GM CATCH CAN Warranty Denial PETITION

[MrChrisLS3]

Originally Posted by TommyTheCat

I always thought that the dealer/manufacturer had to prove that your modification actually affected the problem

To be safe when I took my car in for some warranty problems, I called ahead and asked if my catch can or air intake would be a problem and they said no and I had it put in writing. Just do this, and you should be fine

After doing some reading up, I think many of us are misunderstanding the MM Act. It appears that much of what we are discussing, involving "aftermarket" parts has to do with the "Tie-in Sales" provision.

This means that you don't have to use a certain brand of air filter, or a certain brand of oil, or a certain brand of tire etc, so long as those "aftermarket" meaning not made by the OEM, meet the designed specification. It means that you aren't required to get maintenance, like oil changes, tire rotations, and such at only GM service centers. So long as all the required specifications are met.

However, when we start adding parts that are not part of the OEM design, or start making changes to the structure or operation of OEM systems, I'm not so sure the MM Act applies anymore. So, in a case like this, does GM really have to prove the catch can caused the oil pump to fail? Since the catch can is not part of the OEM design and it modifies the operation of the PCV system, could that be all they need to deny warranty service, even if the pump was indeed a manufacture defect? I don't know, but from what I've read, it seems that the MM Act doesn't cover this.

So, why do dealers perform warranty work on cars with such modifications? Because they can, and they want to. The dealer is not GM. A dealer can look at a catch can, and know that it most likely didn't cause the problem, replace the oil pump and get paid by GM. They can replace the entire engine if the failed oil pump caused the damage. But they don't necessarily have to tell GM that it had a modification to the system. To the dealer, this is immaterial. But in this case, GM was alerted to the addition of the catch can, stupid move by the dealership, and they blocked the repair.

At least this is my take on this, and I could be wrong, of course.

[thephoenix]

So if I add on an aftermarket wing and my AC does tits-up, my warranty is void? NO. The MMWA protects against situations exactly like this one. A cc cannot cause an oil pump to fail any more than that aftermarket wing can cause the AC to fail. But the act is flawed because we can't hire a lawyer and be without a car for months while the wheels of justice slog forward and we spend more than the engine would be worth anyway.

Justice in this country has more to do with money than law.

[Silver14]

Decent article from an attorney. http://lehtoslaw.com/will-modificati...-car-warranty/

Has anyone here modified other items (appliances, electronics, etc.) that have a warranty and still received warranty repairs? I'm curious because MM isn't strictly automotive legislation, it would be interesting to see how modifications are handled in other industries.

[shrinkdoc]

Damn...doesn't GM know there is now the internet, where they can no longer just f over people and people not finding out?

[SS376]

Originally Posted by Gearheaded

I don't think the MM Act is as cut and dry as everyone makes it seem. After reading the actual law, it seems more like installing aftermarket replacement parts instead of OEM is covered by the law, not additional aftermarket parts. Just feels like too much grey area in the words to be as simple as some make it seem.

Bingo. It was written so that a diy oil change or non oe air cleaner element wouldn't void a warranty.

[Mr. Stacy]

§ 700.8 Warrantor’s decision as final.
A warrantor shall not indicate in any
written warranty or service contract
either directly or indirectly that the
decision of the warrantor, service contractor,
or any designated third party
is final or binding in any dispute concerning
the warranty or service contract.
Nor shall a warrantor or service
contractor state that it alone shall determine
what is a defect under the
agreement. Such statements are deceptive
since section 110(d) of the Act
gives state and federal courts jurisdiction
over suits for breach of warranty
and service contract.

§ 700.10 Section 102(c).
(c) No warrantor may condition the
continued validity of a warranty on the
use of only authorized repair service
and/or authorized replacement parts
for non-warranty service and maintenance.
For example, provisions such as,
‘‘This warranty is void if service is performed
by anyone other than an authorized
‘ABC’ dealer and all replacement
parts must be genuine ‘ABC’
parts,’’ and the like, are prohibited
where the service or parts are not covered
by the warranty. These provisions
violate the Act in two ways. First, they
violate the section 102 (c) ban against
tying arrangements. Second, such provisions
are deceptive under section 110
of the Act, because a warrantor cannot,
as a matter of law, avoid liability
under a written warranty where a defect
is unrelated to the use by a consumer
of ‘‘unauthorized’’ articles or
service. This does not preclude a warrantor
from expressly excluding liability
for defects or damage caused by
such ‘‘unauthorized’’ articles or service;
nor does it preclude the warrantor
from denying liability where the warrantor
can demonstrate that the defect
or damage was so caused.

[NYCamOwner]

Any update on this? What's the latest?

[Mr. Stacy]

Also, don't forget "Implied Warranties":

Implied warranties are created by state law, and all states have them. Almost every purchase you make is covered by an implied warranty.

The most common type of implied warranty—a "warranty of merchantability," means that the seller promises that the product will do what it is supposed to do. For example, a car will run and a toaster will toast.

If problems arise that are not covered by the written warranty, you should investigate the protection given by your implied warranty. Implied warranty coverage can last as long as four years, although the length of the coverage varies from state to state. A lawyer or a state consumer protection office can provide more information about implied warranty coverage in your state.

[Mr. Stacy]

Texas Law:

Sec. 2301.204. COMPLAINT CONCERNING VEHICLE DEFECT. (a) The owner of a motor vehicle or the owner's designated agent may make a complaint concerning a defect in a motor vehicle that is covered by a manufacturer's, converter's, or distributor's warranty agreement applicable to the vehicle.
(b) The complaint must be made in writing to the applicable dealer, manufacturer, converter, or distributor and must specify each defect in the vehicle that is covered by the warranty.
(c) The owner may also invoke the board's jurisdiction by sending a copy of the complaint to the board.
(d) A hearing may be scheduled on any complaint made under this section that is not privately resolved between the owner and the dealer, manufacturer, converter, or distributor.

[badcompany]

Originally Posted by NYCamOwner

Any update on this? What's the latest?

They denied the claim and pretty much pissed on the petition. So whoever donated should be receiving their money back.

[Mr. Stacy]

I understand it would be an easy case to win...

OP want's to put it behind him, which I also understand.

[Mr. Stacy]

All donations were refunded last week and should have hit your bank by now. If you do not get your refund within a day or so, let me know and I will check it out.

Thanks again for your generous donations.

[gajagfan]

Originally Posted by Mr. Stacy

I understand it would be an easy case to win...

OP want's to put it behind him, which I also understand.

I bet not as easy to win as it might seem. It is an unfortunate situation, and I hate it for the OP.

[95birdible]

Here is hypothetical: Say you install a trailer hitch on your brand new SS Camaro so you can put your mountain bikes on it. 3,000 miles in your transmission starts slipping, your rear end starts whining, and you take it to the dealership. This would be the same as adding a catch can to your car. It is not a factory OEM installed item and GM or any other manufacturer could refuse and void your warranty saying adding the hitch causes the failures to your car. BS if you ask me.