I could use some help please

[15RS2NV]

I have the same engine in my '15, may be fuel filter.

I believe the fuel filter is in the tank with the fuel pump. If you drop the tank to change the filter, i'd recommend just going with a new pump. This way you only have to drop the tank once. Being how it'd lean on both banks i don't think it's an injector issue.

[Greenhornet2]

Try running it while watching your fuel trim and disconnecting your MAF. If it could be a MAF issue

[dtek]

Originally Posted by Greenhornet2

Try running it while watching your fuel trim and disconnecting your MAF. If it could be a MAF issue

I just replaced MAF last week


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[Greenhornet2]

Oh, sorry missed that.

[ariZona28]

Has anyone ever seen or changed a fuel filter on these vehicles? I have read plenty of speculation about one in the tank with the pump but I've never seen pics or read a filter replacement procedure. Since removal of the tank may be required you'll want to be sure this will fix your problem. You don't want to just be doing this for recreational maintenance. A few posts down from this one a fellow describes removing the tank or cutting an access hole in his floor. Good times.

[mikeman]

I had to replace a fuel pump on a '91 Z28 once and I did it by dropping the tank. It wasn't that hard and I didn't have to hack up the sheet metal under the hatch. I know the 5th gen is a little more complicated with the IRS, but I'd still drop the cradle to do it the right way. Just my $02.

[CamaroBarb]

You need to drive it with the fuel pressure gauge hooked up and compare it to what the scanner is telling the computer it is. They should match within reason. This will tell you if its just a bad sensor or fuel pump or if the high pressure pump is going bad. The fact both banks are lean says it something in the pumps or the pressure sensor.

[CamaroBarb]

This info is for 2010 but is close enough to explain how it all works.


2010 Camaro Fuel System Overview (thanks goes out to Alldata for the useful information)

The fuel system is an electronic returnless on-demand design. A returnless fuel system reduces the internal temperature of the fuel tank by not returning hot fuel from the engine to the fuel tank. Reducing the internal temperature of the fuel tank results in lower evaporative emissions.

An electric turbine style fuel pump attaches to the primary fuel pump module inside the fuel tank. The fuel pump supplies fuel through the fuel feed pipe to the high pressure fuel pump. The high pressure fuel pump supplies fuel to a variable-pressure fuel rail. Fuel enters the combustion chamber through precision multi-hole fuel injectors. The high pressure fuel pump, fuel rail pressure, fuel injection timing, and injection duration are controlled by the engine control module (ECM).

The primary fuel pump module also contains a primary jet pump and a secondary jet pump. Fuel pump flow loss, caused by vapor expulsion in the pump inlet chamber, is diverted to the primary jet pump and the secondary jet pump through a restrictive orifice located on the pump cover. The primary jet pump fills the reservoir of the primary fuel pump module. The secondary jet pump creates a venturi action which causes the fuel to be drawn from the secondary side of the fuel tank, through the fuel transfer pipe, to the primary side of the fuel tank.

Electronic Returnless Fuel System

The electronic returnless fuel system is a microprocessor controlled fuel delivery system which transports fuel from the tank to the fuel rail. It functions as an electronic replacement for a traditional, mechanical fuel pressure regulator. A pressure relief regulator valve within the fuel tank provides an added measure of over pressure protection. Desired fuel pressure is commanded by the engine control module (ECM), and transmitted to the fuel pump flow control module via a GMLAN serial data message. A liquid fuel pressure sensor provides the feedback the fuel pump flow control module requires for Closed Loop fuel pressure control.

Fuel Pump Flow Control Module

The fuel pump flow control module is a serviceable GMLAN module. The fuel pump flow control module receives the desired fuel pressure message from the engine control module (ECM) and controls the fuel pump located within the fuel tank to achieve the desired fuel pressure. The fuel pump flow control module sends a 25 KHz PWM signal to the fuel pump, and pump speed is changed by varying the duty cycle of this signal. Maximum current supplied to the fuel pump is 15 A. A liquid fuel pressure sensor provides fuel pressure feedback to the fuel pump flow control module.

