Alignment help - Page 2

cdb95z28 · 01-19-2023, 05:26 PM

Matt, We've disagreed in the past on the finer points of alignment. Our goals are the same, just a different road to get there maybe. Here is how I view it.
I very much value your input. Thank You.

The OP states: "My steering wheel is turn slightly to the right to go straight." A little bit ambiguous.

Is the OP turning the steering wheel (adding his own force) to the right to maintain straight travel (pull) or is is the steering wheel going to the right on its own with no steering input which results in straight travel (steering wheel angle complaint)? When we can gather what the forces within the steering wheel are this helps to determine if it is pull or steering angle. It may make finding a solution more difficult until we know the dynamics at hand.

A customer expects their steering wheel to be, as GM states, "level", or straight. If we are driving straight we expect the steering wheel to be level. This is the foundation of desired steering dynamics. In order to get the car to track straight on a straight road and we let the steering wheel go to wherever it wants and it is now not level, this is incorrect. So we now compensate to achieve that level steering wheel foundation and we now find there is force opposing our holding the steering wheel level.

Can "a true vehicle pull only complaint (will) have the vehicle pull to one side or the other regardless of steering wheel angle"? GM says yes. Those are their exact words in quotations. I view this to mean the steering wheel can be level or anywhere else during pull. Any steering wheel angle may be related to a true vehicle pull. This is what I keep coming back to, right or wrong.

Examples:
-The driver compensates with a new steering wheel angle (result:not level) to get the car to drive straight. The alignment process shows the toe to steering wheel relationship may be perfect but something else is creating a lateral trajectory.

-OR The driver lets the steering wheel go where it wants (result:not level) and the car drives straight. The toe to steering wheel relationship is incorrect as you pointed out.

-OR The driver compensates with a new steering wheel angle (result:level or not) and the car drives straight. The toe to steering wheel relationship may be incorrect AND there could be something else that is playing part of the ultimate trajectory.

I think the red block below is where I am, I confuse the two, but at the same time I believe they can be related because there can be multiple variables involved. Excessive cross caster/camber combined with poor steering wheel to toe relationship is possible from the seemingly abundant poor Gen5/6 alignment results that show up here and from other sources. I amended my "offset steering wheel" phrase from my previous post so not to confuse with steering wheel angle.

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Conner0388 · 01-31-2023, 01:12 PM

So I got it aligned at a Chevy dealership and tire kingdom. Both say the caster is off by 1 degree is the front. Less on the driver side. So when driving my steering wheel is now turned to the left and goes lefts so I have to turn the wheel center to stay going straight. Should I go and re torque all the bolts and go get it’s aligned again? Or can I just adjust my toe rods?

S1lent · 01-31-2023, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Conner0388

So I got it aligned at a Chevy dealership and tire kingdom. Both say the caster is off by 1 degree is the front. Less on the driver side. So when driving my steering wheel is now turned to the left and goes lefts so I have to turn the wheel center to stay going straight. Should I go and re torque all the bolts and go get it’s aligned again? Or can I just adjust my toe rods?

If the car doesn't drive straight with your hands off the wheel like it sounds, you need to have the alignment done.

Conner0388 · 01-31-2023, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by S1lent

If the car doesn't drive straight with your hands off the wheel like it sounds, you need to have the alignment done.

Well thats the thing i have had it aligned twice now with the same results. They keep saying the caster if off by the 1 degree and they are unable to correct caster since its not adjustable.

RamAir02 · 01-31-2023, 06:19 PM

Several people have asked to see the alignment sheet. Can you share it?

Have you owned the car since new or did you purchase used? Has it ever been in an accident?

