Ressurecting Pontiac?

[99-LS1-SS]

Originally Posted by jrc1122

GM had horrible marketing of the G8. And it didn't help that it debuted as a new model of RWD Thirsty V8 right when gas hit $4.50/ gallon. When gas started falling the economy took a huge hit, then shortly after that pontiac was announced dead. And oddly enough that is when everyone started buying up the G8s. They out sold Buick, and Saturn, and Hummer, and I think Cadillac the months after learning pontiac was going away. (rebates helped with that admittedly)

Any objective car review I have seen states that the G8 is the best Pontiac ever built, as far as fit/ finish, quality, and argueably design.

:( I am sad to see it only have a 2 year run. well 2.5 model years to be exact. 2008, 2009, and 2009.5

Just when pontiac was getting cool with the Solstice GXP, and the G8 GT/ GXP and even the G8 base (V6). They finally got away from cheesy body cladding and bam, GM is effected by the credit drying up. They had to make cuts, and Pontiac made the most sense.

I too would like to see pontiac back.

I've owned 3 pontiacs
And the G8 is several classes ahead of the previous two

2002 Pontiac Sunfire GT
2002 Pontiac Trans Am WS6
now: 2009 Pontiac G8 GT

I've owned 3 Pontiacs also. 93 TA, 99 TA and 09 G8 GXP.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by meanmike

I still dont get why they did'nt drop Buick for the US market and keep Pontiac. I know Buick sell's great in China so let them keep it. It's not like it would'nt be possible.

If they did that, no. 1 -- Pontiac would still be losing money...and no. 2, they'd still have to split resources across 1 more brand. Despite being in another country, the brand still sits beneath GM's umbrella -- and would need funding.

Their plans for Buick, imo -- are a cross between Caddy, Chevy, and Pontiac. It won't be the granny-brand anymore...

[Coldpants]

Warning Rant Ahead

And meandering of a mind driven mad by waiting my car

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

If they did that, no. 1 -- Pontiac would still be losing money...and no. 2, they'd still have to split resources across 1 more brand. Despite being in another country, the brand still sits beneath GM's umbrella -- and would need funding.

Their plans for Buick, imo -- are a cross between Caddy, Chevy, and Pontiac. It won't be the granny-brand anymore...

Buick's problem is it has not identity and no longer has any style and is engaging in a pathetic attempt to go with the whole retro trend. In fact the Camaro IMO is the first time GM got retro right. The Lucerne is a uninspired boring POS that reminds me of K cars. Putting those ventricles on the side only further accentuates the lack of vision and empathizes how long Harley Earl has been dead. The car on the top needs paint, chrome and the correct wheel covers and still generates a crowd. The car on the bottom would look good on fire.



Anyway no car will pull back GM or bring back Pontiac. Reading this forum and personal experience with GM and other car companies seems to show GM's real problem. Its piss poor customer service. There is story after story of ways GM has unnecessarily pissed off a customer. Letting there dealerships run wild, yes I know they are independent but they carry the GM name and it seems that name has no standard. GM,s policy of shrugging at most practices of their dealerships looks like an endorsement of those policies. And things like the GM money back guarantee mean nothing when you see the company looking for anyway to get out of its warranties. That shows people more than anything what GM thinks of its cars. Build a performance car and then violate its warranty when people drive it like a performance car? That's a great deal, Lets see I'll make a boat and guarrenty it for four times its value but the warrenty is void if it come in contact with the following chemicals H20 Argon, Nitrogen or see Lee Iaccoca and fail to get out of his way.

Ok, I'm done. And just to be on topic Pontiac should come back to bring back the Fire chicken.

[Coldpants]

and i see my typos and i am sleepy I WILL NOT EDIT!!!
Go fire chicken.

[Supermans]

I will make a bet that GM will resurrect only one car from the Pontiac brand once the Camaro sales slow down.. Yes, it will be a re-badged Camaro turned Firebird just like the old days.. We have all these concepts and two already built that show promise. I say five years from now.. And you can all quote me on this one.. Now it may simply be called a Chevy Firebird, however that would be fine by the fans..