Fuel Pressure Sensor

The fuel pressure sensor is a serviceable 5 V, 3-pin device. It is located on the fuel feed line forward of the fuel tank, and receives power and ground from the fuel pump flow control module through a vehicle wiring harness. The sensor provides a fuel pressure signal to the fuel pump flow control module, which is used to provide Closed Loop fuel pressure control.

Fuel Tank

The fuel tank stores the fuel supply. The fuel tank is located in the rear of the vehicle. The fuel tank is held in place by 2 metal straps that attach to the frame. The fuel tank is molded from high-density polyethylene.

The fuel tank is a saddle configuration in order to provide space for a driveshaft through the center area of the fuel tank. Because of the saddle shape of the tank, two fuel pump modules are required.

Fuel Fill Pipe

The fuel fill pipe has a built-in restrictor in order to prevent refueling with leaded fuel.

Fuel Filler Cap

The fuel fill pipe has a tethered fuel filler cap. A torque-limiting device prevents the cap from being over-tightened. To install the cap, turn the cap clockwise until you hear audible clicks. This indicates that the cap is correctly torqued and fully seated.

Fuel Pump Module

An electric turbine style fuel pump attaches to the primary fuel pump module inside the fuel tank. The fuel pump supplies fuel through the fuel feed pipe to the high pressure fuel pump. The fuel pump module contains a reverse flow check valve. The check valve maintains fuel pressure in the fuel feed pipe in order to prevent long cranking times.

Primary Fuel Pump Module

The primary fuel pump module is located inside of the right side of the fuel tank. The primary fuel pump module consists of the following major components:

* The fuel level sensor
* The fuel pump and reservoir assembly
* The fuel filter
* The pressure relief regulator valve
* The fuel strainer
* The primary jet pump
* The secondary jet pump

Secondary Fuel Pump Module

The secondary fuel pump module is located inside of the left side of the fuel tank. The secondary fuel pump module consists of the following major components:

* The fuel level sensor
* The fuel pick-up

Fuel Level Sensor

The fuel level sensor consists of a float, a wire float arm, and a ceramic resistor card. The position of the float arm indicates the fuel level. The fuel level sensor contains a variable resistor which changes resistance in correspondence with the position of the float arm. The engine control module (ECM) sends the fuel level information via the High Speed CAN-Bus to the body control module (BCM). The BCM then sends the fuel level percentage via the Low Speed CAN-Bus to the instrument cluster in order to control the fuel gauge. The control module monitors the signal circuits of the primary fuel level sensor and the secondary fuel level sensor in order to determine the fuel level.

Fuel Pump

The fuel pump is mounted in the fuel pump module reservoir. The fuel pump is an electric pump. Fuel is pumped to the high pressure fuel pump at a pressure that is based on feedback from the fuel pressure sensor. The fuel pump delivers a constant flow of fuel even during low fuel conditions and aggressive vehicle maneuvers. The fuel pump flex pipe acts to dampen the fuel pulses and noise generated by the fuel pump.

Fuel Filter

The fuel filter is located in the primary fuel pump module. The paper filter element traps particles in the fuel that may damage the fuel injection system. The filter housing is made to withstand maximum fuel system pressure, exposure to fuel additives, and changes in temperature.

Pressure Relief Regulator Valve

The pressure relief regulator valve replaces the typical fuel pressure regulator used on a mechanical returnless fuel system. The pressure relief regulator valve is closed during normal vehicle operation. The pressure relief regulator valve is used to vent pressure during hot soaks and also functions as a fuel pressure regulator in the event of the fuel pump flow control module defaulting to 100% pulse width modulation (PWM) of the fuel pump. Due to variation in the fuel system pressures, the opening pressure for the pressure relief regulator valve is set higher than the pressure that is used on a mechanical returnless fuel system pressure regulator.