01-19-2023, 05:26 PM	#15
cdb95z28 Drives: 2022 1SS 1LE A10 BCD WCT+PDR Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Johnstown, PA Posts: 3,212	Matt, We've disagreed in the past on the finer points of alignment. Our goals are the same, just a different road to get there maybe. Here is how I view it. I very much value your input. Thank You. The OP states: "My steering wheel is turn slightly to the right to go straight." A little bit ambiguous. Is the OP turning the steering wheel (adding his own force) to the right to maintain straight travel (pull) or is is the steering wheel going to the right on its own with no steering input which results in straight travel (steering wheel angle complaint)? When we can gather what the forces within the steering wheel are this helps to determine if it is pull or steering angle. It may make finding a solution more difficult until we know the dynamics at hand. A customer expects their steering wheel to be, as GM states, "level", or straight. If we are driving straight we expect the steering wheel to be level. This is the foundation of desired steering dynamics. In order to get the car to track straight on a straight road and we let the steering wheel go to wherever it wants and it is now not level, this is incorrect. So we now compensate to achieve that level steering wheel foundation and we now find there is force opposing our holding the steering wheel level. Can "a true vehicle pull only complaint (will) have the vehicle pull to one side or the other regardless of steering wheel angle"? GM says yes. Those are their exact words in quotations. I view this to mean the steering wheel can be level or anywhere else during pull. Any steering wheel angle may be related to a true vehicle pull. This is what I keep coming back to, right or wrong. Examples: -The driver compensates with a new steering wheel angle (result:not level) to get the car to drive straight. The alignment process shows the toe to steering wheel relationship may be perfect but something else is creating a lateral trajectory. -OR The driver lets the steering wheel go where it wants (result:not level) and the car drives straight. The toe to steering wheel relationship is incorrect as you pointed out. -OR The driver compensates with a new steering wheel angle (result:level or not) and the car drives straight. The toe to steering wheel relationship may be incorrect AND there could be something else that is playing part of the ultimate trajectory. I think the red block below is where I am, I confuse the two, but at the same time I believe they can be related because there can be multiple variables involved. Excessive cross caster/camber combined with poor steering wheel to toe relationship is possible from the seemingly abundant poor Gen5/6 alignment results that show up here and from other sources. I amended my "offset steering wheel" phrase from my previous post so not to confuse with steering wheel angle. __________________ 2022 1SS 1LE A10 BCD WCT+PDR2014 1SS 1LE NPP RECARO SIM-SOLD1995 Z28 M6 GSC PGM-SOLD1975 NOVA COUPE 300HP 350 TH350 FLASH RED-SOLD

01-31-2023, 06:19 PM	#19
RamAir02 Shadow Gray '19 ZLE M6 Drives: '19 ZL1 1LE M6 Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: NJ Posts: 1,443 View My Garage	Several people have asked to see the alignment sheet. Can you share it? Have you owned the car since new or did you purchase used? Has it ever been in an accident? __________________ 2019 ZL1 1LE \| M6 \| SGM \| PDR \| CF Dash \| Nav \| Wheel Locks PPF \| Paint Correction \| ZL1 Addons Rock Guards \| ZL1 Addons Lift Pads \| ZL1 Addons Feather Lite Tow Hook \| JWM Smoked Sidemarkers \| Wildhammer Smoked Rear Reflectors \| JWM License Plate LEDs \| RotoFab CAI \| ADM IC Reservoir v2 \| BC Forged RZ05 \| SPL Toe Arms \| BW Brake Deflectors \| CMS Roll Bar \| Schroth Profi II ASM Harnesses . Sold: '99 Trans Am (bolt-ons & cam) \| '00 WS6 (bolt-ons, heads, cam, 12 bolt) \| '05 CTS-V (bolt-ons, short throw) \| '10 SS/RS M6 (short throw, CAI, coilovers, LTs, catback, JRE tune) \| '01 WS6 YouTube

01-31-2023, 01:12 PM	#16
Conner0388 Drives: 2016 Chevy Camaro 2SS Join Date: Sep 2020 Location: Flagler beach, Florida Posts: 214 View My Garage	So I got it aligned at a Chevy dealership and tire kingdom. Both say the caster is off by 1 degree is the front. Less on the driver side. So when driving my steering wheel is now turned to the left and goes lefts so I have to turn the wheel center to stay going straight. Should I go and re torque all the bolts and go get it’s aligned again? Or can I just adjust my toe rods?

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