[Norm Peterson]

With respect to the above, and for Camaro fanboy's benefit in particular . . .

Ford's EPAS has included electronic "corrections" that are intended to reduce the steering burden on drivers against "drift-pull" (the tendency for the car to slip sideways toward the gutter on crowned roads) and "nibble" (the above-mentioned lateral effects and even minor amounts of tire/wheel out-of-balance). IOW, Ford's EPAS can make tiny steering corrections that are independent of what the driver is doing at the steering wheel. Obviously, getting the calibrations for those "steering features" right are going to be important . . . though at this point they do seem to have worked a couple of early-year (2011-ish) bugs out of them.

So maybe it's a case of you having so much driving experience not even being able to hand off lots of little steering corrections to some computer assist that you've been in a running subconscious argument with Ford's EPAS. If it matters, I don't care for those "features" just in principle.


Norm

[Bosse'sBoss]

Originally Posted by Silveradoss573

Mine as well. The only explanation is the absolutely junk garbage GM designed suspension! Hell my 2003 Mach didn't tramline anything like this car does.

From what I can see, you have a 5th gen Camaro SS1LE, on similar tires size like my previous 5th gen Camaro ZL1, that should have stock 285s wide front tires. My ZL1 with stock alignment settings didn't do any tramlining at all seemed perfectly set.


On the contrary on my '11 Mustang GT with track package that came with stock 255s, it tramlining like crazy after I upgraded to 275s, it stopped doing that after I lowered my front tire's PSI. I was using the same PSI of my previous stock 255s, when the 275s began the tramlining.

But my '14 Corvettes C7 Stingray Z51, came stock with very narrow 245s wide front tires, it also did tramlining a lot and also very prematurely weared the external side of both of my font tires, after verifying the alignment with my dealer, they mentioned that it was normal, because the Z51 stock alignment setting is set aggressive for better performance.

So I think that probably you have to check your front tires alignment or your tire's PSI, because your 5th gen SS1LE shouldn't be tramling at all, it has the same size tires like my 5th gen ZL1 and my car didn't do that.

On several car magazines reviews they always have mentioned that with the stock wide tires on the Shelby GT350, GT350R and now on the newer Mach 1 that those cars do a lot of tramlining following the street groves.
I haven't read about any tramlining on the 6th gen SS1LE and neither of the ZL1.

[Bosse'sBoss]

Originally Posted by s346k

perhaps you can explain why my ss 1LE tramlines so much? must be the inferior suspension and chassis.

Inferior suspension/chassis?
The 6th gen Camaro's "Alpha" chassis and its ELSD has been praised by most car magazines to be an engineering marvel and its able to compete with most BMW M models at their same level of performance or better than them.


https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/c...let-camaro-ss/


https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-cul...camaro-ss-1le/

[Wyzz Kydd]

I'm running 305s in back and 295s up front. Zero tramlining.

[Bosse'sBoss]

Originally Posted by Camaro fanboy

for me performnce is meaningless.
i judge cars how they perform as a road car at normal speeds.
the camaro is amazingly rock solid with almost no cowl shake or tramlining
the s550 jumps all over the road on bumpy roads and tramlines like hell.
our cars are very close to what the germans offer.
the s550 drives like a 1989 car.
the s197 drives like a 1975 taunus..well it would as it uses the same suspension lol..those s197's are just about the worst car i have ever owned

I'm not a brand fan, I'm a performance sport car fan who likes to track them and have spirited DD, I prefer the driver's involvement of the car. I dissagre with your S197 comments,. During that year generation '11-'14, the Mustang GT 5.0 was a better sport car compared to the 5th gen Camaro SS (except for the SS1LE or ZL1 which were better performers), even the '11 Mustang GT did great compared to the BMW M3 on a MT H2H and its performance excelled it. I also was able to confirm that on my '11 Mustang GT with the track pack against a same year BMW M3 (V8) at my local PCA track.
https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2...m3-comparison/

The newer 6th gen Camaro SS is an amazing sport car that is in a higher level of performance, and is much better than the newer Mustang GT.

