen, fully loaded Fusion I suggest you do. They feel like a small Mercedes. Yes, I’m not kidding or over exaggerating. They’re that good.

Just when they finally perfect something and get it right they kill it off.

Geeze just get it right the first time and make it the best to start with.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by arpad_m

GM apologists will soon be here to quote the corporation's annual profits hovering around $14-18B for a decade, which, according to them, justifies everything.

LOL no one needs to apologize for that.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by Evergreen6

What can you share about the ICE Equinox?

Not sure if it was this thread or another, but I just had one as a rental, a 2023 with the 1.5 and 6-speed auto. I was amazed it took me that long to actually drive and experience an Equinox.

I like it. It's a good size, it drives like car, interior layout is good. No, it's not an "enthusiast" car, but it does "car things" very well, with added utility. The 1.5 was adequate (with turbo).

I didn't enjoy the automatic. Gears are shockingly far apart for such a relatively small engine. I'm spoiled by an 850RE (8HP50) behind a 2.0 in my daily driver, and ZF's design is superb. Manual gear selection is lightning quick, no lag. The Equinox's 6-speed reminded me of a 4T65 with two gears squeezed in. And that's not a compliment! lol.

Anyway, bottom line, the Equinox feels like a modern suitor to the Malibu's stewardship of size and power. I never thought I'd consider an Equinox, but I actually like them now.

Not totally sure what you are asking so I’ll assume that you’re asking about sales performance.

• Calendar YTD: 73,011 (Malibu is 46,245)
• 4th place in segment sales volume in segment growing 9.5% Y-T-Y (Malibu is 4th in segment that is declining 9.1%)

[NovaSS4spdFan]

Can't recall the last time or if ever I saw an ad on TV for the Malibu. The Equinox is advertised and when the buyer visits the stealership, the sales staff
points them in that direction because they are in stock, big enough without being slobs and are generally affordable.
Texas is truck country. Come to the N.E. and they're are plenty of folks who still want a sedan. Pickup trucks, too.
Some will say GM did the research and decided that it should go. Likely. But the EV push is at the core and platform/battery share is steering the General in that direction. Time will tell how sales pan out but EVs right now are exceeding 100 day supply.

[GearheadSS]

Originally Posted by olrocker

But in the last 10 years before they started cutting them all GM and Ford both were making excellent sedans. The last gen Fusion and current Malibu are every bit as good as the best Camrys and Accords ever made. Maybe better.

[Evergreen6]

Originally Posted by olrocker

Because the majority of the American car buying public are idiots and believe all the pr these companies use to push SUVs.

There was a time I was a Honda fan and owned 3 of them. But in the last 10 years before they started cutting them all GM and Ford both were making excellent sedans. The last gen Fusion and current Malibu are every bit as good as the best Camrys and Accords ever made. Maybe better.

You ever get a chance to drive a well maintained last gen, fully loaded Fusion I suggest you do. They feel like a small Mercedes. Yes, I’m not kidding or over exaggerating. They’re that good.

Just when they finally perfect something and get it right they kill it off.

Geeze just get it right the first time and make it the best to start with.

First off, I don't think the majority of general car-buying public are idiots. That's a step way too far. The majority of car buyers buy vehicles that best fit their needs. I myself absolutely prefer an Equinox over a Malibu and if you're going to call me an idiot, well, I don't really care what anyone thinks. SUV's and CUV's are popular because they meet a higher need for most car buyers.

The Fusion was an OK car and it sold well at its peak. It did not feel like a small Mercedes, IMO. It felt like a midsize global Ford to me, and that's not a bad thing. But it's also not a Mercedes. I've driven plenty of them. I would pick the Fusion over a similar year Chrysler 200 any day, and I'd also pick the Fusion over the Malibu. Not sorry: I'd pick a C-class over all of them.

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

Not totally sure what you are asking so I’ll assume that you’re asking about sales performance.

• Calendar YTD: 73,011 (Malibu is 46,245)
• 4th place in segment sales volume in segment growing 9.5% Y-T-Y (Malibu is 4th in segment that is declining 9.1%)

That's good info. I was curious if GM has any public plans for the future of the Equinox in its current ICE version. I assume it's NOT going away even though there will also be an EV Equinox?

