2017 Dodge Challenger T/A 392!!!!!

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by Kobra_Klutch

It's funny there are some really upset SRT 392/Scatpack owners who don't like the idea of the base 5.7 getting the same visual treatments of their cars. I say that because many people on here have similar issues with the V6/1LE. I like the name T/A over ScatPack and the differences in the packages. I can run a slightly wider tire on the newer 9.5 rims that sport 275s stock. But I also like how badass the SS/1LE looks.

I agree with you Motorhead the Challenger is under-appreciated; big time. But they get all the looks when they roll by--menacing.

275s all around will be a big improvement compared to the ridiculous 245s the Scatpack sports. This is going to be a great seller and a boost to Challenger sales. The Scatpack was a huge success but there were issues which have now been addressed. Pricing this car in the low to mid 40s will immediately eat into Chevy's 2SS pricing and may take a bite out of future 1LE sales.

[SpeedIsLife]

Mopars advertising has been utterly on point lately....I'm interested to see what they do with these

[SuperSound]

Wait, why are some of you guys thinking this will do anything to 1LE sales? Did you miss the part where this is the same suspension already available as an option on RTs? Sure it gets 6 pots and wider tires, but that's it. These cars will handle no better than the SRT does and when exactly did it start competing with the 1LE? It can't even compete against the 1SS with standard suspension on a track. So again why would anyone truly looking at a 1LE (and not simply to say they have one and it be grocery getter all it's life). I know all too well there are idiots that do this kind of thing, but a 1SS or 2SS is still the competition for this T/A. And we all know T/A is still seriously lacking in handling ability based on what it includes.

As for the T/A taking a bite into 2SS sales, I think you forgot to read the part about $45k starting price for the T/A 392. That's without the added $1400 for the essential A8, which is the only thing making the car competitive in straight line acceleration to the M6 and A8 Camaros. So who besides someone who already wanted the Dodge for other qualities (size, comfort, styling) would pay more for less than what a 2SS offers?

Then there's the fact the 1LE V6 costs less and will likely run circles around the 5.7 T/A on the track and very close to it in straight line. That should highlight how not a track package this new T/A is. It's simply rebranding and reshuffling parts already available on the Challenger and turning up the hype machine.

Kobra made the best point about this new package, for those who don't like the bee or the "Shit Pack" comments...this is a great deal. You get all of the really good features of the SRT and Scat Pack in a model that slots between them. It essentially fixes the two biggest weaknesses of the Scat Packs, just adequate brakes and small tires. But you end up paying over $5k more for these. When you think of what the 1LE offers for just a bit more than that, it doesn't seem like such a deal.

[motorhead]

Originally Posted by SuperSound

Wait, why are some of you guys thinking this will do anything to 1LE sales? Did you miss the part where this is the same suspension already available as an option on RTs? Sure it gets 6 pots and wider tires, but that's it. These cars will handle no better than the SRT does and when exactly did it start competing with the 1LE? It can't even compete against the 1SS with standard suspension on a track. So again why would anyone truly looking at a 1LE (and not simply to say they have one and it be grocery getter all it's life). I know all too well there are idiots that do this kind of thing, but a 1SS or 2SS is still the competition for this T/A. And we all know T/A is still seriously lacking in handling ability based on what it includes.

As for the T/A taking a bite into 2SS sales, I think you forgot to read the part about $45k starting price for the T/A 392. That's without the added $1400 for the essential A8, which is the only thing making the car competitive in straight line acceleration to the M6 and A8 Camaros. So who besides someone who already wanted the Dodge for other qualities (size, comfort, styling) would pay more for less than what a 2SS offers?

Then there's the fact the 1LE V6 costs less and will likely run circles around the 5.7 T/A on the track and very close to it in straight line. That should highlight how not a track package this new T/A is. It's simply rebranding and reshuffling parts already available on the Challenger and turning up the hype machine.

Kobra made the best point about this new package, for those who don't like the bee or the "Shit Pack" comments...this is a great deal. You get all of the really good features of the SRT and Scat Pack in a model that slots between them. It essentially fixes the two biggest weaknesses of the Scat Packs, just adequate brakes and small tires. But you end up paying over $5k more for these. When you think of what the 1LE offers for just a bit more than that, it doesn't seem like such a deal.

You missed the entire point of these cars. Most people don't care how fast they can apex a turn or if they win the 1/4. These cars are bassass looking and packed full of goodies for a daily driver, and if you look at the sales numbers, the Challenger is already cutting into Camaro sales. It contiunes to climb insales over all while the Camaro has been dropping since the end of 2015. I do agree that they won't take many 1LE sales though. Those cars are more purpose built for people that have road courses in mind.

