[Number 3]

Originally Posted by 396ssrat

Yes, gm will tell you what you want, not ask you. Cars like the Vega, the Cimarron and the Pontiac Aztec. Now it's going to be another car the established car enthusiast is just screaming for, the gm Appliance.
gm has established itself as a dishonest, sell it and forget it it, one time buyer company. Sorry, all of the people with cracked dashes, faulty 8 speed automatic transmissions and the disastrous lifter debacle which purchaser's aren't very happy with will surely make future car buyer want to flock to the gm nightmare program. I assure you, when you plant the seed of doubt and abandonment into a customer you sell other brands very well. History repeats itself, just take a look at when the imports found their way across the ocean to American customers. The big three did that all by themselves. I'm hearing most car enthusiasts say they love their v8 engines. gm is simply being complicit with the green new deal farce.

A lot of good in your post until your use of the word complicit. Am I complicit in the green new deal because I pick up other peoples trash on a walk? Am I complicit because I agree we need to start doing something now for our environment because even though today may not be the day but that day is coming? Is anyone that does something good for the environment now complicit in your eyes? I hope the rational person in you says no, that’s not really what you mean.

[BlaqWhole]

It would be suicide. Literally. The Big Three right now, together, in unison, are the ONLY things keeping V8 RWD high powered gasoline cars alive right now. If even one of them were to meet their demise then that would be a fatal blow to the industry. And right now as it is the industry is on it's dying breath and hanging by a string that is already lit on fire. So if Frod wants to be a bunch of idiots then by all means go right ahead. Threatening to kill off the Camaro would be like standing in a room full of gasoline with someone while holding a match and threatening to kill them by lighting it.

Frod just talking smack. Let them kill off the Camaro. We'll all just end up in EVs like 10 years sooner than expected.

[s2mikey]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

It would be suicide. Literally. The Big Three right now, together, in unison, are the ONLY things keeping V8 RWD high powered gasoline cars alive right now. If even one of them were to meet their demise then that would be a fatal blow to the industry. And right now as it is the industry is on it's dying breath and hanging by a string that is already lit on fire. So if Frod wants to be a bunch of idiots then by all means go right ahead. Threatening to kill off the Camaro would be like standing in a room full of gasoline with someone while holding a match and threatening to kill them by lighting it.

Frod just talking smack. Let them kill off the Camaro. We'll all just end up in EVs like 10 years sooner than expected.

I agree here - as goes one of the big three, so does the others eventually. I just dont see why there cant be some EVs and some gas cars for those that want them or need them? Why does it have to be so extreme as in we have to all end up in two-seater battery powered bubbles in 20 years or less? Cant we have both types of vehicles to serve the needs/desires of ALL drivers?

Or, like seemingly everything else now it has to be 100% my way or the highway type of thing. Geesh. Theres profit to be made on gas cars so that angle about profitability isnt going to work here. Just crazy.

Originally Posted by 396ssrat

Even a 283 2bbl triggers liberals.

Thats pretty funny, actually. It doesnt take much, does it?

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by s2mikey

I agree here - as goes one of the big three, so does the others eventually. I just dont see why there cant be some EVs and some gas cars for those that want them or need them? Why does it have to be so extreme as in we have to all end up in two-seater battery powered bubbles in 20 years or less? Cant we have both types of vehicles to serve the needs/desires of ALL drivers?

Or, like seemingly everything else now it has to be 100% my way or the highway type of thing. Geesh. Theres profit to be made on gas cars so that angle about profitability isnt going to work here. Just crazy.


Thats pretty funny, actually. It doesnt take much, does it?

That is exactly what we should expect to see for the next 20-30 years. We’re not gonna just wake up in 2035 and all the ICE vehicles are gone. Thing is, most ICE vehicles that will be left will have some form of electric assist. Over time, there will be more BEV than anything else. That’s probably in the 2040-ish timeframe, when most of us on this site today will be racing wheelchairs in some retirement home. That or looking up at the lawn.

[LT4Greg]

If everyone thinks that all the countries in this world will follow our lead going total EV by 2040 or whenever then we are in for a rude awakening in the USA! That’s all I have to say about that topic.

[s2mikey]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

That is exactly what we should expect to see for the next 20-30 years. We’re not gonna just wake up in 2035 and all the ICE vehicles are gone. Thing is, most ICE vehicles that will be left will have some form of electric assist. Over time, there will be more BEV than anything else. That’s probably in the 2040-ish timeframe, when most of us on this site today will be racing wheelchairs in some retirement up. That or looking up at the lawn.

Yep - great points here. Just cant believe anyone thinks some switch is going to get flipped and poof: Everyone changes to a Nissan Leaf. C'mon....

[Tran]

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[90503]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

That is exactly what we should expect to see for the next 20-30 years. We’re not gonna just wake up in 2035 and all the ICE vehicles are gone. Thing is, most ICE vehicles that will be left will have some form of electric assist. Over time, there will be more BEV than anything else. That’s probably in the 2040-ish timeframe, when most of us on this site today will be racing wheelchairs in some retirement up. That or looking up at the lawn.

If this 2035 end of ICE production stays on track, the closer we get to 2035 the fewer and fewer ICE choices there will be. I can't imagine having several remaining and popular(?) ICE models just come to a screeching halt in 2035 in favor of EVs.

Probably right now are the salad days for one or the other. Either ICE will taper off to nothing over the next few years, or perhaps some may stay longer than 2035.

