Feds Propose Making Black Boxes Standard In New Cars

[upflying]

Originally Posted by The_Blur

I am not going to express an opinion on this matter, but with all government regulations and proposals, I have very serious advice for everyone:

Call your elected officials and share your opinion!

Shoulda done that 15 years ago when the boxes were just starting to be installed.

[Nessal]

IMO, the user should be able to not pay for the feature if he or she opts out. For those that likes to be monitored, they can have at it.

[Angrybird 12]

Originally Posted by upflying

Shoulda done that 15 years ago when the boxes were just starting to be installed.

Nobody knew they were being being installed back then, it wasn't general public knowledge. Besides the auto manufacturers were doing it mainly for warranty claims. The government was not involved then. Now they are.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by upflying

Few people would voluntarily purchase an EDR option for their new car.

Didn't think so either. But at least it would put its existence out there for all to see at car purchase time, without a cost penalty to GM et al for doing so. You might get a few more taking it if there was a little $ incentive to the sales force for pushing it a bit.

Some insurance companies (Progressive) are offering insurance discounts if you voluntarily install a code reader/memory into your OBDII port.

I figured this was going to come up sooner or later, and it's somewhat more widely known. Since one of the things those devices track is the number of "hard braking events", lots of hard braking earns you the right to pay a higher insurance premium.

That would be regardless of whether you're a garden-variety moron driver who ends up stomping on the brakes due to inattention (people that insurance companies certainly have the right to identify) or are intentionally keeping current with being able to properly modulate hard braking all by yourself (a road course/autocross skill that does directly transfer over to your street driving).

Just swapping to a more aggressive brake pad formulation would very likely put somebody whose braking was consistently just below the tracking device's threshhold just over it at least in the short run. The example I know of here is Hawk HP+ pads, which while still legitimately streetable really do bite that much harder than HPS or most any other street-only pad.


The larger issue is that those who would continue to extend the monitoring and regulation of individual lives either don't stop to consider the unintended downstream consequences of their decisions - or they do and figure people won't notice or care if it's done gradually and quietly enough. Never mind that lots of people apparently believe that individual behavior, skill, and responsibility should always be considered to be of lesser value than arbitrary regulation and control by others.


Norm

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by The_Blur

I am not going to express an opinion on this matter, but with all government regulations and proposals, I have very serious advice for everyone:

Call your elected officials and share your opinion!

Ha ha haaaa. Blur you are so funny. It so much easier to come on Camaro5 and complain.

Originally Posted by Nessal

IMO, the user should be able to not pay for the feature if he or she opts out. For those that likes to be monitored, they can have at it.

Sorry this isn't intended to be optional.

It is being done primarily to help with situations like the Audi sudden acceleration years ago and the most recent slew of issues with Toyota.

Yes it can and will be used in criminal procedings regarding the vehicle, but it won't tell anyone where you were, just what the most recent 6 to 10 seconds of certain vehicle parameters WERE.

This is not to monitor or report. It records. And if you havn't done anything in your car criminally or caused injury to person or property with your car you have nothing to worry about.

It simply stops people from lying.......................is that bad?

So you can choose to not buy a new car. Buying a new car is not a right. You choose to do so and this is part of the choice.

If you choose to buy a hand gun you follow the rules. Regardless of your right to bear arms.

But again, what you do with your car IS your business. If you happen to get in an accident where someone needs to see the last 6 to 10 seconds of wha the car was doing (injury or damage) then this is nothing more than the eye witness standing there watching the accident only with more detail.

[Angrybird 12]

Think of this scenario. It happened to my first wife. Unfortunately this was before black box technology, so it was his word against hers. Guess who ended up paying?
You are approaching a stop sign as you get close you are going slow coming to a stop, just then the car at the stop sign throws it in reverse slamming into your car. He jumps out cussing claiming you ran into him. With the black box information it can be proven with the info from his car he was in reverse with giving it some throttle . Yours can prove you we're almost stopped with brakes applied and no throttle.
It could stop insurance fraud like this.

[Norm Peterson]

Originally Posted by Number 3

This is not to monitor or report. It records. And if you havn't done anything in your car criminally or caused injury to person or property with your car you have nothing to worry about.

So far, anyway.

To assume it will stay exactly as it is at this instant in time is to stick your head in the sand. The history of vehicle regulation virtually guarantees that the scope of EDR will gradually increase.


Norm

[Number 3]

Originally Posted by Norm Peterson

So far, anyway.

To assume it will stay exactly as it is at this instant in time is to stick your head in the sand. The history of vehicle regulation virtually guarantees that the scope of EDR will gradually increase.


Norm

Don't disagree on what could be. The technology exists to do what everyone is affraid of. But this isn't that technology.

Not sticking my head in the sand anymore than linking registering my firearms to someone coming to my door to take them. They aren't the same thing and they are far from it.

This is the black box that is the first thing they look for when a plane crashes. It helps reconstruct what happened. It isn't spying but it keeps people from lying.

Seriously guys this isn't spying. It's a long way from spying and if you really want to get worried about stuff worry about the technology you don't know about.

If you think in the world we live in today that what you do with your phone, your computer, your bank, your credit card aren't being tracked you are putting your collective heads in the sand. This is just a recording device that can confirm what your car did in the last 6 to 10 seconds prior to a crash.

Why when I bought something on line from Sears was my credit card shut down? Because it's being tracked by algorithms that the credit card company uses to monitor my spending patterns to alert to fraud. That information is just as easily accessible in fact more so. For this they have to have your car after an accident.

And again, if you haven't been in a bad crash and you drive away it's simply going to record the next 6 to 10 seconds.

Black box.......airplane crash..........most important thing to find AFTER the crash to discover what happened. No different.

[ShnOmac]

Originally Posted by Number 3

And again, if you haven't been in a bad crash and you drive away it's simply going to record the next 6 to 10 seconds.

It's not monitoring your vehicle like a lot of people in this thread are implying.....

[Angrybird 12]

Just throwing this out but I can see it escalating to making accident notification standard equipment in all cars. I wouldn't mind it if it didn't cost a monthly fee like OnStar to have that one feature.