Electric Vehicles

[bigd1276]

Can you fit two sets of golf clubs in the trunk of your snowblower?

[CalgaryZL1]

OK I didn’t mean to touch a nerve, but at up -22f for 6 months, a daily driver it is not. Range is realistically down to 40% from brand new with everything else running to try and keep you alive

[CalgaryZL1]

Originally Posted by bigd1276

Can you fit two sets of golf clubs in the trunk of your snowblower?

Sorry No and also not in my Camaro unless my seat is down which doesn’t make it the trunk It makes it the cab.

[Wyzz Kydd]

Evidently the Chairman of Toyota agrees with me.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/comp...vs/ar-AA1iP5Rt

[0stones0]

Originally Posted by CalgaryZL1

That’s my point

Sorry, missed the sarcasm…my bad.

[Martinjlm]

Very well stated. I’ll just touch on a couple points…

Originally Posted by el ess A

It's standard procdure to subsidize "new" technology's start-up costs. For how long and how much is the big question. I'm ok with it as long as it's responsibly done and not just to line pockets.

At some point the teat suckers have to be pulled off the money spigot and stand on their own, though. When that occurs will be determined later, apparently. That will be the major test. Why can't the OEMs just be told something like "Hey, by 2028, all EV subsidies will evaporate, so you need to have your shit together by then." Just throw out any arbitrary date and stick to it. They do it with everything else.

Every incentive plan that has been associated with hybrids or EVs has had a sunset provision. For the first plan involving “electrified vehicles” (applied to hybrids and the earliest EVs) it was after the OEM had achieved 200,000 vehicles in market and then stepped down to zero incentive. The incentive went to the vehicle purchaser, not the OEM but some OEMs found ways to finagle pricing to ensure they got some benefit. The current incentive plan, again targeted to the vehicle purchaser, not the OEM, has a sunset of 2032 and has set strict guidelines on the price of the vehicle, the income of the purchaser, and the location of manufacture for the vehicle and the battery to ensure jobs in the US.

Originally Posted by el ess A

GM's touting a big profits this week, so if that continues for them and other OEMs, subsidies should start to dwindle. But I'm guessing they won't. I mean, as the story goes, it was THEIR OWN DECISION, without any external pressures, to go this route, right? So let them pay for it as their profits rise.

It was GM’s decision, but with significant pressure. Whether we call the pressure external depends on whether external means external to the company or external to the industry. The pressure came (and continues to come) from other manufacturers who have been grabbing market share rapidly in other geographic regions. The “grab” started in the luxury markets. BMW and Mercedes in particular have taken huge hits in China (largest market) and Europe (second largest market) and all indications are that the market grab is already shifting to lower priced market. GM’s position is apparently that at some point you have to take these threats on directly, so they’re doing it sooner rather than later.

Add to that the aggressive moves by countries and companies to pledge alignment with Carbon Neutrality and the answer pretty much forms itself.

Originally Posted by el ess A

Will EVs actually cost less than ICE vehicles? Can they out and out be a drop-in replacement our favorite ICE vehicles? I'm sure that's one goal, but right now, no friggin' way. Eventually, depending on advances in technology, they likely might. This isn't going to happen overnight like some that spend our tax money like a drunken sailor think it will. No flick of the switch will make it happen fast.

Nothing to add here. You nailed it.

Originally Posted by el ess A

Even though there are lots of EVs sold already, what they're don't tell you are the stories of real people owning them and some of the issues they have with them and things to be aware of. They only want to show you the pros without any cons. There needs to be a learning curve of owning/maintaining an EV just like the switch from RWD to FWD many years ago. And be prepared that if your car breaks, you may be waiting for repair parts whether it's gas, diesel, or EV.

I wish the OEMs well in their future endeavors. I'm choosing not to participate in their new adventures until they twist arms and force me to, which is more likely than not. It's not because I have anything against EVs themselves. I just am not a fan of how they're doing all this to satisfy someone else's agenda based on...well, nothing really tangible IMO.

Thing is, it has become their agenda. The primary goal of any profit making venture is to deliver shareholder value. It is clear to the majority of the major companies that the best path to best shareholder value is development of a comprehensive battery electric vehicle portfolio. And that’s what they are all doing. Even Toyota.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by Wyzz Kydd

Evidently the Chairman of Toyota agrees with me.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/comp...vs/ar-AA1iP5Rt

Even in the article you posted it is noted that he (grandson of the founder) stepped down as President and CEO after 14 years at the job. https://voonze.com/lexus-chief-execu...randson-quits/ That is the Japanese polite way of saying the board removed him because he was too dug in on not making the shift to electric. President and CEO are the positions in a company that execute the corporate strategy. Mary Barra, whom you all know and love is the CEO. She’s the one executing strategy. The Board’s position is to set the strategy, not execute it. They don’t always have to agree. In the meantime, Toyota has already laid out a broad portfolio of EVs to come and have all but said Lexus will transition to being 100% electric. Their preference would be to slow the implementation to milk profits from the hybrid portfolio and to give them time to catch up on EV technology.

[Martinjlm]

Here’s what’s got all the Toyota fans drooling. I might even have to replace my MR2 if this ever lands. Naw…but I would add this to the garage. https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a4...oncept-teaser/

[el ess A]

Originally Posted by CalgaryZL1

Sorry No and also not in my Camaro unless my seat is down which doesn’t make it the trunk It makes it the cab.

Grind them up with the snow blower. Trust me, they'll fit in the Camaro then.

[el ess A]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

Here’s what’s got all the Toyota fans drooling. I might even have to replace my MR2 if this ever lands. Naw…but I would add this to the garage. https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a4...oncept-teaser/

Dang! Someone could cut themselves on all those sharp edges just polishing the car! I'm guessing with that many sharp edges it is likely composite body panels vs metal?

[genxer]

I can't be the only one that saw that name and read it as Footsie.

[DevilsReject97]

I won't go the EV route unless I literally have money to burn because I just don't think it's practical or good for the environment. I realize that I may be in the minority but that is what it is...

Would much rather see us (USA) going this route personally...

[jamala00]

Originally Posted by DevilsReject97

I won't go the EV route unless I literally have money to burn because I just don't think it's practical or good for the environment. I realize that I may be in the minority but that is what it is...

You most certainly are not in the minority, you are in the majority of people who don't believe EV is the right choice.

[genxer]

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/new-y...130040140.html

"Respondents also had strong preferences for which automakers they would consider purchasing an electric vehicle from if they were to do so. Nearly one-third (30%) would most likely consider Toyota (TM) as their top choice for an electric vehicle, followed by Tesla (TSLA) at 23%, Honda (HMC) at 20%, GM (GM) with 15%, and Ford (F) at 14%."