If the powers that be make ICE and gasoline overly burdensome and arbitrarily impossible to own and use as we near 2035, then there may be some serious pushback against the obvious ploy to keep up the facade that we have a choice of some kind.

[Hops]

Originally Posted by 90503

If this 2035 end of ICE production stays on track, the closer we get to 2035 the fewer and fewer ICE choices there will be. I can't imagine having several remaining and popular(?) ICE models just come to a screeching halt in 2035 in favor of EVs.

Probably right now are the salad days for one or the other. Either ICE will taper off to nothing over the next few years, or perhaps some may stay longer than 2035.

If the powers that be make ICE and gasoline overly burdensome and arbitrarily impossible to own and use as we near 2035, then there may be some serious pushback against the obvious ploy to keep up the facade that we have a choice of some kind.

Porsche's CEO Oliver Blume has said the 911 will be ICE for a long time.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...g-time-if-ever


I really hope Porsche synthetic fuel plant is Chile is a success!

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by LT4Greg

If everyone thinks that all the countries in this world will follow our lead going total EV by 2040 or whenever then we are in for a rude awakening in the USA! That’s all I have to say about that topic.

Lol, actually, it's the other way around. We're not the ones making the rules kid. And yes, we will follow THEIR lead if manufacturers want to remain profitable in a global market. Open your eyes. Because it sounds like you're the one who's in for a rude awakening.

[hotlap]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

That is exactly what we should expect to see for the next 20-30 years. We’re not gonna just wake up in 2035 and all the ICE vehicles are gone. Thing is, most ICE vehicles that will be left will have some form of electric assist. Over time, there will be more BEV than anything else. That’s probably in the 2040-ish timeframe, when most of us on this site today will be racing wheelchairs in some retirement up. That or looking up at the lawn.

If I'm lucky, I'll live another 30 years +/-5. I'll transition out of the workforce in 7 to 9.

My quandary is will I be allowed to operate ICE in its current form. Many EU cities restrict what types (emission level) can be operated in cities now. If I keep my Aplha Camaro, will its operation be severely restricted? If I (as I planned) buy a 1970 Chevelle SS, will I be allowed to drive it.

Saying ICE with electric assist will remain past 2030 doesn't mean our current cars won't be forced off the road. I've mentioned before, California already has done this with diesel engines where they forced pre 2010 out of the state.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by LT4Greg

If everyone thinks that all the countries in this world will follow our lead going total EV by 2040 or whenever then we are in for a rude awakening in the USA! That’s all I have to say about that topic.

The real rude awakening is that they are all 2-3 years ahead of the US in making the switch.

[BlaqWhole]

Originally Posted by Number 3

A lot of good in your post until your use of the word complicit. Am I complicit in the green new deal because I pick up other peoples trash on a walk? Am I complicit because I agree we need to start doing something now for our environment because even though today may not be the day but that day is coming? Is anyone that does something good for the environment now complicit in your eyes? I hope the rational person in you says no, that’s not really what you mean.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. In college it was mentioned to my class that we are facing overpopulation in 50 years. That was 16 years ago. And the population has increased faster than what was predicted back then. We're facing overpopulation probably in 20 years if not sooner. Trust me. So eventually mass transit will HAVE to take over. And there will HAVE to be new ways to live efficiently and without using up resources. Or we'll need an extinction level event. As much as I love ICE vehicles and the engines and all that crap, I much better like living in breathable air and having drinkable water at my disposal and being able to turn on lights and not living in 20 story apartment buildings like they have to do in New York City and not having to wait for a green light just to have 900 people cross the street with me like in Asian countries. I exaggerate but it is a bleak future if we don't do something now. We've had our fun with gas engines for over a century now. But it's time to think ahead and start worrying about the future. Otherwise we'll all be walking around with respirators and full body hazard suits just to go to the grocery store. Or we'll be living underground and walking thru corridors with filtered air being pumped thru because the environment will be too polluted.

Originally Posted by s2mikey

I agree here - as goes one of the big three, so does the others eventually. I just dont see why there cant be some EVs and some gas cars for those that want them or need them? Why does it have to be so extreme as in we have to all end up in two-seater battery powered bubbles in 20 years or less? Cant we have both types of vehicles to serve the needs/desires of ALL drivers?

Or, like seemingly everything else now it has to be 100% my way or the highway type of thing. Geesh. Theres profit to be made on gas cars so that angle about profitability isnt going to work here. Just crazy.

I wish it were possible to have ICE for some and EV for others. I just don't see how it is possible. Newer tech will always push out older tech. Even if manufacturers did try to do this, at some point it will be too expensive to do both and they'll have to pick one over the other. And they will pick EV. Because think about it, instead of spending money to build 2 completely different types of engines, it would be much more efficient to just build one type. ICE have had their rule for a long time. Just like the dinosaurs...pun intended. But the meteor is heading towards the ICE planet and out of the destruction EV will emerge. And in another few decades there will be some fancy new way to transport people.

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

The real rude awakening is that they are all 2-3 years ahead of the US in making the switch.

I think we're much further behind than that. America is not in the lead.

I remember a movie in which the villain says something to the effect of "Americans can't fathom a world in which they are not two steps ahead of everyone else". Of course the villlain ended up losing because writers and movies and fiction but what he said is true.

[redcoats1976]

i thought the covid was supposed to take care of overpopulation...