Fuel Strainer

The fuel strainer attaches to the lower end of the primary fuel pump module. The fuel strainer is made of woven plastic. The functions of the fuel strainer are to filter contaminants and to wick fuel. The fuel strainer normally requires no maintenance. Fuel stoppage at this point indicates that the fuel tank contains an abnormal amount of sediment or contamination.

Primary and Secondary Jet Pumps

The primary jet pump is located in the primary fuel pump module. Fuel pump flow loss, caused by vapor expulsion in the pump inlet chamber, is diverted to the primary jet pump and the secondary jet pump through a restrictive orifice located on the pump cover. The primary jet pump fills the reservoir of the primary fuel pump module.

The secondary jet pump creates a venturi action which causes the fuel to be drawn from the secondary side of the fuel tank, through the transfer pipe, to the primary side of the fuel tank.

Fuel Feed Pipes

The low pressure fuel feed pipe carries fuel from the fuel tank to the high pressure fuel pump.

The fuel feed pipe assembly located in the engine compartment connects the chassis fuel pipe to the high pressure fuel pump. This pipe contains the fuel pulse dampener and the fuel pressure service valve, and is constructed of stainless steel.

The fuel feed intermediate pipe is a high pressure pipe that carries fuel from the high pressure fuel pump to the fuel rail. The fuel feed intermediate pipe is constructed of stainless steel.

Nylon Fuel Pipes

Warning

In order to reduce the risk of fire and personal injury observe the following items:

* Replace all nylon fuel pipes that are nicked, scratched or damaged during installation, do not attempt to repair the sections of the nylon fuel pipes
* Do not hammer directly on the fuel harness body clips when installing new fuel pipes. Damage to the nylon pipes may result in a fuel leak.
* Always cover nylon vapor pipes with a wet towel before using a torch near them. Also, never expose the vehicle to temperatures higher than 115°C (239°F) for more than one hour, or more than 90°C (194°F) for any extended period.
* Apply a few drops of clean engine oil to the male pipe ends before connecting fuel pipe fittings. This will ensure proper reconnection and prevent a possible fuel leak. (During normal operation, the O-rings located in the female connector will swell and may prevent proper reconnection if not lubricated.)

Nylon pipes are constructed to withstand maximum fuel system pressure, exposure to fuel additives, and changes in temperature.

Heat resistant rubber hose or corrugated plastic conduit protect the sections of the pipes that are exposed to chafing, high temperature, or vibration.

Nylon fuel pipes are somewhat flexible and can be formed around gradual turns under the vehicle. However, if nylon fuel pipes are forced into sharp bends, the pipes kink and restrict the fuel flow. Also, once exposed to fuel, nylon pipes may become stiffer and are more likely to kink if bent too far. Take special care when working on a vehicle with nylon fuel pipes.

Quick-Connect Fittings

Quick-connect fittings provide a simplified means of installing and connecting fuel system components. The fittings consist of a unique female connector and a compatible male pipe end. O-rings, located inside the female connector, provide the fuel seal. Integral locking tabs inside the female connector hold the fittings together.

High Pressure Fuel Pump

The high pressure fuel pump is a mechanical one-cylinder design driven by an additional three lobe cam on the exhaust camshaft of bank 2. High pressure fuel is regulated by the high pressure fuel pump actuator, which is a part of the high pressure fuel pump. The high pressure fuel pump actuator is a magnetic actuator which controls the inlet valve of the high pressure fuel pump. The ECM provides battery voltage on the actuator high control circuit and ground on the actuator low control circuit. Both circuits are controlled through output drivers within the ECM. When deactivated, both drivers are disabled and the inlet valve is held open with spring pressure. When activated, the actuator low control circuit driver connects the low control circuit to ground, and the actuator high control circuit driver pulse-width modulates the high control circuit. The ECM uses the camshaft and the crankshaft position sensor inputs to synchronize the actuator with the position of each of the three camshaft lobes. The ECM regulates fuel pressure by adjusting the portion of each pump stroke that provides fuel to the fuel rail. The high pressure fuel pump also contains an integrated pressure relief valve.

