[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

That makes it Mid Lux Sedan, where CTS has always wanted to be. CTS...all three previous generations, struggled with size relative to segment. In the last iteration, ATS was smaller than most mid-lux, CTS larger than most midlux. CT5 will be closer to CTS Gen 3 size (a little smaller) and will move the "CTS" name to the new nomenclature.

Originally Posted by PDXSSCE

We'll agree to disagree. Everyone, including GM sources, have stated the CT5 is a totally new vehicle to slot between & replace the soon to be discontinued ATS & CTS. The CTS name isn't moving anywhere.

Not really much of a disagreement. CT5 is to CTS as 6th Gen Camaro is to 5th Gen Camaro. The statement I highlighted in bold is a bit clumsy. I really struggled with how to describe what is really happening here. The "original" Cadillac nomenclature was to have the first letter identify the size class that the car was to compete in. A is small (like Mercedes A-Class). C is midsized (like Mercedes C-Class). The new nomenclature simply kept the C and used the 3rd digit as a numeral to indicate size, more like BMW uses its 1st digit. Confused yet? Now, somewhere in the development of the 3rd Gen CTS, it was decided that it is too big to be a 3-Series competitor as originally intended with Gen 1 CTS. It was determined that CTS should be a 5-Series competitor. So, with the Alpha upgrade + the implementation of the new naming system, the vehicle (CTS) that would be the 5-Series competitor becomes CT5. All other cars would be numbered based on their size relative to CTS/CT5. CT4 would be smaller than old CTS / new CT5. CT6 is larger than old CTS / new CT5. Confusing, but pretty much the way it evolved.

In the old (as in currently on the street) portfolio, ATS competed with M-B A-Class and BMW 3-Series and CTS competed with M-B C-Class and BMW 5-Series. The new CT5 will compete with M-B C-Class and BMW 5-Series. It will not compete with A-Class or 3-Series, so whatever GM source is telling you that CT5 replaces CTS and ATS is hedging a little bit and/or opting to not discuss the entire portfolio. You know...."I am not at liberty to discuss future product plans". We all get that stamped in ultraviolet ink on the backs of our hands

When it was determined that Gen 2 CTS would be too large to compete effectively with 3-Series, ATS was developed to target 3-Series head-on. The idea of one car as a tweener to compete in both segments flew out of the window. Saying CT5 will do that would be a huge step backward to those awkward days.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

Not really much of a disagreement. CT5 is to CTS as 6th Gen Camaro is to 5th Gen Camaro. The statement I highlighted in bold is a bit clumsy. I really struggled with how to describe what is really happening here. The "original" Cadillac nomenclature was to have the first letter identify the size class that the car was to compete in. A is small (like Mercedes A-Class). C is midsized (like Mercedes C-Class). The new nomenclature simply kept the C and used the 3rd digit as a numeral to indicate size, more like BMW uses its 1st digit. Confused yet? Now, somewhere in the development of the 3rd Gen CTS, it was decided that it is too big to be a 3-Series competitor as originally intended with Gen 1 CTS. It was determined that CTS should be a 5-Series competitor. So, with the Alpha upgrade + the implementation of the new naming system, the vehicle (CTS) that would be the 5-Series competitor becomes CT5. All other cars would be numbered based on their size relative to CTS/CT5. CT4 would be smaller than old CTS / new CT5. CT6 is larger than old CTS / new CT5. Confusing, but pretty much the way it evolved.

In the old (as in currently on the street) portfolio, ATS competed with M-B A-Class and BMW 3-Series and CTS competed with M-B C-Class and BMW 5-Series. The new CT5 will compete with M-B C-Class and BMW 5-Series. It will not compete with A-Class or 3-Series, so whatever GM source is telling you that CT5 replaces CTS and ATS is hedging a little bit and/or opting to not discuss the entire portfolio. You know...."I am not at liberty to discuss future product plans". We all get that stamped in ultraviolet ink on the backs of our hands

When it was determined that Gen 2 CTS would be too large to compete effectively with 3-Series, ATS was developed to target 3-Series head-on. The idea of one car as a tweener to compete in both segments flew out of the window. Saying CT5 will do that would be a huge step backward to those awkward days.

There is way to many numbers and letters in that post I thought I was reading a calculus equation lol

also made me feel like this

[Dethsupp0rt]

Originally Posted by shaffe

There is way to many numbers and letters in that post I thought I was reading a calculus equation lol

Hah! It's all irrelevant anyway, because Cadillac cannot compete with Audi/BMW/Mercedes at the current pricing.

The 2nd gen CTS was a relative bargain, as it competed pretty well with the M5 at the time, while being less expensive (about the same as the M3).

Yeah, the transmission was awful and the interior wasn't as good, but for the price it held its own.

Inexplicably, they decided for the 3rd gen CTS-V and the ATS-V, they'd price them at the same level as the M5 and M3 competition. They've sat on lots ever since, and Nysschen finally got fired because of it.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by shaffe

There is way to many numbers and letters in that post I thought I was reading a calculus equation lol

also made me feel like this

I know. Tried to do the Reader’s Digest version in the prior post, but it was apparently a bit ambiguous, so I went ahead and dumped the whole load.

[shaffe]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

I know. Tried to do the Reader’s Digest version in the prior post, but it was apparently a bit ambiguous, so I went ahead and dumped the whole load.

LOL I appreciate the clarification but damn reading all those numbers letters so close together on 1 cup of coffee was tough lol