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Old 12-07-2020, 10:30 PM   #1
blvckZL1
 
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Manual ZL1 Advice?

Hello all, I made a post awhile back about a manual tranny issue I was dealing with, and wanted to update my findings to see if anyone has any ideas. So my original problem was that I could put the shifter into gear, but no matter how many times I tried to get the clutch to catch, the car wouldn’t move. It would just sit there and rev, I tried multiple times over a week or so with no luck. I dropped the tranny and removed the clutch, but it still looked to have around 40% or so left, so didn’t seem worn enough to not be able to catch at all. I also took the transmission to a tranny shop and they said the transmission itself was sound. I have since held off on this project as it is just my weekend driver, but now that it is winter I will be picking it up again next week for something to do. Anyone have any ideas the could share to help me diagnose the problem and find a solution?
Thanks for any advice.
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Old 12-07-2020, 11:15 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by blvckZL1 View Post
Hello all, I made a post awhile back about a manual tranny issue I was dealing with, and wanted to update my findings to see if anyone has any ideas. So my original problem was that I could put the shifter into gear, but no matter how many times I tried to get the clutch to catch, the car wouldn’t move. It would just sit there and rev, I tried multiple times over a week or so with no luck. I dropped the tranny and removed the clutch, but it still looked to have around 40% or so left, so didn’t seem worn enough to not be able to catch at all. I also took the transmission to a tranny shop and they said the transmission itself was sound. I have since held off on this project as it is just my weekend driver, but now that it is winter I will be picking it up again next week for something to do. Anyone have any ideas the could share to help me diagnose the problem and find a solution?
Thanks for any advice.
Sure you have the driveshaft connected? Seriously there is more to the story than you are telling. The clutch disk are spring loaded and the outer disk is engaged to the flywheel all the time, you have to press the pedal to push fluid to the slave cylinder to push the plunger against the clutch disk springs to lift them off the flywheel. So if you are telling us that no matter what you do the clutch disk won’t engage tells me they aren’t touching the flywheel ever.

Just curious where you driving and then one day you couldn’t get the clutch to engage any more? When you had the clutch out you said you measured the outer clutch disk and thought it had 40% left, what about the inner clutch disk which has to catch the inner pressure plate flywheel. Remember you have two clutch disk.

Do you have a lift? If so when you get the clutch back on the flywheel you can hand spin the crank and see if the clutch’s are rotating with the pressure plate by inserting an alignment tool. Before you go through all that logic says check the slave cylinder and make sure it’s returning all the way back to the trans input shaft against the bell housing. If it’s stuck out you are depressing the pressure plate all the time.
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Old 12-07-2020, 11:39 PM   #3
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Sure you have the driveshaft connected? Seriously there is more to the story than you are telling. The clutch disk are spring loaded and the outer disk is engaged to the flywheel all the time, you have to press the pedal to push fluid to the slave cylinder to push the plunger against the clutch disk springs to lift them off the flywheel. So if you are telling us that no matter what you do the clutch disk won’t engage tells me they aren’t touching the flywheel ever.

Just curious where you driving and then one day you couldn’t get the clutch to engage any more? When you had the clutch out you said you measured the outer clutch disk and thought it had 40% left, what about the inner clutch disk which has to catch the inner pressure plate flywheel. Remember you have two clutch disk.

Do you have a lift? If so when you get the clutch back on the flywheel you can hand spin the crank and see if the clutch’s are rotating with the pressure plate by inserting an alignment tool. Before you go through all that logic says check the slave cylinder and make sure it’s returning all the way back to the trans input shaft against the bell housing. If it’s stuck out you are depressing the pressure plate all the time.
It started as a slight decline in power in the higher gears, then eventually became a problem with first gear as anytime I would stop at a light or a stop sign it would take an extra second to move. Then got to the point where I would have to rev for 5 seconds or so to finally start to move. At that point I parked it, planning to drive it to the shop, then it wouldn’t move anymore.

