Trans Am ws6 vs. Camaro SS

[ULTRAZLS1]

Originally Posted by radz28

Let's everyone chill out

I tried that with my last post to him.

I guess he thinks I am blind or something when I read his posts.

[radz28]

Originally Posted by ULTRAZLS1

I tried that with my last post to him.

I guess he thinks I am blind or something when I read his posts.

Regardless - let's return to being civil Please

Respectfully...

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by ULTRAZLS1

Dude...wow. Everything you have said is old news

It's clear you have a lot of knowledge about these cars. Maybe someday you will also learn to respect others instead of putting down the depth of their observations.

and I havent stacked anything in anyones favor.

You calculated power-to-weight only for the most powerful 5gen, without mentioning the other possibility. If you were impartial, you'd have mentioned both possibilities left open by the OP.

You left plenty of things out...you brought up weight but didnt mention power to weight....you never mention stock 1/4 mile times....on and on and on.

Sorry, missed that in my big "in-depth analysis" that I advertised to be complete, intricate and all-encompassing. (not)

How am I supposed to know if he drives the auto or manual? I am stacking the deck becuase I qouted m6 times? are you kidding me right now?

A fair comparison would have compared both cars, stock for stock, considering the possibilities of all the transmission matchups since the OP left it open. Sorry that was not in my in-depth analysis

So yes you have done the same thing you claim I am doing...

Again, nope. Your observations to that end are not holding water.

When I said you favor the 4th gen I didnt mean literally...

Eh? Making no sense here.

The only rreason you even posted was to show an argument in favor of the 4th gen being close to the 5th!

Guess what: it is close... as you yourself have observed herein. I just added the points I'm familiar with. I'm not a big expert on the 5gens... that is one reason why I come to this site to read about them and their enthusiasts. I'm not an expert on 5gen gearing, the restrictions of their PCM's, their tires or the weight of their rims. I just brought up a few notions to see if someone has more info (hence, the question marks in my list). The rims on the 5gen SS are gorgeous... but how much do they weigh? Instead of someone chiming in with info, I'm being chased like a witch in Salem. Burn the witch, for her blasphemy!

Out of your dedicated in depth review of both cars you presented ONLY 2 key points for the 5th gen and didnt go into any detail. You said It has a better motor and good gearing for the A6. Holy cow....I can think of plenty more you have left out becuase YOU FAVOR the 4th gen...in other words you are biased.

As I said, it's clear you know some things about the 5gen. Hopefully it will then also be apparent to you that the items on my two lists are not equal in performance impact. As I've already acknowledged more than once, the 5gen has an innate edge in this comparison. Its top engine has loads more power than the LS1. My list was meant more to answer the question, "Why is this even a close matchup?" and to make a case that the two are close enough that it might be a "driver's race".

You even went into the aerodynamic advantage of the 4th gen...but no...you dont favor the 4th gen.

So, aero doesn't matter in a race over 100 MPH? What planet are you from? Maybe it's not a huge factor. But the 4gen is superior in that attribute. Actually I only looked it up as an afterthought to my original list (that being, the formal in-depth analytical analysis thingy)... after looking at some pix of both types of cars and noticing how much more pointy the 4gens are. You better believe, aero matters in automotive performance. I still greatly enjoy my 4gen, and have an open mind about its advantages as well as its shortcomings. When the time comes, I will eagerly trade up to a 5gen with its improved styling, power and modern tech. But in the meantime I'm ok with what I have

[ULTRAZLS1]

Originally Posted by BlueStreak

It's clear you have a lot of knowledge about these cars. Maybe someday you will also learn to respect others instead of putting down the depth of their observations.


You calculated power-to-weight only for the most powerful 5gen, without mentioning the other possibility. If you were impartial, you'd have mentioned both possibilities left open by the OP.

Sorry, missed that in my big "in-depth analysis" that I advertised to be complete, intricate and all-encompassing. (not)

A fair comparison would have compared both cars, stock for stock, considering the possibilities of all the transmission matchups since the OP left it open. Sorry that was not in my in-depth analysis

Again, nope. Your observations to that end are not holding water.

Eh? Making no sense here.

Guess what: it is close... as you yourself have observed herein. I just added the points I'm familiar with. I'm not a big expert on the 5gens... that is one reason why I come to this site to read about them and their enthusiasts. I'm not an expert on 5gen gearing, the restrictions of their PCM's, their tires or the weight of their rims. I just brought up a few notions to see if someone has more info (hence, the question marks in my list). The rims on the 5gen SS are gorgeous... but how much do they weigh? Instead of someone chiming in with info, I'm being chased like a witch in Salem. Burn the witch, for her blasphemy!

As I said, it's clear you know some things about the 5gen. Hopefully it will then also be apparent to you that the items on my two lists are not equal in performance impact. As I've already acknowledged more than once, the 5gen has an innate edge in this comparison. Its top engine has loads more power than the LS1. My list was meant more to answer the question, "Why is this even a close matchup?" and to make a case that the two are close enough that it might be a "driver's race".