[Vega]

See i disagree with a lot of whats said on here, people say itd be a horrible idea but then again they said that about the Camaro and look what a success it has been...also i stand behind my claim that the Camaro is pulling GM out of the fire, maybe not completely, and maybe its not there yet, but its definatly doing a LOT in that sense, the Camaro is undoubtibly GM's most popular model right now and they just cant make them fast enough to sell them, all that publicity and all that good marketing does reap financial rewards yes, but mainly the reward of winning back the American consumers...so yeah i stand behind my former claim, if its not a major financial help (which i believe it is) then it most definatly is a major marketing help.

I think most people are biased against Pontiac because they remember the re-badged crap of the 90s'...thats totally not what i would want brought back, i would want the old Pontiac back, a brand that is completely its own focused on creating quality performance cars at a cheap price, not this re-badging disaster that it evolved into.

I think people under estimate how big of a fan base Pontiac has, and how big of an impact the brand could have if just done right again...i mean what was the last car they made that wasnt a re-badged model? The Grand Am, and it was a major success, then the G8 was also released as the only Zeta car for its time and not a re-badged model and it was an AMAZING car but it never had the chance to blossom under the Camaro's release and GM management's personal vendetta against the brand. I just dont think the brand doesnt get enough credit at all.

[SWAT 79]

If pontiac could stay, but have a very limited line-up, like 3 or 4 good selling cars, the g8, g6, solstice and bring back that t/a. They can sell those at any gm dealership since its not some gigantic line and they can still keep the most profitable cars. I might not ever buy gm again because of what they did to the g8. I was seriously considering one, but now, I don't even know if i would get a camaro because of this government owned bull shit.


Also, don't forget, many dealerships tried to come together and buy pontiac as a subsidary of gm....no other dealership or private contractor did that for any other dying gm brand. The head guys at gm however said no, which will tell you that it was a POLITICAL decision not an ECONOMICAL one.

[DGthe3]

There isn't really a market for the types of cars that would be pontiacs, not enough to justify the cost of re-starting the brand anyway. Pontiac's glory days were about performance cars, thats why enthusiasts like us would like to see it return. But in the coming years, performance will be taking a back seat to fuel economy. I would have liked to see Pontiac and Saturn as a sort of ying/yang combo. Use the same platforms but ditch the economy models for the Pontiacs and the top performing Saturns. But since Saturn is dead now anyways ... this is but a dream in my head.

Originally Posted by a_Username

I thought the G6 was the V6 version and the G8 was the V8 version? Seemed logical to me because of the corresponding numbers lol.

No. And the the G5 wasn't an I5 verson, and the G3 wasn't going to be an I3 either, in case you were wondering.

The G6 stood for Grand Am: 6th Generation. Its the same as the Malibu or Aura. G8 was Grand Prix: 8th Generation. As for the rest, they used smaller numbers for smaller cars.

[a_Username]

So the GT gives it the bigger engine?

[Vega]

Well first the thing about "government owned" ive argued this a lot too, lol, especially with dickhead Ford guys on YouTube. GM went into reconstructive bankruptcy in which it used government loans to emerge as a new company first known as like NGMCO or something like that and was re-named General Motors Company while the old GM was liquidated, now the US Treasury is claiming a majority ownership of GM but only because GM owes back the loans, its like a collatoral system so that if GM starts to go under again they can go "hey, we own your ass fat boy and we're liquidating so we can get our money back" (lmao, as put in my words) But once GM pays back its debts (which it is doing at a rate of $10 billion per year currently) it will be a fully independant company again, and also in 2010 they are going to go IPO and allow consumers to buy stock again...in basic terms GM is owned by GM but the Treasury has collatoral in it, thats why everyone thinks GM is government owned when it isnt, and its soon to be owned by the American citizens through stocks...and honestly i MUCH preffer an American company owned by the American citizens themselves over any other ownership...my oppinion though

