No Gas for New York

[Nilly Welson]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

You read it perfectly. It is a goal, not a law. Executive branch at state or federal level does not make laws. That is the job of the Legislative branch. FWIW, every immigrant who wants to become a US citizen has to learn that the Legislative Branch makes law, the Executive Branch approves (or vetoes) law, the Judiciary Branch interprets law.

Case in point…the original California ZEV Mandate stated that by 2003, 10% of cars sold in California had to be zero emissions. In Q1 2021, 18 years after the timing for the original “mandate” the number of zero emissions cars sold in California just eked past 10% for the very first time (thanks Tesla). So either the original mandate was NOT a law, or the law has been broken every year for the past 18 years. It was not a law. But it led to actual law that was a lot more realistic and achievable. History is repeating.

California and New York are not alone. Maine, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, New Jersey, New Mexico, North Carolina, Washington, Oregon, and Hawaii also have set 2035 as a target year to ban sales of new vehicles with ICE. That’s about 1/5 of the US by state count and closer to 1/3 of annual new vehicles sales. And more are coming.

This is a chart I'll be using at a panel discussion I'll be speaking at at Motor Bella.

Thank you!!!...Now so easy to see all the sh!thole states!

[pauly1119]

Originally Posted by JamesNoBrakes

At least there are mountains.

Perfect place to see all the homeless tents from. It’s like a huge camp ground, sounds real nice Clark.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Stop complaining. Electric cars are gonna be much faster anyway. They're gonna friggin destroy gasoline cars in performance. The Model S bone stock is already walking motorcycles from a dig and a roll. Some of them have a 0-60 less than 2 seconds and a 200 MPH top speed. So what's to complain about? The fast electric cars are gonna make the fastest gasoline cars look slow.

<sigh> . . . it never ends

What you gain with EV performance - most of which is so traction-controlled and stability-controlled that the driver is all but irrelevant - comes at too great a cost in other aspects of car ownership and driving. At least for some of us.


Norm

[cthulhucaller]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

This is a chart I'll be using at a panel discussion I'll be speaking at at Motor Bella.

What the hell is going on over in North Cawkaleekee? Not sure what happened to those guys. We used to be cool and hang out and BBQ, but now they got all weird.

[z28pat]

I just don’t see how big oil is going to sit back and let their markets be taken away. That’s why they have lobbyists and politicians on the payroll, I mean campaign donations.

[s2mikey]

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

<sigh> . . . it never ends

What you gain with EV performance - most of which is so traction-controlled and stability-controlled that the driver is all but irrelevant - comes at too great a cost in other aspects of car ownership and driving. At least for some of us.

Norm

It doesnt end. I dont care if an Electric sportscar or exotic gets to 60mph in 1 second. The "whoosh" in place of the engine sound & other missing visceral stimulations is a deal killer for me. EVs are great for daily running about or going to work. We'll probably have one eventually ourselves. But, weekends, after work & pleasure driving? Petrol baby, preferably in a Camaro. * Sets mic down *

Originally Posted by z28pat

I just don’t see how big oil is going to sit back and let their markets be taken away. That’s why they have lobbyists and politicians on the payroll, I mean campaign donations.

They wont and Im glad for it. As I said, an EV in most households makes sense and will be fine. But replacing everything with an EV anytime in the near or even far future is just a wonky concept. No way. We arent even close to having the infrastructure to support it nor is there enough demand for it.

[Chrome383Z]

Originally Posted by BlaqWhole

Stop complaining. Electric cars are gonna be much faster anyway. They're gonna friggin destroy gasoline cars in performance. The Model S bone stock is already walking motorcycles from a dig and a roll. Some of them have a 0-60 less than 2 seconds and a 200 MPH top speed. So what's to complain about? The fast electric cars are gonna make the fastest gasoline cars look slow.

Agree if the car is designed for it. My only problem with electric is modifying would probably be extremely expensive. Basically you’ll have to buy the high performance models.

They days of buying a SS level car and modifying to ZL1 levels for example will probably be gone. That part sucks.

[JKSully]

Originally Posted by s2mikey

They wont and Im glad for it. As I said, an EV in most households makes sense and will be fine. But replacing everything with an EV anytime in the near or even far future is just a wonky concept. No way. We arent even close to having the infrastructure to support it nor is there enough demand for it.

