[PolynesianPowerhouse]

just trying to see if anyone on the forum went past the cradle lockout and went for either the diff lockout or full diff bushings?

time to start building for the spring. just got the cradle lockouts for thanksgiving, the toe rods for Christmas.... looking to snag the diff lockouts and the rear brace for the next sale/holiday

[kropscamaro16]

haha they look nice but im not bold enough yet but i do have a daily now so hmm

[PolynesianPowerhouse]

Originally Posted by kropscamaro16

haha they look nice but im not bold enough yet but i do have a daily now so hmm

I think I'm gonna have to be the crazy one and put it ON the daily

just been reading and watching some vids pertaining to the 5th gen and the new mustang... and when you see how much the rear diff flex, and then read about throttle response... it seems the less flex, the quicker the power is transferred to the ground.

trying to get rid of some fe2 slop and build my pineapple-LE

[EMTNLSS]

I'm planning on getting all the BMR arms and cradle lockout kit soon. Debating on if I want the diff lockout kit also. I think i'll get the arms and cradle lockout and see how it is then get the diff lockout. Then i'll be able to tell the difference with it added.

[F1FTY]

Originally Posted by PolynesianPowerhouse

I think I'm gonna have to be the crazy one and put it ON the daily

just been reading and watching some vids pertaining to the 5th gen and the new mustang... and when you see how much the rear diff flex, and then read about throttle response... it seems the less flex, the quicker the power is transferred to the ground.

trying to get rid of some fe2 slop and build my pineapple-LE

Do it.

[cmitchell17]

Can anyone explain to me how they market putting more power to the ground by eliminating flex and energy absorbed by the stock pieces? This make no sense to me?

What I'm trying to say is I know the stock pieces are able to absorb more energy for NVH, but this amount of energy is so negligible that its probably not even measureable. I know there are other advantages in having stiffer components and for one reason you can better approximate and calculate whats going on with the suspension setup instead of having so many unknown variables in how much slop and play is in things. For example, with solid mounts you can guareentee your camber is at a certain setting rather than having to overcompensate on your camber to compensate for extra play and flex in the stock pieces.

[Risky Justice]

Look at it like this: ever smacked something really hard with a wooden baseball bat and aluminum? One absorbs the shock better while the other you seem to really feel in your hand. I don't know how big a difference it makes, but that is energy and I suppose it could be considered waste to have it absorbed before it reaches the wheels.

[HyperspaceTurd]

Camber plates are next.

Then this.

It's very appealing since they actually seem to require less labor than the cradle bushing kit and it pretty much does the same thing.

[Ryephile]

Originally Posted by HyperspaceTurd

...It's very appealing since they actually seem to require less labor than the cradle bushing kit and it pretty much does the same thing.

No. The cradle bushings keep dynamic suspension alignment more consistent. The diff bushings add drivetrain shock in an attempt to cure wheel-hop problems trying to dead-hook. The latter are pointless in a road-course setup.

-->OP: are you having wheel hop problems? You say you're trying to get rid of your FE2 slop. Start by moving to FE4 or FEA front and rear control links.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

-->OP: are you having wheel hop problems? You say you're trying to get rid of your FE2 slop. Start by moving to FE4 or FEA front and rear control links.

I read this and wondered the same sort of thing. If you're looking to tighten up the suspension, why are you focusing in on the differential?

[PolynesianPowerhouse]

Originally Posted by cmitchell17

Can anyone explain to me how they market putting more power to the ground by eliminating flex and energy absorbed by the stock pieces? This make no sense to me?

What I'm trying to say is I know the stock pieces are able to absorb more energy for NVH, but this amount of energy is so negligible that its probably not even measureable. I know there are other advantages in having stiffer components and for one reason you can better approximate and calculate whats going on with the suspension setup instead of having so many unknown variables in how much slop and play is in things. For example, with solid mounts you can guareentee your camber is at a certain setting rather than having to overcompensate on your camber to compensate for extra play and flex in the stock pieces.

I'll take a go at it..... from what i've seen and felt from current upgrades...the stock pieces, the rubber bushings, have holes and voids in them. those holes and voids allow flex and absorption of sound and energy.

its the same ordeal is nike shoes that had the air pods at the rear heels for cushioning. there was a structure that had voids even though filled with air.

a solid or more solid piece, will transfer a bit more noise (if you get scientific and measure DB/sound) and more energy. this is what the lockout kit does... it fills the voids in the stock piece so that the rubber.

think of an egg, just a hollow shell, nothing inside. easy to crush.

an egg with the actual egg inside, still relatively easy to crush, but more resistance.

now make the egg inside the shell more solid by freezing it...way harder to crush.

basically the more dense the inside of the bushing is, the more nvh that will be transferred and the more consistent alignment settings and performance will become.

back when I was into j-bodies, the transmission mount had voids in it.... rather than wait for prothane, or energy suspension or any of the smaller companies to produce one... we got a spare mount, filled it with window urethane and let it cure for a few days... swapped the mounts with the stock one, and for the 13$ price of a tube of urethane for windows, you had an upgrades stiffer mount simply from filling the voids.