Neither clutch disk looked bad enough to cause as serious of a problem as I have. I plan replace the clutch while I have the tranny out, but want to see what other ideas people have so I can cover all bases and hopefully not have to drop the trans again.

I do not have a lift unfortunately.
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Old 12-08-2020, 08:01 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by blvckZL1 View Post
It started as a slight decline in power in the higher gears, then eventually became a problem with first gear as anytime I would stop at a light or a stop sign it would take an extra second to move. Then got to the point where I would have to rev for 5 seconds or so to finally start to move. At that point I parked it, planning to drive it to the shop, then it wouldn’t move anymore.

Neither clutch disk looked bad enough to cause as serious of a problem as I have. I plan replace the clutch while I have the tranny out, but want to see what other ideas people have so I can cover all bases and hopefully not have to drop the trans again.

I do not have a lift unfortunately.
If you know the clutch is good I would check the slave cylinder making sure is is fully retracting.
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Old 12-08-2020, 08:48 AM   #5
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Does the clutch pedal have a normal feel to it's travel ??
I assume you've checked the fluid reservoir for proper level and fluid color?
What about bleeding the system ?

I'd guess that these are things you've already considered, but I had to ask.

Last edited by HDRDTD; 12-08-2020 at 05:24 PM.
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Old 12-09-2020, 07:04 PM   #6
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Everything you are saying is clutch all clutch. The disk may "look" ok but not enough material to grab or the basket could be hanging up or separated.



The whole set of symptons with showing slipping in higher gear then progressing to first gear issues says clutch replacement.
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Old 12-09-2020, 11:09 PM   #7
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Everything you are saying is clutch all clutch. The disk may "look" ok but not enough material to grab or the basket could be hanging up or separated.



The whole set of symptons with showing slipping in higher gear then progressing to first gear issues says clutch replacement.
Yeah I would agree, but in the forum you have to take someone’s word when they tell you the clutch is good. Was wandering how he came up with 40% disk left.
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Old 12-10-2020, 07:03 PM   #8
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Yeah I would agree, but in the forum you have to take someone’s word when they tell you the clutch is good. Was wandering how he came up with 40% disk left.
It’s just my estimate, let me know what you guys think: https://imgur.com/gallery/rjS0uEt
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Old 12-10-2020, 10:32 PM   #9
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It’s just my estimate, let me know what you guys think: https://imgur.com/gallery/rjS0uEt
That link doesn’t work, just attach a pic.
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Old 12-11-2020, 01:00 AM   #10
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That link doesn’t work, just attach a pic.
This work?
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Old 12-11-2020, 09:42 AM   #11
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Throw out bearing.
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Old 12-11-2020, 12:05 PM   #12
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Throw out bearing.

Could be but you would thing before it got to that point it would have been pretty noisy. There does seem to be enough material on the disk as when mine got bad I kept delaying fixing it because it still worked, so one day I just went out and took it down to the rivets. Problem solved, had to push it on the lift.. I would certainly be looking at that pressure plate making sure there is enough spring pressure to grab, and like mentioned before make sure you don't have a stuck slave cylinder.
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Old 12-11-2020, 03:18 PM   #13
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Looks like your pressure plate have been overheating and probably lost its spring pressure as ZMEnow mention above.
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Old 12-15-2020, 10:39 AM   #14
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How about the dual mass flywheel, have you checked that? There is a spring between the two pieces of the flywheel that is supposed to dampen the rotational force "to give a smoother ride" since this powertrain is originally from the CTS-V. Maybe something is going on there.

My OEM clutch was slipping under load at 25,000 miles when I bought the car. There was plenty of material on the clutch discs when I took it out. I put a Monster clutch in it which ditched the OEM flywheel and all is well now. I also replaced the slave cylinder while I was in there as a good measure. I may have had pressure plate spring issues too, either way everything got replaced and all is well now.

Last edited by MLC_LSA; 12-15-2020 at 11:04 AM.
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