[CamaroSS50]

Ah crap. this has been discussed to death on here.

1- GM couldn't market a cancer drug to end cancer.

The Camaro is dying on the vine, because no one even knows it is an option. It is not because of so-called poor visibility or a small trunk. It is because no one, other than those who have one, knows it is the best in this category.

Dodge has done a killer job in marketing the Challenger. Absolutely knocking it out of the park. This category isn't about a value proposition of anything other than impulse and pride.

Speed.
Looks.
Balls.

Burn those tires.
Hit 150 if you dare.
Go into the turn at 75.
Turn heads.

Oh well, carry on, I see the same folks defending GM's inept ways...

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by CamaroSS50

Ah crap. this has been discussed to death on here.

1- GM couldn't market a cancer drug to end cancer.

The Camaro is dying on the vine, because no one even knows it is an option. It is not because of so-called poor visibility or a small trunk. It is because no one, other than those who have one, knows it is the best in this category.

Dodge has done a killer job in marketing the Challenger. Absolutely knocking it out of the park. This category isn't about a value proposition of anything other than impulse and pride.

Speed.
Looks.
Balls.

Burn those tires.
Hit 150 if you dare.
Go into the turn at 75.
Turn heads.

Oh well, carry on, I see the same folks defending GM's inept ways...

Sorry but no. You can’t sell a car with limitations that are only accepted by ravid Camaro fans to a market that wants versatility and usefulness. The issue isn’t that people that would never consider a Camaro don’t know about the Camaro. Those people do. What people seem to be believing here is that there are a bunch of people, that if they just knew tha Camaro existed by a TV commercial, would be lined up to buy Camaros. That, my friends, is simply not the case.

[396ssrat]

Originally Posted by Number 3

The SS sedan has been gone since the 2017 MY. Marketing isn’t the issue other than interpreting the Voice of the Customer. You have to be clear on this. What I see is the customer for the Gen6 was the person that purchased a Gen5. So although I’ve defended The Chevrolet/Camaro marketing team on the advertising front, where they actually failed was in understanding what customer they actually wanted to target. Targeting existing Gen5 buyers with a smaller trunk, smaller rear seat and even worse visibility (other than over the hood and fender) might not have been the best play.

2017 SS was a fine car in all aspects but GM kept it a secret from the customer who was busy buying Camry's and BMW's. In reality the SS was a Goldmine which was overlooked. It didn't have to be so damned pricey.

[396ssrat]

Originally Posted by CamaroSS50

Ah crap. this has been discussed to death on here.

1- GM couldn't market a cancer drug to end cancer.

The Camaro is dying on the vine, because no one even knows it is an option. It is not because of so-called poor visibility or a small trunk. It is because no one, other than those who have one, knows it is the best in this category.

Dodge has done a killer job in marketing the Challenger. Absolutely knocking it out of the park. This category isn't about a value proposition of anything other than impulse and pride.

Speed.
Looks.
Balls.

Burn those tires.
Hit 150 if you dare.
Go into the turn at 75.
Turn heads.

Oh well, carry on, I see the same folks defending GM's inept ways...

I really like my grandson's 2019 3LT RS. It's a damned nice car. I have said more than once, "if GM could get people to drive these cars more would buy it". I rarely see a new Camaro in LA traffic. And LA has alot of traffic.

[3.8TransAM]

Originally Posted by Number 3

Sorry but no. You can’t sell a car with limitations that are only accepted by ravid Camaro fans to a market that wants versatility and usefulness. The issue isn’t that people that would never consider a Camaro don’t know about the Camaro. Those people do. What people seem to be believing here is that there are a bunch of people, that if they just knew tha Camaro existed by a TV commercial, would be lined up to buy Camaros. That, my friends, is simply not the case.

You could easily sell a lot more of the car if people knew they were out there, they don't. Just went thru this at work talking to people who mentioned the word Mustang.


Most of the issues with the Camaro go away if you actually get someones ass into the car and into the drivers seat for a drive. If you never get them there, you already lost the battle period. THEY need to advertise the car.


They did make a major screw up in the high belt line which wrecked the trunk opening and visibility out of the car(along with rear headroom), the back seat thing doesn't help. I have more room to smash people in the back of my Thirdgens than a sixth and I'm 6'6. It cannot happen in a sixth at all.


The worst decision GM can make is the crappy one they are doing now with complete lack of advertising. The Camaro and the Alpha platform are that good, without getting people to even look at them gets you exactly that, not a damned thing.

[Zack46]

Originally Posted by 396ssrat

I really like my grandson's 2019 3LT RS. It's a damned nice car. I have said more than once, "if GM could get people to drive these cars more would buy it". I rarely see a new Camaro in LA traffic. And LA has alot of traffic.

I've been seeing more and more around the cleveland area.

[MrChrisLS3]

Well, I don't know, but could it be possible that the known issues with the A8 transmission got out to folks researching the Camaro, and went with a Mustang or Challenger to avoid an unfixable issue?

Then, they finally put the A10 in it. However, someone in the Ivory Tower said awesome, we fixed the transmission issue, now let's make it ugly as hell.

So now, in 2020, it looks like they put down the shovel, but that's a deep hole by now.

Further, just take a stroll through the Gen5 Forum and you will find there are a good number of folks that are holding on to their 5th Gens because they think GM took the Camaro in the wrong direction. So there's that as well.

As far as visibility, I've sold my share of Challengers, and taken enough Mustangs in trade that I can say the visibility difference between the three is negligible at best.