I don't know if you've seen the visual videos on this, but its worth a look. start at 37 seconds


now, you've said the amount of energy is "negligible". that's a term that relative to what you use the car for. On a drag track, I've done back to back runs where I've spun on both runs from wheel hop, and had a .462 and .488 as the end of my et times. reducing wheel hop...usually the goal with most rear end mods, can easily improve those times. considering I'm starting with a FE2 suspension, my parts aren't as stout as SS/1LE - FE3 and FE4 parts. most of the year I'm doing autoX... constant, left and right turns... and just like tires, you don't want too much flex... in the same sense, a stiffer tire offers more crisp and predictable handling. the same as a stiffer bushing.

there's a reason why GM themselves opted to use a Spherical bearing in the front links on the 1LE suspension, VS the rubber bushings on the SS and V6/2.0T models. that spherical bearing has virtually ZERO slop. the ZL1 1LE handling kit, offers stiffer bushings in all the areas on the knuckles, and stiffer bushings or spherical bearings... less slop= more handling.

also wheel hop is an IRS drawback, which is expected, but its also a a cushion, that allows flex. the more flex, the more wheel hop.

https://youtu.be/00iB0NMKzH4?t=3m54s

remember, you see a lot of really high hp cars... but only a very few of em put the power down efficiently. many times you'll see a less powerful car go quicker that has suspension mods, cause its utilizing the power it has efficiently. for an underbuilt suspension car, to do the same, it may need 50-100+ more hp to overcome the lack of suspension.

[PolynesianPowerhouse]

Originally Posted by Ryephile

No. The cradle bushings keep dynamic suspension alignment more consistent. The diff bushings add drivetrain shock in an attempt to cure wheel-hop problems trying to dead-hook. The latter are pointless in a road-course setup.

-->OP: are you having wheel hop problems? You say you're trying to get rid of your FE2 slop. Start by moving to FE4 or FEA front and rear control links.

I was getting a bit the last cold drag track day. once its warm enough for autoX to start back up, not too much of a worry, ya know

but on the control links, I have pretty much all BMR rear currently arm wise. I do have the cradle lockout, toe rods, and front spherical bearing link from GM to install from the 1LE. I should be good there.

but was looking at the amount the diff bushings flex when you apply power...reason I was looking into if it would help or not. I don't do drag racing, but maybe two time frames in a year. early spring, late fall. but if the bushings flex as much as I've seen on vids and from my old go pro, could that flex be eliminated and translated into more power to the ground? or more so the power being applied quicker to the ground.

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

I read this and wondered the same sort of thing. If you're looking to tighten up the suspension, why are you focusing in on the differential?

see above. I was looking more towards the time of applying power as to the power being sent to the wheels. as in overall ET effects. not so much a road course or autoX endeavor, but more focused on getting off the line on a drag track.

also I figure since I'm gonna be under there to install the cradle lockout soon....while under there get this solved as well.


thoughts?

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by PolynesianPowerhouse

I was getting a bit the last cold drag track day. once its warm enough for autoX to start back up, not too much of a worry, ya know

but on the control links, I have pretty much all BMR rear currently arm wise. I do have the cradle lockout, toe rods, and front spherical bearing link from GM to install from the 1LE. I should be good there.

but was looking at the amount the diff bushings flex when you apply power...reason I was looking into if it would help or not. I don't do drag racing, but maybe two time frames in a year. early spring, late fall. but if the bushings flex as much as I've seen on vids and from my old go pro, could that flex be eliminated and translated into more power to the ground? or more so the power being applied quicker to the ground.



see above. I was looking more towards the time of applying power as to the power being sent to the wheels. as in overall ET effects. not so much a road course or autoX endeavor, but more focused on getting off the line on a drag track.

also I figure since I'm gonna be under there to install the cradle lockout soon....while under there get this solved as well.


thoughts?

Gotcha.

Could you help me understand what a "lockout" is...I think I know, but I haven't seen that term before this thread.

[PolynesianPowerhouse]

Originally Posted by Mr. Wyndham

Gotcha.

Could you help me understand what a "lockout" is...I think I know, but I haven't seen that term before this thread.

notta prob.

https://www.bmrsuspension.com/siteart/install/BK060.pdf

that should be a good visual for the diff, but the lockout kits are basically where you don't remove the bushing, but you just fill the voids in the bushings with a solid material (removable if its too much for you, you plan to sell the car and wanna go back to stock), and solid end caps, so that they don't move.

I think this before and after video is a better visual, its for a mustang, but same principle and you can see the bushings better.