If you believe GM will build a GEN 7 ICE Camaro, Read This

[olrocker]

Originally Posted by 90503

FWIW, a similar scenario occurred when the first California emissions and smog checks were put in place during the late 60s and 70s. It didn't matter how lousy or poorly your car ran from horrible smog equipment or smog "tuning" adjustments from a mandatory smog check.

Hot rodders could prove their cars ran better, produced less emissions and got better mileage without any of the smog equipment....Didn't matter, too bad for everyone. Any common sense all fell on the state's deaf ears. Get your stupid smog check, then fix it back to common sense after you got your smog sticker. Sometimes it wasn't worth the hassle. I got rid of several cars just to avoid the smog-check bs.

Oh well, so much for the good old days...lol...You're whipping a dead horse if you think the state will realize any common sense at this point. Whatever it takes to eliminate fossil fuels and ICE will be employed in some manner over the near future.

My parents bought a 1974 Nova (not an SS) brand new with the optional 350 and Quadrajet, factory A/C, Turbo 350 trans, and sport wheel package. It was white with black and white houndstooth buckets and console. Since I was born in ‘77 it was the first car I remember my parents driving.

My Dad said after driving it for a while he was unimpressed with the performance considering he paid extra for the 350 and QJ. So my uncle being a mechanic told him to bring it to his house and leave it for a weekend.

When he picked it up the catalytic converter and smog pump were in the trunk.

They owned that car 10 years and Dad hated to sell it even though it had started rusting bad.

Gotta love Ohio - only a few counties have smog checks

[detamble13]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

I think it’s logical to believe that a Camaro based on an electric platform with a small displacement ICE is a very real possibility. An unaided ICE very much less so.

Hey James you might have covered this one before but I can't remember. Why does the CT4 and CT5 continue to exist while the Camaro was axed?

I'm interested to see how the new Charger sells and if it's success or failure impacts gm's decision with Camaro. I guess if it fails we'll never know but I feel Mustangs 2005 retro design pushed Dodge and Chevy to respond with something. Not sure the Charger will be that successful but I do appreciate that Dodge hasn't abandoned the segment.

[olrocker]

Originally Posted by detamble13

Hey James you might have covered this one before but I can't remember. Why does the CT4 and CT5 continue to exist while the Camaro was axed?

I'm interested to see how the new Charger sells and if it's success or failure impacts gm's decision with Camaro. I guess if it fails we'll never know but I feel Mustangs 2005 retro design pushed Dodge and Chevy to respond with something. Not sure the Charger will be that successful but I do appreciate that Dodge hasn't abandoned the segment.

Bill Ford jr was emphatically clear the Mustang will continue on with an ICE V8, no electric or hybrid assist, and true 3 pedal manual for the long term. He said everyone at Ford is absolutely dedicated to keeping the ICE -V8 alive and well for the long term in Mustang.

As a side note the sales have gone up since GM axed Camaro and Stellantis put a radio speaker in place of a Hemi in Charger/Challenger.

[Capricio]

Originally Posted by olrocker

Bill Ford jr was emphatically clear the Mustang will continue on with an ICE V8, no electric or hybrid assist, and true 3 pedal manual for the long term. He said everyone at Ford is absolutely dedicated to keeping the ICE -V8 alive and well for the long term in Mustang.

As a side note the sales have gone up since GM axed Camaro and Stellantis put a radio speaker in place of a Hemi in Charger/Challenger.

Meanwhile, back in the court of Queen Mary...

https://jalopnik.com/gm-to-white-col...-or-1851644340

[olrocker]

Originally Posted by Capricio

Meanwhile, back in the court of Queen Mary...

https://jalopnik.com/gm-to-white-col...-or-1851644340

That’s great for Ford. Because unlike GM Ford is dismantling their EV projects and will need more ICE engineers for the future.

Time to get the resumes ready. If I worked at GM today I’d be taking a look at houses near Dearborn.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by detamble13

Hey James you might have covered this one before but I can't remember. Why does the CT4 and CT5 continue to exist while the Camaro was axed?

I'm interested to see how the new Charger sells and if it's success or failure impacts gm's decision with Camaro. I guess if it fails we'll never know but I feel Mustangs 2005 retro design pushed Dodge and Chevy to respond with something. Not sure the Charger will be that successful but I do appreciate that Dodge hasn't abandoned the segment.

From an operational standpoint I would think it has to do with which parts of the plant needed to be converted when. I haven’t been in that plant for a long, long time, so I don’t know if the two products are together throughout the whole assembly process or where exactly they come together. From a marketing perspective, if Camaro was X% of Chevrolet volume. CT4/CT5 are 10X% of Cadillac volume. You can’t totally starve the dealers. So if the EV replacements are delayed, the ICE versions have to be extended.

You did notice probably that CT5 got a mid-cycle but CT4 did not. I can’t help but think that this may be due to the original timing for the two to exit. The recent decision to extend them both for a year or two may have pushed the CT4 beyond the original sunset timing. If it was originally set to sunset after ‘24 or ‘25 MY there would have been no value to a mid-cycle, so maybe one was never planned.

[GreenZLE]

Originally Posted by Capricio

Meanwhile, back in the court of Queen Mary...

https://jalopnik.com/gm-to-white-col...-or-1851644340

What an absolute idiot! GM found someone to lawn dart the company for sure!!!!!

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by olrocker

That’s great for Ford. Because unlike GM Ford is dismantling their EV projects and will need more ICE engineers for the future.