Fuel Rail Assembly

The fuel rail assembly attaches to each cylinder head. The fuel rail distributes high pressure fuel to the fuel injectors. The fuel rail assembly consists of the following components:

* The direct fuel injectors
* The fuel rail pressure sensor

Fuel Injectors

The fuel injection system is a high pressure, direct injection, returnless on-demand design. The fuel injectors are mounted in the cylinder head beneath the intake ports and spray fuel directly into the combustion chamber. Direct injection requires high fuel pressure due to the fuel injector's location in the combustion chamber. Fuel pressure must be higher than compression pressure requiring a high pressure fuel pump. The fuel injectors also require more electrical power due to the high fuel pressure. The ECM supplies a separate high voltage supply circuit and a high voltage control circuit for each fuel injector. The injector high voltage supply circuit and the high voltage control circuit are both controlled by the ECM. The ECM energizes each fuel injector by grounding the control circuit. The ECM controls each fuel injector with 65 V. This is controlled by a boost capacitor in the ECM. During the 65 V boost phase, the capacitor is discharged through an injector, allowing for initial injector opening. The injector is then held open with 12 V.

The fuel injector assembly is an inside opening electrical magnetic injector. The injector has six precision machined holes that generate a cone shaped oval spray pattern. The fuel injector has a slim extended tip in order to allow a sufficient cooling jacket in the cylinder head.

Fuel Injection Fuel Rail Fuel Pressure Sensor

The fuel rail pressure sensor detects fuel pressure within the fuel rail. The engine control module (ECM) provides a 5 V reference voltage on the 5 V reference circuit and ground on the low reference circuit. The ECM receives a varying signal voltage on the signal circuit. The ECM monitors the voltage on the fuel rail pressure sensor circuits. When the fuel pressure is high, the signal voltage is high. When the fuel pressure is low, the signal voltage is low.

Fuel Pulse Dampener

The fuel pulse dampener is a part of the low pressure fuel feed pipe assembly. The fuel pulse dampener is diaphragm-operated, with fuel pump pressure on one side and with spring pressure on the other side. The function of the dampener is to dampen the fuel pump pressure pulsations.

Engine Fueling

The engine is fueled by six individual injectors, one for each cylinder, that are controlled by the ECM. The ECM controls each injector by energizing the injector coil for a brief period once every other engine revolution. The length of this brief period, or pulse, is carefully calculated by the ECM to deliver the correct amount of fuel for proper driveability and emissions control. The period of time when the injector is energized is called the pulse width and is measured in milliseconds, thousandths of a second.

While the engine is running, the ECM is constantly monitoring the inputs and recalculating the appropriate pulse width for each injector. The pulse width calculation is based on the injector flow rate, mass of fuel the energized injector will pass per unit of time, the desired air/fuel ratio, and actual air mass in each cylinder, and is adjusted for battery voltage, short term, and long term fuel trim. The calculated pulse is timed to occur as each cylinders intake valves are closing to attain the largest duration and most vaporization.

Fueling during a crank is slightly different than fueling during an engine run. As the engine begins to turn, a prime pulse may be injected to speed starting. As soon as the ECM can determine where in the firing order the engine is, the ECM begins pulsing the injectors. The pulse width during the crank is based on the coolant temperature and the engine load.

The fueling system has several automatic adjustments in order to compensate for the differences in the fuel system hardware, the driving conditions, the fuel used, and the engine aging. The basis for the fuel control is the pulse width calculation that is described above. Included in this calculation are an adjustment for the battery voltage, the short term fuel trim, and the long term fuel trim. The battery voltage adjustment is necessary since the changes in the voltage across the injector affect the injector flow rate. The short term and the long term fuel trims are fine and coarse adjustments to the pulse width that are designed in order to maximize the driveability and emissions control. These fuel trims are based on the feedback from the oxygen sensors in the exhaust stream and are only used when the fuel control system is in a Closed Loop operation.

Under certain condition, the fueling system will turn OFF the injectors for a period of time. This is referred to as fuel shut-off. Fuel shut-off is used in order to improve traction, save fuel, improve emissions, and protect the vehicle under certain extreme or abusive conditions.