The problem is that with the oil companies fighting it so hard for so long, it's taking much longer to get the infrastructure built out to support the EV future that IS coming, like it or not. Petroleum will run out eventually no matter what we do.

If big oil was really smart, they wouldn't be fighting against it, they'd be funding the research and development of renewables so they can transition their own business and profits to benefit from the EV future. Instead, they're going to find themselves left behind while others make a name for themselves and establish the markets, and they will run themselves out of business like so many other companies that have refused to accept change (see: Blockbuster, Polaroid, et al).

[Nothing like an SS]

Originally Posted by JKSully

The problem is that with the oil companies fighting it so hard for so long, it's taking much longer to get the infrastructure built out to support the EV future that IS coming, like it or not. Petroleum will run out eventually no matter what we do.

If big oil was really smart, they wouldn't be fighting against it, they'd be funding the research and development of renewables so they can transition their own business and profits to benefit from the EV future. Instead, they're going to find themselves left behind while others make a name for themselves and establish the markets, and they will run themselves out of business like so many other companies that have refused to accept change (see: Blockbuster, Polaroid, et al).

Big oil is already partnering to build charging stations and infrastructure, they are on board, not fighting it.....following the money

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by JKSully

The problem is that with the oil companies fighting it so hard for so long, it's taking much longer to get the infrastructure built out to support the EV future that IS coming, like it or not. Petroleum will run out eventually no matter what we do.

If big oil was really smart, they wouldn't be fighting against it, they'd be funding the research and development of renewables so they can transition their own business and profits to benefit from the EV future. Instead, they're going to find themselves left behind while others make a name for themselves and establish the markets, and they will run themselves out of business like so many other companies that have refused to accept change (see: Blockbuster, Polaroid, et al).

Originally Posted by Nothing like an SS

Big oil is already partnering to build charging stations and infrastructure, they are on board, not fighting it.....following the money

A lot of truth to this. But in addition, do we really think that Exxon is only motor oil and gasoline? There are a lot of different products that come out of a 42 gallon barrel of crude. What doesn’t go into light vehicle fuel tanks will go to other products.

[Checkmate1]

New York has Blackouts occasionally with the current grid the way it is...now add umpteen electric cars...can the infrastructure even handle this?

Unreal.

[Village Idiot]

What happened to that synthetic fuel Porsche has been testing? Assuming that's a pipe dream?

[90503]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

You read it perfectly. It is a goal, not a law. Executive branch at state or federal level does not make laws. That is the job of the Legislative branch. FWIW, every immigrant who wants to become a US citizen has to learn that the Legislative Branch makes law, the Executive Branch approves (or vetoes) law, the Judiciary Branch interprets law.

Case in point…the original California ZEV Mandate stated that by 2003, 10% of cars sold in California had to be zero emissions. In Q1 2021, 18 years after the timing for the original “mandate” the number of zero emissions cars sold in California just eked past 10% for the very first time (thanks Tesla). So either the original mandate was NOT a law, or the law has been broken every year for the past 18 years. It was not a law. But it led to actual law that was a lot more realistic and achievable. History is repeating.

California and New York are not alone. Maine, Massachusetts, Rhode Island, New Jersey, New Mexico, North Carolina, Washington, Oregon, and Hawaii also have set 2035 as a target year to ban sales of new vehicles with ICE. That’s about 1/5 of the US by state count and closer to 1/3 of annual new vehicles sales. And more are coming.

This is a chart I'll be using at a panel discussion I'll be speaking at at Motor Bella.

One minor detail left out that wasn't around in past 18 years as you show above.

And that is that manufacturers did not announce any plans in past years to permanently stop making vehicles that produce emissions.

Seems to me a different ball-game if the manufacturers time-line to stop production completely matches the so-called non-binding time line of prominent states to end emissions.

Not quite the same as the past 18 years of violating a non-binding target.

[Nothing like an SS]

Originally Posted by Checkmate1

New York has Blackouts occasionally with the current grid the way it is...now add umpteen electric cars...can the infrastructure even handle this?

Unreal.

We do???? Been here 50+ years, other storms and one major blackout (east coast, not just NY state), ummm....what blackouts???

I don't think that is even close to "occasionally"

unless you mean only NYC? Not relevant as representative of the state of NY in any way

I love to see these "facts" being spouted....laughable