Software Updates and Lock-in Track Modes

OminouSS · 09-25-2017, 02:52 PM

Is it possible to receive programming updates over WiFi or will it always be a trip to dealer?
On that note, is there a possibility we can have a 'lock-in' feature added to menu options for both Engine Mode and Active Handling? There are occasions when I inadvertently hit the selector button when shifting during track driving, causing a program change to PTM or Driving Mode. I'm a tall driver and have found other guys with long limbs to have this problem as well. Why not also allow the car to recall your last setting as a future default so you do not have to fumble through modes when you restart your car on grid? Liability I presume...

Thanks for building me a Porsche Annihilator

waterman · 09-25-2017, 03:21 PM

subscribed.

Thirty3 · 09-25-2017, 03:29 PM

As well as locking Rev matching on or off.

OminouSS · 09-25-2017, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thirty3

As well as locking Rev matching on or off.

YUP!

wanab · 09-25-2017, 07:30 PM

Lock launch control settings as your personal default.

Dethsupp0rt · 09-26-2017, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OminouSS

Is it possible to receive programming updates over wifi or will it always be a trip to dealer?

Please no. That's a security nightmare waiting to happen.

OminouSS · 09-26-2017, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dethsupp0rt

Please no. That's a security nightmare waiting to happen.

So is on-line banking. So is checking your Equifax credit score. So is going to a Anthem blue cross doctor. So is shopping at Target. So is having a Yahoo email. So is...

I picture the possibility of choosing your updates like we can for anything else app based on our phones, TV's, hell even my new washing machine can take software updates over wifi.

Dethsupp0rt · 09-26-2017, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OminouSS

So is on-line banking. So is checking your Equifax credit score. So is going to a Anthem blue cross doctor. So is shopping at Target. So is having a Yahoo email. So is...

I picture the possibility of choosing your updates like we can for anything else app based on our phones, TV's, hell even my new washing machine can take software updates over wifi.

Except one of these is potentially life threatening.

There are already attack vectors present as it is, so making them more accessible over a wireless network, no matter how innocuous they may seem (e.g. only allowing certain updates to a head unit), is extremely bad practice. They should remain limited to physical access only.

OminouSS · 09-27-2017, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dethsupp0rt

Except one of these is potentially life threatening.

There are already attack vectors present as it is, so making them more accessible over a wireless network, no matter how innocuous they may seem (e.g. only allowing certain updates to a head unit), is extremely bad practice. They should remain limited to physical access only.

I appreciate you recognizing that I wanted your opinion. It matters to me. Especially when the safety of the world is at stake. Nobody wants to hop in their $70,000 sports car only to find Al Qaeda slipped in a bad engine tune.

Dethsupp0rt · 09-27-2017, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OminouSS

I appreciate you recognizing that I wanted your opinion. It matters to me. Especially when the safety of the world is at stake. Nobody wants to hop in their $70,000 sports car only to find Al Qaeda slipped in a bad engine tune.

Security's just my job 5 (really 7) days a week. I can understand you/everyone may not have an interest in this field, and that's fine.

PoC attacks on vehicles via wireless have already been done, so it's a little more than "opinion".

al-Qaeda is so two years ago though, so that statement I cannot forgive.

Bobkd · 09-30-2017, 09:23 PM

The 18's can do OTA updates in the Mylink. Not sure what they could do though.

samsumon · 10-01-2017, 12:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dethsupp0rt

Security's just my job 5 (really 7) days a week. I can understand you/everyone may not have an interest in this field, and that's fine.

PoC attacks on vehicles via wireless have already been done, so it's a little more than "opinion".

al-Qaeda is so two years ago though, so that statement I cannot forgive.

Tesla seems to be doing fine

*DGthe3* · 10-01-2017, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by samsumon

Tesla seems to be doing fine

Just because something hasn't happened, doesn't mean it can't happen.

If there exists a data connection, the system can be compromised by an outsider. The only way to make it impossible for vehicle control systems to get hacked wirelessly is if they are completely disconnected from communication points. Which includes not only preventing wireless updates (which is obvious), but also doing things like having no means of communication between say the navigation system and throttle/steering/brakes.

h422694 · 10-01-2017, 10:09 PM

I agree that if there is no wireless connection, the hack attempt would fail. However the other control modules (ECM, TCM, BCM, etc) would still be connected to a common bus that would allow them to communicate with each other. It would be no different than if you had 4 PCs connected behind a router and then disconnected the router. The PCs could still talk to each other but not the outside world. While Nav gets outside info, I don't think that Nav has the capability to control other driving/control functions(yet).

09-25-2017, 02:52 PM	#1
OminouSS Drives: Red Hot track candy Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: NorCal Posts: 1,092	Software Updates and Lock-in Track Modes Is it possible to receive programming updates over WiFi or will it always be a trip to dealer? On that note, is there a possibility we can have a 'lock-in' feature added to menu options for both Engine Mode and Active Handling? There are occasions when I inadvertently hit the selector button when shifting during track driving, causing a program change to PTM or Driving Mode. I'm a tall driver and have found other guys with long limbs to have this problem as well. Why not also allow the car to recall your last setting as a future default so you do not have to fumble through modes when you restart your car on grid? Liability I presume... Thanks for building me a Porsche Annihilator __________________ Baby born 11/08/16. Left birthing place 11/25/16. Arrived home 12/6/16: '17 Red Hot ZL1. Stock.

09-25-2017, 03:21 PM	#2
waterman Drives: Grandad's C2 L89 Join Date: May 2017 Location: 2051.50N 15629.60W Posts: 1,711	subscribed. __________________ 2018 ZL1 1LE sw/PDR

09-25-2017, 03:29 PM	#3
Thirty3 Drives: SS 1LE Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: Land of 10,000 lakes. Posts: 76	As well as locking Rev matching on or off. __________________ 2018 SS 1LE

09-25-2017, 07:30 PM	#5
wanab Drives: 17 ZL1 4300 03/16/2017 Join Date: Dec 2016 Location: Kansas Posts: 112	Lock launch control settings as your personal default. __________________ 2017 ZL1 Coupe, MBM, A10, PDR, CF Hood Insert, ZL1 matts, 50th Anv. Indoor Cover

09-30-2017, 09:23 PM	#11
Bobkd Drives: 2018 1ss, 2021 silverado HD Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: wny Posts: 68	The 18's can do OTA updates in the Mylink. Not sure what they could do though.

10-01-2017, 10:09 PM	#14
h422694 Drives: '16 Z06 7 Spd, 2024 High Country HD Join Date: May 2015 Location: Kansas City area Posts: 441	I agree that if there is no wireless connection, the hack attempt would fail. However the other control modules (ECM, TCM, BCM, etc) would still be connected to a common bus that would allow them to communicate with each other. It would be no different than if you had 4 PCs connected behind a router and then disconnected the router. The PCs could still talk to each other but not the outside world. While Nav gets outside info, I don't think that Nav has the capability to control other driving/control functions(yet).