*takes a breath*

LOL, so anyways putting that together with Pontiac, basically it means the government can never say "you're not making this car" because GM is still going to make cars based on consumer demand over all...if people want a Trans Am and the government wants a Prius, goddamnit we're getting a Trans Am, LOL, cause they still have to appeal to the buyers first and foremost, the people keep them in business through sales, not the government. Also i really liked that idea SWAT 79 had where Pontiac was just a 3 or 4 car brand, that would be AWSOME because it would be a small stake in the company and being so could have full reign over itself without GM going "hey you're a big part of us and you're giving us a bad name with all your performance products" Also with few models they could focus more on improving those models rather than promoting tons of them, basically the "Quality over quantity" theory =)

[jrc1122]

Originally Posted by duder4thgen

This.

HUH?
________
Mazda rx-2 history

[Vega]

Originally Posted by jrc1122

HUH?

I agree with your former post, the G8 was an amazing car, it really didnt get the rep it desirved, it had everything, styling, luxury, performance, quality, affordability, its probly about the closest to the perfect car that we've ever seen haha, even MotorTrend noted how much it totally trumped the Dodge Charger in pretty much all aspects...i think people lost faith in Pontiac right when they were really about to hit us with their best shot. When GM rebadges stuff with Pontiac it sucks but when Pontiac gets their way they always bring 5 star hits every time, like i said the Grand Am was a huge hit and the G8 was a huge hit for the short run it had, i truely believe the G8 could have been a huge workhorse for GM if they would have given it more of a chance...the Camaro is on the same platform and is an amazing car but i really believe the G8 would have out-done it in the economy and family marketing

[Camaro_Corvette]

Originally Posted by Dragoneye

Buick is a Solid brand-name. Unadulterated, though currently somewhat stale. The things coming down the pipe for the next two-three years will change that, though.

And GMC is GM's second-most profitable brand.....

And you can't chop Chevy or Caddy.

See where I was coming from?

[Mr. Wyndham]

Coldpants; roger on the rant warning. I want to respond anyways.

Originally Posted by Coldpants

Its piss poor customer service.

Well...I guess I just disagree, here. And so does JDPower......
GM is currently, imo, the most customer-focused car company out there right now. Their dealerships on the other hand are a different case altogether. But still, GM dealers rate very high on customer-satisfaction surveys, well above most of the imports.

Originally Posted by Coldpants

GM,s policy of shrugging at most practices of their dealerships looks like an endorsement of those policies. And things like the GM money back guarantee mean nothing when you see the company looking for anyway to get out of its warranties. That shows people more than anything what GM thinks of its cars. Build a performance car and then violate its warranty when people drive it like a performance car? That's a great deal, Lets see I'll make a boat and guarrenty it for four times its value but the warrenty is void if it come in contact with the following chemicals H20 Argon, Nitrogen or see Lee Iaccoca and fail to get out of his way.

It sounds to me like you're describing Nissan, or Toyota....as for the performance warranty thing...I assume you're speaking about the Corvette. That car can take care of itself under racing conditions, and so there shouldn't be any warranty issues...IF you're not a suck-driver, which is why they shun racing in the warranty. Let's put it this way, how would you like to warranty a screwdriver. And some fool uses it to hammer a nail, and brings it back all bent, crying. You'd tell them to take a hike.

As far as your comments on Buick. I can't disagree with you regarding their recent lineup (EXCLUDING the Enclave, and LaCrosse). Those two exceptions define their future....it will have its identity back very soon. It's already spanking Lexus in quality ratings.

Originally Posted by Supermans

I will make a bet that GM will resurrect only one car from the Pontiac brand once the Camaro sales slow down.. Yes, it will be a re-badged Camaro turned Firebird just like the old days.. We have all these concepts and two already built that show promise. I say five years from now.. And you can all quote me on this one.. Now it may simply be called a Chevy Firebird, however that would be fine by the fans..

That's a bold prediction...I think you are right about ressurecting only one Pontiac, but a "Chevy Firebird"??...$20 sound good?