Dodge Viper, More power than advertised ?

[MrKrisSullivan]

Originally Posted by radz282003

I don't think the ACR is really even on the same field as ZR1 though. Isn't that car like stripped and what not? I'm sure GM could find the few more tenths it's lacking in a few more laps and get to at least the same speed as the ACR. Still, I'm not taking away from that car because it's just plain cool.



Shoot; even though Magnusun doesn't make the blower for either the LSA or LS9 I think I still may have some validity: The LSA uses the 1900 blower and Magnusun rates the same size 4-lobe blower to something like 800 horsepower (I haven't read what's claimed for the 2300 in the ZR1). My point is that I think that ZR1 could reliably live in the range gtahvit said. I know the engineers said that the LS9 is at it's limit now but I don't recall exactly as a result of what. It has a completely forged bottom end, bigger head bolts, stronger heads, and a load of other stuff. I'm sure adding long tubes, a different pulley, CAI and catback would get another easy 'hundred horse' out of it. Still, the point about adding FI to the Viper would just be stupid-power, but I don't think a comparison between an NA motor to an FI motor is quite representative.

Either way, it looks like Dodge may have underrated the car a little

So the boy's at GM have even said that the LS9 has peaked...Well wouldn't that end the arguement?
I see what has been said about high compression ratio but it could still handle some boost, you said so your self... And in an earlier post I did say it would be "stupid power"
So it does prolly go back to "No replacement for displacement"...

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by radz282003

Shoot; even though Magnusun doesn't make the blower for either the LSA or LS9.....

They do, actually.
It's the one they put on the G8. "Generation 6" TVS-series 1900, and 2300.

Granted, there aren't many kits out...but the one they make for the Camaro will be with one of those blowers, I 99% guarantee it!

[gunslinger]

The ACR is a stripped down track car with adjustable aerodynamics and adjustable(non-magnetic) suspension, which means it is probably faster around a Road Course.

The ZR1 is a high HP touring car with incredible handling and a very compliant ride.

They are two different beasts and any high end garage would have one of both!!

[GTAHVIT]

Originally Posted by MrKrisSullivan

So the boy's at GM have even said that the LS9 has peaked...Well wouldn't that end the arguement?
I see what has been said about high compression ratio but it could still handle some boost, you said so your self... And in an earlier post I did say it would be "stupid power"
So it does prolly go back to "No replacement for displacement"...

Because GM, like everyother manufacturer will over engineer the engine to protect it from the idiot that will redline it in first gear to see how much boost they can generate.

The bottom line is GM built the LS9 to be nearly indestructable in the hands of someone with more money than brains. But you will always have more room for more power in an engine that is built to handle boost. Look at the GT500 compared to our SS. sure I can put a blower on the ls3 at say 7psi, (see ls3 vettes already doing this) and make close to 600 at the crank.

But the GT500 guy gets a new pully and a tune and all of a sudden he's pushing 700hp... NA High CR motors are just not engineered to hadle gobs of boost.

[Camaro_Corvette]

Better off to promise low, and give your customers more than it is to promise high, and make a total ass of themselves.

[TFord]

Originally Posted by gtahvit

Because GM, like everyother manufacturer will over engineer the engine to protect it from the idiot that will redline it in first gear to see how much boost they can generate.

The bottom line is GM built the LS9 to be nearly indestructable in the hands of someone with more money than brains. But you will always have more room for more power in an engine that is built to handle boost. Look at the GT500 compared to our SS. sure I can put a blower on the ls3 at say 7psi, (see ls3 vettes already doing this) and make close to 600 at the crank.

But the GT500 guy gets a new pully and a tune and all of a sudden he's pushing 700hp... NA High CR motors are just not engineered to hadle gobs of boost.

you beat me to it!

[fazm]

Originally Posted by gtahvit

OK I'll jump in the fray here.



Meanwhile, the ZR1 is already a blown motor that is more than capable of handling near 20lbs of boost. For about, meh, 100 bucks. Now the ZR1 is well into the 800hp range.

FWIW.

$100? seriouly?

for starters $100 will buy you a pulley +shipping. then you need a custom tune $$$ then a tuner $$$ a well as extra cooling mods (already been stated) $$$$

granted there is more potential for an aleady f/i engine (without breaking into internals) but $100 is an extreme under estimate on how much it woud cost to get a zr1 into the 800hp range

[GTAHVIT]

Originally Posted by fazm

$100? seriouly?

for starters $100 will buy you a pulley +shipping. then you need a custom tune $$$ then a tuner $$$ a well as extra cooling mods (already been stated) $$$$

granted there is more potential for an aleady f/i engine (without breaking into internals) but $100 is an extreme under estimate on how much it woud cost to get a zr1 into the 800hp range

I would argue you'd need either a tune or a tuner or a flashed PCM or a run on a dyno. And the intercooler on the 2300 is more than capable of handling the extra boost. Eaton says that blower can produce over 1k hp as is... Yes it would be safe to add cooling capability to the LS9 but you'd have the same problem if you added a blower to a NA motor to an even greater degree.

So, I'll admit I was off by a few hundred dollars.

[DGthe3]

Good job Mopar. The Viper ACR is probably the most badass car on the road. The ZR1 has been 'tamed' but is always ready to be unleashed. The ACR on the other hand . . . well you don't tame it so much as survive the attempt, if it lets you. Its a Viper, it wants to kill you.

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

I never cared for V10s or V12s, or V16s, etc though...they always came off as overkill to me.

And a superchaged 6.2L V8 isn't? Technically speaking, those cars are making 15x the power that is 'needed' so anything more than a 40 hp 500cc V-twin engine is 'overkill'. But having super-duper-OMGWTFBBQ-mega-overkill sure is fun to talk about.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

And a superchaged 6.2L V8 isn't? Technically speaking, those cars are making 15x the power that is 'needed' so anything more than a 40 hp 500cc V-twin engine is 'overkill'. But having super-duper-OMGWTFBBQ-mega-overkill sure is fun to talk about.

Stupid devil's Advocate.

My thought process has always been V10, V12, V16s....how much bigger are they gonna make these stupid things? The LS7 is the golden engine, imho...not overkill. Art.

[Supermans]

The viper is a beautiful car. I just wish Dodge would have made a version in the $40,000 range from factory..

[JJ#48Racing]

Hennessy has a 705hp version of the ZR1 by adding 4lbs of boost (total 14lbs), headers, and a tune.

They also have a 750hp version using the same above mods plus a cam.