[cdrptrks]

I would be worried about possibility causing unwanted airbag deployment or unpredictable traction/stability control results during an autocross if running with disconnected wheel speed sensors.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by cdrptrks

I would be worried about possibility causing unwanted airbag deployment or unpredictable traction/stability control results during an autocross if running with disconnected wheel speed sensors.

Autocross is arguably the best and safest environment for testing this. I can't see how Stabilitrak would be any better equipped than ABS to know how fast one or more wheels with disconnected sensors would be turning, so that it could make the right call for any of the brakes. ABS takes itself offline (and throws a light/code).


Norm

[rotis]

IIRC reference vehicle speed is based on the second fastest wheel when accelerating, and the second slowest wheel when braking. This is part of the reason you can get a speed error-related hard pedal when going directly from wheelspin to brakes. In an instant it sees all four wheels turning significantly slower than the reference vehicle speed, assumes that all four tires are sliding, and tries to cope accordingly.

From a mechanical and hydraulic perspective, the rear brakes are massively overpowered. The electronic brake proportioning valve is required in order to maintain sane brake bias. If you somehow disable the ABS unit (via fuse pull or otherwise) you are going to have a severe bias problem.

[AND0]

Mustangs do not have this problem.......

[BlueinTN]

Originally Posted by rotis

IIRC reference vehicle speed is based on the second fastest wheel when accelerating, and the second slowest wheel when braking. This is part of the reason you can get a speed error-related hard pedal when going directly from wheelspin to brakes. In an instant it sees all four wheels turning significantly slower than the reference vehicle speed, assumes that all four tires are sliding, and tries to cope accordingly.

From a mechanical and hydraulic perspective, the rear brakes are massively overpowered. The electronic brake proportioning valve is required in order to maintain sane brake bias. If you somehow disable the ABS unit (via fuse pull or otherwise) you are going to have a severe bias problem.

Yeah my small experience with "everything off" on a modern ABS car is its undriveable at any kind of limit due to skewed brake bias.


Purple wire mod is what was called in the Dodge LX/LC platform. it turns the YAW sensor off faulting out all the electronic nannies.

[Cito]

So, exactly how hard is it to switch out the ABS module?

[Chris V]

Originally Posted by Cito

So, exactly how hard is it to switch out the ABS module?

Remove the cowl, pry off the factory computer, install 2019 computer from a car with the same brake configuration, reinstall cowl.

The hard part is getting the 2019 computer.

[94boosted]

Originally Posted by vtirocz

Couple questions:

Who's Ryan O.?

Do you have a link to the '19 SS 1LE with ice mode complaint?

See: https://www.camaro6.com/forums/showp...4&postcount=43

The complaints of a 2019 SS 1LE also getting ice mode at a recent autocross event is here: https://www.roadraceautox.com/showth...eet-now/page39 See post #1936

[LJenkins1LE]

Originally Posted by AND0

Mustangs do not have this problem.......

Yes they do.

[rotis]

Originally Posted by LJenkins1LE

Yes they do.

Negative. They do not have a problem with anywhere near this severity. I just drove a 2018 GTPP this weekend and went through a section that would 100% guarantee hard pedal in my SS. Slightly sideways, exiting a fast offset with wheelspin, and going straight to the brakes while still countersteering. The brakes worked perfectly.

Ford goes out of their way to say the Performance Pack cars have a different ABS calibration, so maybe they just did a good job with those. No idea how the brakes on a base model are, not really a concern of mine.

[LJenkins1LE]

Originally Posted by rotis

Negative. They do not have a problem with anywhere near this severity. I just drove a 2018 GTPP this weekend and went through a section that would 100% guarantee hard pedal in my SS. Slightly sideways, exiting a fast offset with wheelspin, and going straight to the brakes while still countersteering. The brakes worked perfectly.

Ford goes out of their way to say the Performance Pack cars have a different ABS calibration, so maybe they just did a good job with those. No idea how the brakes on a base model are, not really a concern of mine.

Just because you drove one that didn’t, doesn’t mean they don’t. I never experience ice mode with my 1LE and apparently it happens. I have a buddy in my region that gets ice mode just as much as everyone here in his ‘17GTPP. So yes, Mustangs experience ice mode as well.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by rotis

Negative. They do not have a problem with anywhere near this severity. I just drove a 2018 GTPP this weekend and went through a section that would 100% guarantee hard pedal in my SS. Slightly sideways, exiting a fast offset with wheelspin, and going straight to the brakes while still countersteering. The brakes worked perfectly.

Ford goes out of their way to say the Performance Pack cars have a different ABS calibration, so maybe they just did a good job with those. No idea how the brakes on a base model are, not really a concern of mine.

Ford has had more track-capable ABS modules available since the S197 days. With the earlier years you swapped the module, and since Ford had intended it for the race cars (FR500, Grand Am Cup) if you ran it on a street model the dash lit up like it was Christmas.


I don't know anything about ABS in the S550, but I've had it (stock module) take itself offline in my S197 during a track session - I have no idea why - and remain offline for the entire following session. The quickest two and top 3 of 4 laps that day were with ABS inop, although lap times with ABS were slightly more consistent. I did manage to lock up a RR once after making a rather late pass (going into right-hand T1 @ NJMP/Lightning). After a few more start/shutdown cycles ABS functionality seemed to have returned (the ABS light went out, anyway).


Norm

[rotis]

Originally Posted by LJenkins1LE

Just because you drove one that didn’t, doesn’t mean they don’t. I never experience ice mode with my 1LE and apparently it happens. I have a buddy in my region that gets ice mode just as much as everyone here in his ‘17GTPP. So yes, Mustangs experience ice mode as well.

Your 18 1LE has a more robust calibration than a SS. A 2019 1LE has a better calibration than yours, and a ZL1-1LE has a better calibration than both.

Does your friend with the 17GTPP have stock pads? If he doesn't, tell him to install them. The only GTPPs I've driven that had hard pedal issues were on aftermarket pads. Can't blame Ford for that.

[LJenkins1LE]

Originally Posted by rotis

Your 18 1LE has a more robust calibration than a SS. A 2019 1LE has a better calibration than yours, and a ZL1-1LE has a better calibration than both.

Does your friend with the 17GTPP have stock pads? If he doesn't, tell him to install them. The only GTPPs I've driven that had hard pedal issues were on aftermarket pads. Can't blame Ford for that.

Stock pads.