In case of a major internal problem, the ECM may be able to use a back-up fuel strategy for limp in mode that will run the engine until service can be performed.

Sequential Fuel Injection

The ECM controls the fuel injectors based on information that the ECM receives from several information sensors. Each injector is fired individually in the engine firing order, which is called sequential fuel injection. This allows precise fuel metering to each cylinder and improves the driveability under all of the driving conditions.

The ECM has several operating modes for fuel control, depending on the information that has been received from the sensors.

Starting Mode

When the ECM detects reference pulses from the crankshaft position sensor, the ECM will enable the fuel pump. The fuel pump runs and builds up pressure in the fuel system. The ECM then monitors the mass air flow (MAF), intake air temperature (IAT), engine coolant temperature (ECT), and the throttle position sensor signal in order to determine the required injector pulse width for starting.

Clear Flood Mode

If the engine is flooded with fuel during starting and will not start, the Clear Flood Mode can be manually selected. To select Clear Flood Mode, push the accelerator to wide open throttle (WOT). With this signal, the ECM will completely turn OFF the injectors and will maintain in this stage as long as the ECM indicates a WOT condition with engine speed below 1,000 RPM.

Run Mode

The run mode has 2 conditions called Open Loop and Closed Loop. When the engine is first started and the engine speed is above 480 RPM, the system goes into Open Loop operation. In Open Loop operation the ECM ignores the signals from the oxygen sensors and calculates the required fuel rail pressure and injector pulse width based primarily on inputs from the MAF, IAT, and ECT sensors.

In Closed Loop, the ECM adjusts the fuel rail pressure and injector pulse width for each bank of injectors based on the signals from each oxygen sensor.

Acceleration Mode

The ECM monitors the changes in the throttle position and the MAF sensor signals in order to determine when the vehicle is being accelerated. The ECM will then increase the fuel rail pressure and injector pulse width in order to provide more fuel for improved performance.

Deceleration Mode

The ECM monitors changes in the throttle position and MAF sensor signals to determine when the vehicle is being decelerated. The ECM will then decrease fuel rail pressure and injector pulse width or even shut-off injectors for short periods to reduce exhaust emissions, and for better, engine braking, deceleration.

Battery Voltage Correction Mode

The ECM can compensate in order to maintain acceptable vehicle driveability when the ECM sees a low battery voltage condition. The ECM compensates by performing the following functions:

* Increasing the injector pulse width in order to maintain the proper amount of fuel being delivered
* Increasing the idle speed to increase the generator output

Fuel Shut-Off Mode

The ECM has the ability to completely turn OFF all of the injectors or selectively turn OFF some of the injectors when certain conditions are met. These fuel shut-off modes allow the ECM to protect the engine from damage and also to improve the vehicles driveability.

The ECM will disable all of the six injectors under the following conditions:

* Ignition OFF-Prevents engine run-on
* Ignition ON but no crankshaft position signal-Prevents flooding or backfiring
* A high engine speed-Above the red line
* A high vehicle speed-Above the rated tire speed
* Closed throttle coast down-Reduces the emissions and increases engine braking.

The ECM will selectively disable the injectors under the following conditions:

* The torque management enabled-Transmission shifts or abusive maneuvers.
* The traction control enabled-In conjunction with the front brakes applying

[camguynj]

Originally Posted by TommyTheCat

Definitely sounds like a fuel pressure problem. You can still check the low pressure fuel pump to make it's not a problem, but more than likely the high pressure pump is going out.

Agree with what he ^^^ said. Seeing you're getting a P0191 maybe the fuel rail pressure sensor is bad and needs replacement. Relatively ez & inexpensive. If you're problem goes away if not and you still get a P0191 you'll know the problem is behind the sensor. Good luck.