[Pupilbone]

Way back in this thread I commented on my seeing a new Mach 1 in the wild… I thought the exterior looked good, and I really liked the colour (the fighter jet grey). Totally agree with the colour fads coming and going. I would never purchase the copper colour which was so popular a few years ago.

[Silveradoss573]

Originally Posted by Bosse'sBoss

From what I can see, you have a 5th gen Camaro SS1LE, on similar tires size like my previous 5th gen Camaro ZL1, that should have stock 285s wide front tires. My ZL1 with stock alignment settings didn't do any tramlining at all seemed perfectly set.


On the contrary on my '11 Mustang GT with track package that came with stock 255s, it tramlining like crazy after I upgraded to 275s, it stopped doing that after I lowered my front tire's PSI. I was using the same PSI of my previous stock 255s, when the 275s began the tramlining.

But my '14 Corvettes C7 Stingray Z51, came stock with very narrow 245s wide front tires, it also did tramlining a lot and also very prematurely weared the external side of both of my font tires, after verifying the alignment with my dealer, they mentioned that it was normal, because the Z51 stock alignment setting is set aggressive for better performance.

So I think that probably you have to check your front tires alignment or your tire's PSI, because your 5th gen SS1LE shouldn't be tramling at all, it has the same size tires like my 5th gen ZL1 and my car didn't do that.

On several car magazines reviews they always have mentioned that with those wide on the Shelby GT350, GT350R and now on the newer Mach 1 that those cars do a lot of tramlining following the street groves.
I haven't read about any tramlining on the 6th gen SS1LE and neither of the ZL1.

It's really no big deal and i was being sarcastic in my response which to some may have been taken wrong. I'm not slamming gm on the 5th 1LE suspension and definitely not the 6th gen. Pretty much every car I've owned that's been performance oriented experienced tramling to some degree. From what I can tell, it's mix of suspension setup, tire design and or width and the road surface variations that contribute to tramling. My point was to a certain member that the mustang isn't the only vehcle prone to tramling.....far from it.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by Pupilbone

Way back in this thread I commented on my seeing a new Mach 1 in the wild… I thought the exterior looked good, and I really liked the colour (the fighter jet grey). Totally agree with the colour fads coming and going. I would never purchase the copper colour which was so popular a few years ago.

I think the Mach I is an excellent car, but priced too high. It should be priced in the same range as an SS 1LE. But, if your Ford and people are lining up to pay sticker plus ADM for one, then why not, eh?

If I was ordering one, it would be either FJG or the dark blue. I’ve seen a few in person. FJG, blue, orange. FJG looks good in print, even better in person.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by Bosse'sBoss

On the contrary on my '11 Mustang GT with track package that came with stock 255s, it tramlining like crazy after I upgraded to 275s, it stopped doing that after I lowered my front tire's PSI. I was using the same PSI of my previous stock 255s, when the 275s began the tramlining.

Odd . . . My ' 08 running 285/35s on 18x11s on all four corners never seems to give a hint of tramlining, and that's at -2° camber. Pre-EPAS.

Then again, your experience could have been linked to that early EPAS calibration.


Norm

[Silveradoss573]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

I think the Mach I is an excellent car, but priced too high. It should be priced in the same range as an SS 1LE. But, if your Ford and people are lining up to pay sticker plus ADM for one, then why not, eh?

Agree 100% with this. My god if Ford priced these in line with the SS 1Le and no dealer markups, I bet they would have a hard time keeping up with the demand. Still hoping they bring back the shaker hood in the next couple of years.

[crysalis_01]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

I think the Mach I is an excellent car, but priced too high. It should be priced in the same range as an SS 1LE. But, if your Ford and people are lining up to pay sticker plus ADM for one, then why not, eh?

If I was ordering one, it would be either FJG or the dark blue. I’ve seen a few in person. FJG, blue, orange. FJG looks good in print, even better in person.