[DRKS1D3]

Originally Posted by motorhead

You missed the entire point of these cars. Most people don't care how fast they can apex a turn or if they win the 1/4. These cars are bassass looking and packed full of goodies for a daily driver, and if you look at the sales numbers, the Challenger is already cutting into Camaro sales. It contiunes to climb insales over all while the Camaro has been dropping since the end of 2015. I do agree that they won't take many 1LE sales though. Those cars are more purpose built for people that have road courses in mind.

Exactly. Dodge has done a fantastic job at offering many levels of both performance and aesthetics to the Challenger platform. As I've already stated, a brand new Scat Pack can be bought for ~$41k depending on options. That is amazing, considering a similarly equipped new Camaro SS will run you ~$5k more. GM dropped the ball on the new Camaros with the price. This is why most Chevy lots are sitting on piles of 2016's as the 2017's are being released. I already mentioned in another thread, the sticker on my car when I bought it new in '11 was ~$45k. The same optioned '16 2SS stickers for ~$52K. That is nuts...just plain nuts!

[newmoon]

Originally Posted by motorhead

You missed the entire point of these cars. Most people don't care how fast they can apex a turn or if they win the 1/4. These cars are bassass looking and packed full of goodies for a daily driver, and if you look at the sales numbers, the Challenger is already cutting into Camaro sales. It contiunes to climb insales over all while the Camaro has been dropping since the end of 2015. I do agree that they won't take many 1LE sales though. Those cars are more purpose built for people that have road courses in mind.

This- Lets be honest the Gen 5 1LE were not exactly a highly desired vehicle. Chevy had to offer huge discounts to unload the leftover 14s and 15s. So the thought that most prefer a handling vehicle is a myth. If this were the case the new SS would not be being beat solidly by the GT and also surpassed by the now 9 yro Challenger platform. The new SS is clearly the best balanced package yet sales are dismall.

[SuperSound]

Originally Posted by motorhead

You missed the entire point of these cars. Most people don't care how fast they can apex a turn or if they win the 1/4. These cars are bassass looking and packed full of goodies for a daily driver, and if you look at the sales numbers, the Challenger is already cutting into Camaro sales. It contiunes to climb insales over all while the Camaro has been dropping since the end of 2015. I do agree that they won't take many 1LE sales though. Those cars are more purpose built for people that have road courses in mind.

No I didn't miss the point because we are not talking about Challenger vs Camaro sales across the board. People mentioned specifically the 2SS and 1LE to which I countered exactly why the T/A isn't going to make a dent in either because A) it costs more than a 2SS B) isn't even in the same league as the 1LE.

The build numbers for SRT and SP cars are less than 10k a year. That's less than 2 months of current sales of the Challenger. That's how small a % of sales these "above RT" models contribute too. The T/A will be no different because it costs more. And if the people don't care about track performance, they wouldn't care for the 6 pots and wider wheels. They'll buy an RT or SXT, hell even Scat Pack for cheaper.

[CapeCruisin]

does anyone else not care?
the LX platform is a dinosaur. its like you're buying a 10 year old car that has been patched together with 'upgrades' throughout the years.
I like challengers but they just don't do it for me anymore here in 2016

[motorhead]

Originally Posted by SuperSound

No I didn't miss the point because we are not talking about Challenger vs Camaro sales across the board. People mentioned specifically the 2SS and 1LE to which I countered exactly why the T/A isn't going to make a dent in either because A) it costs more than a 2SS B) isn't even in the same league as the 1LE.

The build numbers for SRT and SP cars are less than 10k a year. That's less than 2 months of current sales of the Challenger. That's how small a % of sales these "above RT" models contribute too. The T/A will be no different because it costs more. And if the people don't care about track performance, they wouldn't care for the 6 pots and wider wheels. They'll buy an RT or SXT, hell even Scat Pack for cheaper.

They like that stuff for the look as much as the performance. I see the value in those cars. If you are not a Mopar fan, you will not get it, and there is nothing wrong with that. I would buy one of those over a stanard SS gen6 in a heartbeat. Way more coolness factor there for me.
You have to buy the ZL1 to equal the coolness factor of a 6.4l T/A challenger. Coolness is something you can't put on a graph or apply a number.

[SuperSound]

Originally Posted by DRKS1D3

Exactly. Dodge has done a fantastic job at offering many levels of both performance and aesthetics to the Challenger platform. As I've already stated, a brand new Scat Pack can be bought for ~$41k depending on options. That is amazing, considering a similarly equipped new Camaro SS will run you ~$5k more. GM dropped the ball on the new Camaros with the price. This is why most Chevy lots are sitting on piles of 2016's as the 2017's are being released. I already mentioned in another thread, the sticker on my car when I bought it new in '11 was ~$45k. The same optioned '16 2SS stickers for ~$52K. That is nuts...just plain nuts!

