[Raven87]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

I don't know about that....I think it's healthy and educational to compare the two and let people learn what those differences are. That sort of thing is how I learned that I preferred good-handling cars to high-hp cars.

With a set of Sport Cup tires (or similar), it's entirely possible that the ZL1 could keep up with a Grand Sport around a track...at least that's what the numbers suggest...so in terms of performance, we're not talking about different leagues...

But they're both going to feel dramatically different, because they go about it differently.

Thank you for agreeing that the cars are vastly different. You can compare them all day long but they are so different in so many ways that IMO they are not 'competitors'.

They GS is a much more fit for purpose vehicle than the ZL1 is, it's almost like comparing the Z/28 to a ZL1 - two completely different platforms with different goals.

The same goes for the GS vs the ZL1. A 2 seater sports car that is very track focused vs a 4 seater pony car that does everything damn well and we won't even discuss the dimensional, weight, and overall body design differences.

Can either lay down a great lap at VIR? No doubt. Performance-wise, yes, they are close in ability. But the comparisons end there IMO.

[Fred25]

Easy comparison and choice. Camaro head and leg room. Corvette a shrinking violet for short people. ZL1 only.

[pdiddy972]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

Maybe...but real world is tough because it varies so much from place to place. I know I can't get that much off a Z06 around here...and certainly not if I ordered one.

You could buy your Z06 at Kerbeck or MacMulkin and get a lot off of MSRP and have it shipped straight to you.
http://kerbeck.com/new-corvette-inventory/

Z06's in the list are all $6,000-$9,000 below MSRP, depending on options.

And, yes, you can get those prices even on an order. Those guys have allocations all the time.

[formoutofchaos]

The corvette feels like a fighter pilot the camaro a fast tank , the visceral experience of the open window and top off not many cars can give you that feel . The essence of the GS is the z51 slap those pilots on and you will be close to the GS. There are some GS for 59k on macmulkin.

Every track I was at the guys w the zo6 had to cool off after three laps I wouldn't buy a zo6

I mean the manual zl1 prob runs a 3.7 and 11.7 numbers a z51 could achieve with cam , headers etc and the GS would be right there .

The zl1 is super beast if u like the small
View vs the vette a fighter pilot view

[17CamaroZL1]

Originally Posted by formoutofchaos

Every track I was at the guys w the zo6 had to cool off after three laps I wouldn't buy a zo6

The new Z06 should do better. They added additional cooling that the ZL1 has. A new supercharger cover and at least 1 additional heat exchanger.

[2cnd chance]

Originally Posted by Fred25

Easy comparison and choice. Camaro head and leg room. Corvette a shrinking violet for short people. ZL1 only.

Oh yeah??? I'm 6'3" 220 and I fit perfect in my GS (comp, seats). I don't even have the seat all the way back.

[2cnd chance]

Originally Posted by Raven87

Thank you for agreeing that the cars are vastly different. You can compare them all day long but they are so different in so many ways that IMO they are not 'competitors'.

They GS is a much more fit for purpose vehicle than the ZL1 is, it's almost like comparing the Z/28 to a ZL1 - two completely different platforms with different goals.

The same goes for the GS vs the ZL1. A 2 seater sports car that is very track focused vs a 4 seater pony car that does everything damn well and we won't even discuss the dimensional, weight, and overall body design differences.

Can either lay down a great lap at VIR? No doubt. Performance-wise, yes, they are close in ability. But the comparisons end there IMO.

I think the comparisons are only based on the fact that they're both performance cars with a comparable price.

I'd say go drive them for a very different experience.

[COmaro]

Originally Posted by pdiddy972

You could buy your Z06 at Kerbeck or MacMulkin and get a lot off of MSRP and have it shipped straight to you.
http://kerbeck.com/new-corvette-inventory/

Z06's in the list are all $6,000-$9,000 below MSRP, depending on options.

And, yes, you can get those prices even on an order. Those guys have allocations all the time.

Looking at the Grand Sports, they list them for about $58K, up to about $70K. I'd love a Grand Sport. I may have to shop around in a couple of years when they hit $40K or so.

I noticed none of the 1LT Grand Sports have the PDR. I guess you must go to 2LT to get that option? Also, sadly, about 85% of them are automatics.

[pdiddy972]

Originally Posted by COmaro

Looking at the Grand Sports, they list them for about $58K, up to about $70K. I'd love a Grand Sport. I may have to shop around in a couple of years when they hit $40K or so.

I noticed none of the 1LT Grand Sports have the PDR. I guess you must go to 2LT to get that option? Also, sadly, about 85% of them are automatics.

Agreed - if I get a Vette it would have to be the manual (though I prefer a 6-speed to the 7-speed the Vettes come with). There's no way I'd get the A8 in the Vette - tons of issues with them since 2015 and still not fixed by GM.