So, aero doesn't matter in a race over 100 MPH? What planet are you from? Maybe it's not a huge factor. But the 4gen is superior in that attribute. Actually I only looked it up as an afterthought to my original list (that being, the formal in-depth analytical analysis thingy)... after looking at some pix of both types of cars and noticing how much more pointy the 4gens are. You better believe, aero matters in automotive performance. I still greatly enjoy my 4gen, and have an open mind about its advantages as well as its shortcomings. When the time comes, I will eagerly trade up to a 5gen with its improved styling, power and modern tech. But in the meantime I'm ok with what I have

The 4th gen has no advantage over 100mph. The LS3 pulls more RPMs over a broader torque curve. The top end pull at 80+mph is really where the 5th starts to shine.The 5th gen has been clocked at ~175mph stock with the limiter removed.
A high speed roll race would favor the 5th gen even more so. The weight of the car is also less of a factor at speed BTW. Another reason I didnt care to address this factor...it is "old news" and has been discussed before. Also anyone who has extensively driven and owned both cars (such as myself) would already know the 5th gen has an advantage at high speed. The only people arguing this would be those that are biased toward the 4th gen and dont have all the facts....

What I meant by "old news" was that you are nitpicking every little detail when none of this is needed. The ls1 4th gen has been on the road for over a decade...it has run a best of 12.8 in the 1/4. The 5th has been on the road for a little over a year and has run a 12.5. It is as simple as that...I dont care if the 4th gen has a special flux capacitor that kicks in at 43mph and each wheel weighs 15lbs less.

If I didnt include the automatic to favor YOUR point of view....sorry I missed that. Fact remains the L99 has hit 12.8 stock which matches the M6 4th gen and bests the A4 4th gen. I didnt mention that because...again "old news".

I drive an M6 and the M6 is the fastest example of the 5th gen because the L99 is down 30hp. I could care less what it runs. We were talking max performance of both cars and the manual tranny is top performer in both in stock form...more old news.

Also...funny how when I leave something out I am being unfair. When you leave something out "sorry I missed that". We wouldnt be arguing if either of us thought we were being fair or whatever stupid thing we are pissing and moaning about.

I have plenty more I could say in rebuttal but I dont care to change your mind (or whatever it is we are trying to do) anymore.

Lets move on with our lives and agree to disagree on who is being more fair or who is right etc LOL.
You can go ahead and get the last word in...I wont be replying in regards to this anymore. Also...I apologize if I came off rude with some of my comments. I can be sarcastic at times and really dont mean to be rude.

[BlackieRay]

So have they had the race yet? It should be a driver's race. All things being equal, I would give a .2 edge to the Camaro.

[BlueStreak]

Originally Posted by ULTRAZLS1

Lets move on with our lives and agree to disagree on who is being more fair or who is right etc LOL.
You can go ahead and get the last word in...I wont be replying in regards to this anymore. Also...I apologize if I came off rude with some of my comments. I can be sarcastic at times and really dont mean to be rude.

Agreed, and apologies from here too if I came off in such a way. I've made all the observations I intended too, so I'm done responding here as well. It appears you are a fellow Michigander (?) - maybe we can meet up some day and trade some stories. Hope you made it to Woodward this weekend... we had some family up here from Ohio and it was really a blast

[big hammer]

here is the non arguable facts on this presented by myself.

l99 > auto ls1

manual ls1 > L99

ls3 > manual ls1.

[ULTRAZLS1]

Originally Posted by BlueStreak

Agreed, and apologies from here too if I came off in such a way. I've made all the observations I intended too, so I'm done responding here as well. It appears you are a fellow Michigander (?) - maybe we can meet up some day and trade some stories. Hope you made it to Woodward this weekend... we had some family up here from Ohio and it was really a blast

I had to work all weekend and couldnt get it off :(.

I was planning on going but couldnt.

[28.]

Has the OP posted results? I hate it when ppl start threads, get everyone rialed up, then don't bother to come back and inform the rest...

[SGOS252382]

What's funny is when the 05/06 GTO came out we had this same discussion over in the GTO forums. The Fbody guy all said the WS6 was faster and the GTO guys said the GTO was faster. So a bunch of members raced some WS6s and video taped it (stock vs stock).

Over in LS1GTO.com you could post street race vids and we saw lots of WS6 Trans Am vs 05/06 GTO vids.

Stock vs stock - the LS2 (400HP - 3780 lbs) GTO seemed to pull on the WS6 the majority of the time.

[BlackieRay]

Originally Posted by 28.

Has the OP posted results? I hate it when ppl start threads, get everyone rialed up, then don't bother to come back and inform the rest...

Sort of makes you wonder what he's up to doesn't it?

[All-Or-Nothing]

Originally Posted by 28.

Has the OP posted results? I hate it when ppl start threads, get everyone rialed up, then don't bother to come back and inform the rest...

Looks like he might be...........