[Number 3]

Realistically this is part of the bigger plan that shuts the Malibu plant down for a year. When the plant opens back up the Malibu is a year older. Even the XT4 goes on hiatus. Now when the plant opens back up with the Bolt that likely replaces the Malibu.

Prediction though, look for a Chinese made Hybrid soon. Fun fact. GM imported a Cadillac CT6 hybrid that was a sales bomb from China a few years ago. Another sedan that stayed in production in China after dissapearing from the US.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by NovaSS4spdFan

Can't recall the last time or if ever I saw an ad on TV for the Malibu. The Equinox is advertised and when the buyer visits the stealership, the sales staff
points them in that direction because they are in stock, big enough without being slobs and are generally affordable.
Texas is truck country. Come to the N.E. and they're are plenty of folks who still want a sedan. Pickup trucks, too.
Some will say GM did the research and decided that it should go. Likely. But the EV push is at the core and platform/battery share is steering the General in that direction. Time will tell how sales pan out but EVs right now are exceeding 100 day supply.

Pretty much spot on except for the last line. Very few EVs are at or near 100 day supply and for some of them it makes sense. Example…Jaguar iPace typically has about 300 plus days of inventory at any point in time. Their average sales per day is 1-3 cars nationwide. And Jaguar has 337 dealerships. So on any given day, every dealership has one iPace that they may or may not sell that month.

Here’s my list of EVs with more than 100 days supply…

• Cadillac Lyriq: 200 (14,043 vehicles)
• Genesis GV60: 105 (1,071 vehicles)
• Mercedes-Benz EQE: 129 (1,998 vehicles)
• Mercedes-Benz EQS: 99 (1,254 vehicles)
• Audi eTron GT: 124 (613 vehicles)
• Mercedes-Benz EQB: 238 (2,200 vehicles)
• Jaguar iPace: 93 (306 vehicles)

Out of that list, the only one that would worry me if I’m a vehicle planner is Lyriq. Mercedes-Benz has a lot of inventory. But even their ICE vehicles that are not built at Tuscaloosa tend to have very high (between 100 - 200 days) inventory.

[SomeGeoffGuy]

Originally Posted by Vtor_ZL1

If I already owned the tooling... just keep in making until no longer profitable. Silly to abandon platform where all tooling is paid for and still selling 400K units a year.


I'm sure they did upside of increased profit for "potential" sales from a more flexible factory as well... and we know what won.

My guess is that it ties up too much capitol (cash) to keep it running. They are using all the capitol to fund the EV transition right now.

-Geoff

[Martinjlm]

One thing that gets lost in this mix is the impact of fuel economy curves. In negotiating the rule making for Car CAFE and Truck CAFE the Detroit 3 were very successfully in negotiating different fuel economy curves for the Car Fleet and the Truck Fleet. The curves for both Car and Truck are based on “shadow area” which can be most easily defined as the area bordered by the tire patches. Readers Digest version is that the Detroit 3 got the regulators to agree that due to rules of physics that cannot be violated, where a Truck and a Car have the same footprint area, the Truck will require more energy to operate than the Car. And therefore, the Truck should have a less stringent fuel economy target than the Car. Remember, this is the Readers Digest version. There’s a lot more involved here. So…If you have a Malibu and an Equinox that have roughly the same “shadow area”, the Equinox will have an easier fuel economy target to hit than the Malibu. And the Equinox has a better profit margin per vehicle sold. So, if you’re GM do you ant to build and sell more Malibu or more Equinox? The choice is clear. This is part of the reason why sedans are dropping out of brand portfolios and utilities are breeding like rabbits. From th manufacturer side. From the consumer side, the utility configuration is far more usable than the sedan. Sedans ma be more stylish (and coupes even more so) but at the end of the day, consumers are purchasing more utilities because they are more useful than similar sized sedans.

[genxer]

It's also quite an ugly incentive to ignor improving tougher segments, if they think they can manipulate those people elsewhere.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by SomeGeoffGuy

Like they have a choice? It's a government mandate.

-Geoff

Only in California and other states aligned with CARB and that’s not until 2030.