[speeddemonta]

I am enjoying all the responses from the forum.

Am wondering if the 2017 Camaro ZL1 will have an influence on the 2017 Corvette Grand Sport sales? I feel they ALMOST are in direct competition with each other - while the Corvette ZO6 has the same horsepower as the ZL1 the ZO6 costs quite a bit more.

When reviewing the specs, the ZL1 is not as expensive, is faster [0-60 mph, & 1/4 mile] and is rated at 1.02 g's which is almost the same as the G.S. without the Z07 performance package. To me, it seems that the ZL1 MIGHT be the better value. I do realize that there are also subjective areas to consider i.e., exterior and interior styling/size, perceived comfort/ride, brand value [Corvette verses Camaro], etc.

I am hoping that one of the major publications does a head-to-head comparison.

For me, 'the jury is still out'. However, it sure is a fun decision to make. Keep the responses coming!

[10spd]

Originally Posted by speeddemonta

I am enjoying all the responses from the forum.

Am wondering if the 2017 Camaro ZL1 will have an influence on the 2017 Corvette Grand Sport sales?

I love the C7 Corvette and has been following the C7 closely. At the moment, I just don't really have confidence in the C7 platform. Here is why.

- There seems to be lots of fit, finish and paint issues.

- A number of LT1 motors failed. Car & Driver alone encountered two IIRC.

- Finally they acknowledged the overheating problem with the Z06 and is implementing a redesigned cooling system. The early adapters might be SOL though.

- Just like I remember Tadge Juechter said in an interview that the LT1 has so much torque that the 6 speed automatic was sufficient and 8 gears are not necessary. Then the 8 speed auto came out a year after.

None of the above inspire much confidence and one has to wonder what other problems might be lurking.

It is unfortunate that I likely won't be able to get a 2017 ZL1 allocation here in Canada. Will I consider the Grand Sport as an alternative? Not at all.

A CTS-V perhaps? Not likely, the CUE system bothers me and the 8 speed automatic seems to have some issues and doesn't shift as fast as the ZL1 10 speed. Maybe if they offered the CTS-V with a manual, but they don't anymore.

In lieu of a ZL1 allocation, the new E63S AMG might actually be it for me.

[harmonyp]

Originally Posted by speeddemonta

I am enjoying all the responses from the forum.

Am wondering if the 2017 Camaro ZL1 will have an influence on the 2017 Corvette Grand Sport sales? I feel they ALMOST are in direct competition with each other - while the Corvette ZO6 has the same horsepower as the ZL1 the ZO6 costs quite a bit more.

When reviewing the specs, the ZL1 is not as expensive, is faster [0-60 mph, & 1/4 mile] and is rated at 1.02 g's which is almost the same as the G.S. without the Z07 performance package. To me, it seems that the ZL1 MIGHT be the better value. I do realize that there are also subjective areas to consider i.e., exterior and interior styling/size, perceived comfort/ride, brand value [Corvette verses Camaro], etc.

I am hoping that one of the major publications does a head-to-head comparison.

For me, 'the jury is still out'. However, it sure is a fun decision to make. Keep the responses coming!

Why would the Camaro and Vette be any more in direct competition than they have ever been?

Despite the downsize of the Camaro, the Camaro is still a muscle / pony car, and the Vette still a sports car. They appeal to different markets / targets, and if you drive both you'll understand how vastly different they are.

[Diggitydog]

Originally Posted by harmonyp

Why would the Camaro and Vette be any more in direct competition than they have ever been?

Despite the downsize of the Camaro, the Camaro is still a muscle / pony car, and the Vette still a sports car. They appeal to different markets / targets, and if you drive both you'll understand how vastly different they are.

I'm interested in the LT4 in a chassis with a bit more weight vs the Z06. I've never driven a Z06 but some online reviews suggest the Z06 is overpowered for driving at the cars limit. Not trying to start a flame fest on the Z06 just seems like the ZL1 weight might be a good thing with the LT4.

[10spd]

Originally Posted by harmonyp

Why would the Camaro and Vette be any more in direct competition than they have ever been?

Despite the downsize of the Camaro, the Camaro is still a muscle / pony car, and the Vette still a sports car. They appeal to different markets / targets, and if you drive both you'll understand how vastly different they are.

Ignore the marketing for a second, the ZL1 and CTS-V has never been more closely related and similar to each other.

- Both based on the Alpha platform
- Both powered by the LT4
- Both have active rear differential

Also, similar price level given the discount available on the CTS-V. Anyways, I didn't mean to derail this thread by mentioning the CTS-V. Just wanted to point out that a perspective buyer is just as likely to consider the CTS-V as an alternative as the Grand Sport.