[Cherry]

I've seen a lot of 2019's here in central Virginia. I hardly see any 2016-2018

[396ssrat]

Originally Posted by MrChrisLS3

Well, I don't know, but could it be possible that the known issues with the A8 transmission got out to folks researching the Camaro, and went with a Mustang or Challenger to avoid an unfixable issue?

Then, they finally put the A10 in it. However, someone in the Ivory Tower said awesome, we fixed the transmission issue, now let's make it ugly as hell.

So now, in 2020, it looks like they put down the shovel, but that's a deep hole by now.

Further, just take a stroll through the Gen5 Forum and you will find there are a good number of folks that are holding on to their 5th Gens because they think GM took the Camaro in the wrong direction. So there's that as well.

As far as visibility, I've sold my share of Challengers, and taken enough Mustangs in trade that I can say the visibility difference between the three is negligible at best.

The'14 and 15 models were a vast improvement over the 10-13 models but the 5th gen overall are nowhere as good as the gen 6. As mentioned before the too low beltline could have been improved and would surely have appealed to more people. The A8 is typical of GM engineering where immediately finding a remedy and correcting each and every customer's
dissatisfaction within a reason able time frame is ignored. The results are failing sales. Just like the '07 to '13 Silverado, Sierra and the SUV's cracking dashes. That is 6 year models to correct a failed part. That leaves bitterness on a prospective future buyer and the word "quality" or lack thereof gets around.

[IOMCamaroSS]

Originally Posted by Number 3

Not this BS again. Mrs. Number 3 has a degree in marketing, was the marketing manager of Corvette (which Camaro volumes have fallen to) and with data that suggests there is no business case that says TV ad $ increases sales enough to pay for the ads.

Your degree was in what? You refer to Marketing 101? Oh and to be clear, advertising is a mere subset of marketing.

If I spend $20,000,000 to develop, film and buy air time for ads, how many more Camaros do I have to sell to break even?

And Camaro is not Coke. Everyone is a target for a Cola drink. A limited capacity coupe has a much more limited market. Mapuche more limited.

You don’t need to have a marketing degree or even be passionate about cars to know that GM’s ads suck. They’re some of the most boring, uninspiring ads on TV period. Whatever they’re spending on TV advertisements, they aren’t getting their money’s worth. I’ll give you that.

Dodge has great ads on social media as well. I never see anything exciting like that posted by Chevrolet or Chevrolet Performance for that matter. You simply cannot tell me that advertisement like that has NOTHING to do with Dodge continuing to put up respectable sales numbers with an ancient platform.

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by IOMCamaroSS

You don’t need to have a marketing degree or even be passionate about cars to know that GM’s ads suck. They’re some of the most boring, uninspiring ads on TV period. Whatever they’re spending on TV advertisements, they aren’t getting their money’s worth. I’ll give you that.

Dodge has great ads on social media as well. I never see anything exciting like that posted by Chevrolet or Chevrolet Performance for that matter. You simply cannot tell me that advertisement like that has NOTHING to do with Dodge continuing to put up respectable sales numbers with an ancient platform.

What works for Dodge doesn’t mean unit works for Chevy. Dodge has nothing to advertise except Challenger and Charger. An ancient Journey, nearly irrelevant Durango and a mini van.

I agree that a Camaro TV commercial could improve sales. But the issue is how many sales and would there be a positive NPV? This is where GM has all the data, analytics, survey data and knowledge. And simply if GM could make a bigger profit with a (or many) commercials we would have already seen them.

It’s just that simple. If GM spends $10,000,000 on a commercial and air time do they sell enough cars to make $11,000,000 more in profit. Otherwise they are just making commercials to make Camaro6 happy.

[CamaroSS50]

Originally Posted by Number 3

Sorry but no. You can’t sell a car with limitations that are only accepted by ravid Camaro fans to a market that wants versatility and usefulness. The issue isn’t that people that would never consider a Camaro don’t know about the Camaro. Those people do. What people seem to be believing here is that there are a bunch of people, that if they just knew tha Camaro existed by a TV commercial, would be lined up to buy Camaros. That, my friends, is simply not the case.

Clearly you're thinking is EXACTLY reflective of the current GM thinking, which is leading them to obsolescence.

I do not speak from an anecdotal position, I speak from actual experience.

So, yes, if GM focused on the positives of the Camaro, what it areas it performs better in, you bet your corporate ass it would move enough product to at least push Challenger back to #3.

[CamaroSS50]

Originally Posted by Number 3

What works for Dodge doesn’t mean unit works for Chevy. Dodge has nothing to advertise except Challenger and Charger. An ancient Journey, nearly irrelevant Durango and a mini van.

I agree that a Camaro TV commercial could improve sales. But the issue is how many sales and would there be a positive NPV? This is where GM has all the data, analytics, survey data and knowledge. And simply if GM could make a bigger profit with a (or many) commercials we would have already seen them.

It’s just that simple. If GM spends $10,000,000 on a commercial and air time do they sell enough cars to make $11,000,000 more in profit. Otherwise they are just making commercials to make Camaro6 happy.

$10M ad campaigns are a thing of the distant past.

1/10th of that would generate $11M in sales.

Not with the real people crap.

Stick to what you know, not what you don't.

[Need4Camaro]

Admittedly I love my 2SS and I have been buying Camaros and Firebirds since I was 18. I'm now 34 but admittedly I just bought a house and am becoming a bit more practical in decision making. I love my cars but I will admit my next car probably wont be a Camaro ... ... if I can manage to ignore that ZL1 itch.