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BeckyD @ James Martin Chevy


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Old 11-01-2018, 07:42 PM   #1
GT in KC
 
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Tire data for cold, but dry pavement.

I think it is interesting that what were called snow tires decades ago are now broadly called winter tires, and every comparison between these and an otherwise excellent all season performance tire are only on snow or ice, and never on cold, yet dry pavement... I think this demonstrates the marketing and financial power of the tire manufacturers over automotive news and media outlets.

Where is the tire test data measuring performance of winter vs. all-season tires on very cold, but very dry, pavement? I haven't found much.

I don't ever drive my high hp cars when there is snow or ice on the road. I don't have to. I do like to take them out on sub-zero days when it is sunny and the roads are dry. For these, I switch from ultra high performance summer tires to performance all seasons. They can't handle the power no matter what the season, but at least I can safely piddle around on cold sunny days.

In my sedans, when I do a seat of the pants, quasi measured braking comparison between a premium winter tire and a premium all-season tire on cold pavement (on the day I switch), the all season is no worse than the winter tire. For this reason, I don't bother with winter/snow tires on my sports cars.

So back to my question:

Is there any reliable, controlled data measuring the performance of winter vs. all-season tires on very cold, but very dry, pavement?

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Old 11-02-2018, 07:20 AM   #2
Alpha1BC

 
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In the conditions you describe, no you probably won't notice much of a difference between winter tires vs. an all season that can handle low temperatures unless you start taking actual data measurements.

The benefit of winter tires is that they're much more capable in winter conditions outside of dry. The rubber compounds on winter tires stay soft in cold temperatures when all-seasons would typically harden up which carries more of an impact when there's a low surface mu (i.e. wet, snow, and/or ice). Not that you can't run all-seasons during the winter, but they won't match a winter tire's performance in a non-dry condition.

There should even be a slight benefit to having winter tires in a cold and dry condition just due to the fact that the rubber stays softer, but it would take someone with a more sensitive seat-of-the-pants feeling or actual data to show it.
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Old 11-02-2018, 08:26 AM   #3
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I think this is a very good question, but I've never seen such data. I often hear it said that winter tires are better than all seasons in dry conditions below ~41-45F/5-7C, but I'm not sure if I believe it is at that temperature. That said winter tires have improved a lot for dry conditions in the last ~10-15 years. Similar things have been said of all season vs. summers. Again, I'm sure there is a point where the all seasons are better, but I'm not sure that it's at 45F. This isn't the same use case, but I know 200TW tires still have very significant grip on the track at those temperatures.
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Old 11-02-2018, 09:13 AM   #4
DaveC113

 
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I'd agree it probably depends on temps.

That said, there are big differences between snow tires. Performance snows like the Michelin PA4 perform unbelievably well on cold, dry pavement and still do well in the snow, maybe not quite at Michelin XIce levels but they are still very good.
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