A similarly equipped? The 1SS starts at $37k, the SP at $39k. The SP doesn't come with factory HIDs and has a GC tax as well. Then there's the fact the M6 SP can't compete in any metric except size with the M6 Camaro SS. You need to have an auto to make it competitive. There's another almost $2k. Start comparing apples to apples.

Originally Posted by newmoon

This- Lets be honest the Gen 5 1LE were not exactly a highly desired vehicle. Chevy had to offer huge discounts to unload the leftover 14s and 15s. So the thought that most prefer a handling vehicle is a myth. If this were the case the new SS would not be being beat solidly by the GT and also surpassed by the now 9 yro Challenger platform. The new SS is clearly the best balanced package yet sales are dismall.

No disagreements, handling ability does not carry this segment. But then again we are supposed to be talking about the new T/A, which is a more expensive appearance package for all purposes. Remember the GT is outselling everyone while offering slower performance and less space than the Challenger 392 everyone is supposed to think is such a great deal. Obviously straight line performance and space doesn't sell either.

[SuperSound]

Originally Posted by motorhead

They like that stuff for the look as much as the performance. I see the value in those cars. If you are not a Mopar fan, you will not get it, and there is nothing wrong with that. I would buy one of those over a stanard SS gen6 in a heartbeat. Way more coolness factor there for me.
You have to buy the ZL1 to equal the coolness factor of a 6.4l T/A challenger. Coolness is something you can't put on a graph or apply a number.

Yep that's why I said something about that in my first response. For Mopar fans, this is good. It just isn't what I wanted to see them build and use the T/A name for. I came close to buying a SP Charger. I would probably pick the new Daytona over the SP too. Coolness is subjective. So saying anything under a ZL1 wouldn't be as cool as a T/A 392 is a personal opinion that many (including a ton of Mustang owners) won't agree. Hellcat, yes.

[motorhead]

Originally Posted by SuperSound

Yep that's why I said something about that in my first response. For Mopar fans, this is good. It just isn't what I wanted to see them build and use the T/A name for. I came close to buying a SP Charger. I would probably pick the new Daytona over the SP too. Coolness is subjective. So saying anything under a ZL1 wouldn't be as cool as a T/A 392 is a personal opinion that many (including a ton of Mustang owners) won't agree. Hellcat, yes.

Right, my opinion not fact of course. You feel different and that's great. I know what you're saying about using the T/A name when that was a road course car, but Dodge isn't trying to do what GM did with the Z/28. They are more about exciting the senses with eye candy and value based performance which I believe this car does well. Would you rather see them do a full on road course car that ends up costing 70 to 80grand to end up a year or two later with 20grand in discounts because the 20 people in the world that really want that type of car to use it as intended bought them and the real consumer won't shell out that much coin for the ultimate handling Challenger? Sound familiar?

[SuperSound]

Originally Posted by motorhead

Right, my opinion not fact of course. You feel different and that's great. I know what you're saying about using the T/A name when that was a road course car, but Dodge isn't trying to do what GM did with the Z/28. They are more about exciting the senses with eye candy and value based performance which I believe this car does well. Would you rather see them do a full on road course car that ends up costing 70 to 80grand to end up a year or two later with 20grand in discounts because the 20 people in the world that really want that type of car to use it as intended bought them and the real consumer won't shell out that much coin for the ultimate handling Challenger? Sound familiar?

As an enthusiast yes, as a stock holder definitely no. I was really hoping the T/A wouldn't make an appearance until the new platform was launched. To me this is like the same problem GM made making the Z28 the name plate for the base V8. I guess I should be happy it wasn't something even more stupid like calling it a Cuda.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G920A using Tapatalk

[DRKS1D3]

Originally Posted by SuperSound

A similarly equipped? The 1SS starts at $37k, the SP at $39k. The SP doesn't come with factory HIDs and has a GC tax as well. Then there's the fact the M6 SP can't compete in any metric except size with the M6 Camaro SS. You need to have an auto to make it competitive. There's another almost $2k. Start comparing apples to apples.

I am comparing apples to apples (kind of). It is kind of tough considering Mopar has more engine options than GM (V6, 5.7L, 6.4L and the Hellcat S/C 6.2L). If a person in the market for a pony car is not brand loyal and just looking for price, the Challenger will undercut the Camaro 9 times out of 10. A Scat Pack is a killer car and a killer price. It is an R/T Challenger equipped with the 6.4L HEMI from the SRT8, packaged together for a price starting under $40k. As I've already stated, the prices of the new 2016 Camaros are through the roof. Go to any GM dealer. They have droves of these things sitting on lots. The look is soft and the price is high. About the only thing remotely helping to move them now is the 2017's being released and dealers needing to move them. BTW, I am a GM guy through and through, but Chevy did no favors with the 6th Gen in terms of appearance and price. ~$52K for a 2SS Convertible? LOL! Laughable at best!

Exhibit A:

http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from...amaro&_sacat=0