Time to get the resumes ready. If I worked at GM today I’d be taking a look at houses near Dearborn.

Proof that Ford is “dismantling” their EV projects?

Let me give you a little information to the contrary.

• Ford bought a dilapidated train station that had been abandoned for decades, spent 2 or 3 years and tens of millions of dollars to restore it and set it up as their EV division headquarters.
• As part of the restoration, they paid to have marble extracted from the mines that supplied the marble for the original train station. That meant reopening and operating the mines. It also meant reconstructing the roads in and out of the mines.
• Ford also installed the world’s first inductive charging road on one of the streets adjacent to the new EV headquarters so that they can work on development of in-the-road wireless charging
• Ford’s “skunkworks” project just leaked that what they’ve been working on, the first project to come out of the skunkworks, will be a compact or mid-sized EV pickup.

Ford and GM are both revising their product launch plans. In Ford’s case, they are shelving their 7-passenger SUV EV project and pulling ahead their compact / mid-sized EV pickup truck project. They are still working on an all new platform for mid-sized utilities.

From what I can tell, GM is stretching out the timing of the EV products they intend to launch. No more forcing Cadillac to all EV by 2030. It’ll happen when it happens. Could be 2032. Could be 2035. But they do already have Lyriq, Optiq, and Escalade IQ shipping to dealers and Vistiq is soon to follow. FWIW, Lyriq is the 2nd best selling Cadillac over the last 3 or 4 months. GM as a whole is still intending to sell 200,000 EVs by the end of 2024, down from an original 300,000 projection and 250,000 correction announced in 2023. Blazer EV and Equinox EV delays really hurt them in ‘23 but both are selling fairly well now.

[ItsChristianInHD]

Originally Posted by tenargo57

They were thinking it doesn't sell well compared to other models and doesn't have the profit margin of a Cadillac or Corvette. https://investor.gm.com/static-files...7-fa478654e9e7

It’s definitely about profit per car.

YouTubers/media kept saying “no one wants a Camaro” but ask anyone that tried to order one from 2020-2024. You couldn’t get one.

[ItsChristianInHD]

Originally Posted by Capricio

Meanwhile, back in the court of Queen Mary...

https://jalopnik.com/gm-to-white-col...-or-1851644340

This is insane.

I won’t be surprised if Al or the Camaro team (what’s left) being pushed out. I’m sure it’s not fun being inside GM at the moment with Savagegeese saying there’s a “media blackout” in regards to Camaro.

I’m willing to bet there’s people WANTING to finish a 7th Gen coupe.

[detamble13]

Originally Posted by olrocker

Bill Ford jr was emphatically clear the Mustang will continue on with an ICE V8, no electric or hybrid assist, and true 3 pedal manual for the long term. He said everyone at Ford is absolutely dedicated to keeping the ICE -V8 alive and well for the long term in Mustang.

As a side note the sales have gone up since GM axed Camaro and Stellantis put a radio speaker in place of a Hemi in Charger/Challenger.

I watched that Jay Leno Garage episode as well. My intention is to keep my Camaro as long as possible but if/when it needs to be replaced I'll definitely look in Fords direction. The funny thing was when I bought my car my brother in law was a Ford dealer. I tried to convey the passion I had for the Camaro and how I had always wanted a first gen and this captured that for me. I don't think he got it but it doesn't matter as they're divorced now anyways.

Any new Camaro should attempt to capture the "must have" feeling and hopefully that starts with it being a 2 door car.

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

From an operational standpoint I would think it has to do with which parts of the plant needed to be converted when. I haven’t been in that plant for a long, long time, so I don’t know if the two products are together throughout the whole assembly process or where exactly they come together. From a marketing perspective, if Camaro was X% of Chevrolet volume. CT4/CT5 are 10X% of Cadillac volume. You can’t totally starve the dealers. So if the EV replacements are delayed, the ICE versions have to be extended.

You did notice probably that CT5 got a mid-cycle but CT4 did not. I can’t help but think that this may be due to the original timing for the two to exit. The recent decision to extend them both for a year or two may have pushed the CT4 beyond the original sunset timing. If it was originally set to sunset after ‘24 or ‘25 MY there would have been no value to a mid-cycle, so maybe one was never planned.

Thanks for the info!

[olrocker]

https://www.hotcars.com/ford-manual-...will-continue/

https://www.motortrend.com/news/jeep...24-sales-news/

As GM and Stellantis throw in the towel on V8 sport coupes with a stick Ford is moping the floor with it.

[Capricio]

Originally Posted by detamble13

Any new Camaro should attempt to capture the "must have" feeling and hopefully that starts with it being a 2 door car.
!

Speaking only for myself, I am bracing for a tofurkey Thanksgiving disappointment as they reveal a 2 motor 4 door BEV crossover with a Camaro badge on it, ala E-Mustang. Fully ruining the brand credibility, not just borrowing from it. I hope I'm wrong.

[olrocker]

Originally Posted by Capricio

Speaking only for myself, I am bracing for a tofurkey Thanksgiving disappointment as they reveal a 2 motor 4 door BEV crossover with a Camaro badge on it, ala E-Mustang. Fully ruining the brand credibility, not just borrowing from it. I hope I'm wrong.

They already have the Camaro SUV, they just call it a Blazer. But the interior is almost a spot-on copy of Camaro’s.

My guess is that they’ll come out with some kind of cute little “hot hatch” like the Cruze hatchback and make it “sporty” and call that a Camaro.