[dtek]

Originally Posted by CamaroBarb

The fuel system in your car is complicated. I would recommend having a pro at least diagnose it. It could be as simple as changing out the pressure sensor. If you want to throw parts at it that maybe the 1st thing to try. I would check the o2s like mentioned above. Looks like from here the fuel pressure controller is failing or not seeing proper readings from the fuel pressure sender causing low fuel fuel pressure. You could check the connections at the fuel pressure controller, its mounted behind the pass side rear seat panel. Could also have a dirty fuel filter but its not serviceable on these cars as far as I know, I'd try a bottle of Thechron with only 5 gals of fuel so its strong, it may be enough to clean it out if that's the trouble.

I got some Tachron today, how do I use this stuff? I have to use it before filling up with gas?


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[GabrielLuke]

Yes, it happened to me. I was sitting with my wife in my truck in a parked car. We just stopped, so the truck was still running when completing its text message. Now I'm proud of my cars. The truck was 8 years old. I am the only owner. I know every brand of my truck. Indeed, it was the first wedge to honor my truck.

However, this money is parked next to me at Pontiac Grand Prix. As I turned off my engine, my truck suddenly shook from side to side with distinctive noise. My wife looks at me and asks me "what's wrong with your truck?" Conquered, I look to the side of my driver's mirror and see a car door stuck in my driver's back door. I mean a real tooth that is on board and about 6 inches tall. This kid (about 17 years old) closes the door and goes into Vape's shop as if nothing had happened. He immediately put me in a deep anger.

My wife and I go into the store and immediately ask, "That we only open the doors of the other cars and we do damage and act when nothing is wrong?" He asks if I don't think about what I'm talking about. I firmly recommend him sitting in my truck when he opened the passenger door directly in my truck. He said it was not possible and would be noticed if such action was taken. I then explained that there is a weight of 6,700 lbs on my truck and that the door is smaller than that. How can I shake my truck from the door without noticing?

I told him he had to pay. We will exchange numbers. I told him that I would get estimates and that I would contact him later so we could repair it. I did not feel that there was any need for insurance like the involvement of his parents. Just fix my teeth and my screw

[Dogmeat]

GabrielLuke…...man, your post really didn't make much sense at at all....?????

You mentioned a TOOTH in your door, and a door caught in your car......doesn't make ANY hot damn sense....wanna try to explain it a little better so IT CAN MAKE SENSE???

[Greenhornet2]

A lot of times when the high pressure pump fails it leaks. this leaks fuel into the oil. Does your oil smell like fuel and maybe overfull?

[miswebmailxyz]

Dude What A Story share some more insights if possible.

Originally Posted by GabrielLuke

Yes, it happened to me. I was sitting with my wife in my truck in a parked car. We just stopped, so the truck was still running when completing its text message. Now I'm proud of my cars. The truck was 8 years old. I am the only owner. I know every brand of my truck. Indeed, it was the first wedge to honor my truck.

Welcome! Here we will explain how EQ MIS Webmail helps you to access the educational data provided by the Australian Government for hardworking students.

However, this money is parked next to me at Pontiac Grand Prix. As I turned off my engine, my truck suddenly shook from side to side with distinctive noise. My wife looks at me and asks me "what's wrong with your truck?" Conquered, I look to the side of my driver's mirror and see a car door stuck in my driver's back door. I mean a real tooth that is on board and about 6 inches tall. This kid (about 17 years old) closes the door and goes into Vape's shop as if nothing had happened. He immediately put me in a deep anger. https://testedevelocidadeinternet.info/

My wife and I go into the store and immediately ask, "That we only open the doors of the other cars and we do damage and act when nothing is wrong?" He asks if I don't think about what I'm talking about. I firmly recommend him sitting in my truck when he opened the passenger door directly in my truck. He said it was not possible and would be noticed if such action was taken. I then explained that there is a weight of 6,700 lbs on my truck and that the door is smaller than that. How can I shake my truck from the door without noticing?

I told him he had to pay. We will exchange numbers. I told him that I would get estimates and that I would contact him later so we could repair it. I did not feel that there was any need for insurance like the involvement of his parents. Just fix my teeth and my screw