I have to agree in part and disagree with others here. It's the Free Market at work. It's not "Priced too high" it's "priced to high for those who don't want it."

The price/value is determined by the market, and maximizing profit isnt a side effect, it's a key feature, of aforementioned Free Market. Would I rather them MSRP lower, yeah. Not that I'm in the market, 2nd home buying is taking up a lot of the financial focus now. But even when that's all figured out I likely won't buy new. I'll find a low mile GT350 and that'll be just fine by me, I don't track my car's anyway. Just light canyon carving in the summer.

But I digress. If people pay it, it would be bad business to not keep the prices high. If people stop paying for it and sales drop, then it'll be bad business to not lower prices. In theory anyway, in practice, in 'Merica...who knows these days.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by crysalis_01

I have to agree in part and disagree with others here. It's the Free Market at work. It's not "Priced too high" it's "priced to high for those who don't want it."

The price/value is determined by the market, and maximizing profit isnt a side effect, it's a key feature, of aforementioned Free Market. Would I rather them MSRP lower, yeah. Not that I'm in the market, 2nd home buying is taking up a lot of the financial focus now. But even when that's all figured out I likely won't buy new. I'll find a low mile GT350 and that'll be just fine by me, I don't track my car's anyway. Just light canyon carving in the summer.

But I digress. If people pay it, it would be bad business to not keep the prices high. If people stop paying for it and sales drop, then it'll be bad business to not lower prices. In theory anyway, in practice, in 'Merica...who knows these days.

One of the things you say is exactly why I say it’s priced too high. To get the Mach I the way I’d want it equipped, it would sticker at $61,500. Let’s pretend there’s no ADM. If I’m spending that kinda coin, I’d more than likely prefer a low mile GT350, as you say you would, or pick up a 1LE and pocket a lot of cash. As nice as the Mach I is, it is pretty much on par with a 1LE in terms of performance but the price differential is too much to sway me from the more reasonably priced 1LE or even a used GT350, which I find to be a much better car.

[CamaroSSStlfan]

Originally Posted by Bosse'sBoss

I'm not a brand fan, I'm a performance sport car fan who likes to track them and have spirited DD, I prefer the driver's involvement of the car. I dissagre with your S197 comments,. During that year generation '11-'14, the Mustang GT 5.0 was a better sport car compared to the 5th gen Camaro SS (except for the SS1LE or ZL1 which were better performers), even the '11 Mustang GT did great compared to the BMW M3 on a MT H2H and its performance excelled it. I also was able to confirm that on my '11 Mustang GT with the track pack against a same year BMW M3 (V8) at my local PCA track.
https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2...m3-comparison/

The newer 6th gen Camaro SS is an amazing sport car that is in a higher level of performance, and is much better than the newer Mustang GT.

I agree. I owned a 2012 Mustang GT. I bought it because at the time it was quicker than the gen 5 SS and overall a better car.


I have no complaints about the 2011-14 GT. I had an auto which was a great car. I wouldn't touch an MT82. Those transmissions are garbage.


My 2012 was a dependable car. Quick. Except as I posted before the interior was total garbage and typical cheap ford, unfinished.


The gen 6 Camaro is a far superior car compared to the Mustang. It's better with everything.



Ford kills it with the GT also because they're pushing the base model a lot. You can get good deals on those.

[Bosse'sBoss]

Originally Posted by CamaroSSStlfan

I agree. I owned a 2012 Mustang GT. I bought it because at the time it was quicker than the gen 5 SS and overall a better car.


I have no complaints about the 2011-14 GT. I had an auto which was a great car. I wouldn't touch an MT82. Those transmissions are garbage.

Mine was a 6MT with the 3.73 rear, never had any issue with the MT82 transmission, I used to shift it continuously specially while tracking my previous '11 Mustang GT 5.0 that came with the track package, and it felt very precise, almost never missing a shift.