Feds Propose Making Black Boxes Standard In New Cars

[midnighter]

Owning a vehicle is becoming a tyranny.

[Mutant Racer]

Wait a minute...if these Black Box's are so good and they've been around for a while why are so many people still being scammed with accident fraud?

[Nessal]

I find it funny how all the posters from left leaning states are the ones that don't like it and the posters from supposidely right leaning states are either indifferent or for it. Blows my mind.

[ShnOmac]

Originally Posted by Nessal

I find it funny how all the posters from left leaning states are the ones that don't like it and the posters from supposidely right leaning states are either indifferent or for it. Blows my mind.

What if you don't live in your home state and move a lot.... How do you know which way to lean?????

[Mr. iNCREDIBLE]

Originally Posted by DarkneSS

Go ahead, my car, my property, I'll just take it out.

Originally Posted by ShnOmac

I don't think you actually can....

"Gary Biller, executive director of the National Motorists Association:

“It’s in the cars, it can’t be turned off, and the information is available to anyone with a court order. Our members ask whether these devices can be disabled, but they can’t, because they are integral to the computer systems that control modern cars.”

Originally Posted by Mr_Draco

Go ahead and remove it. You won't have an operable vehicle when you do as it is an integral part of the computer system. The Camaro already has one so I guess you'll be taking it out?

Getting a court order to read someone's black box is very complicated and the only times I've ever seen the order given was when someone died cause of the accident. So if you are ever in the position to have your black box read you will either be dead or in jail facing charges.

Oh and P.S. All GM vehicles since 1990 has one and over 90% of vehicles sold in the US since 1995 have one as well. So if anyone is against the idea better sell any new vehicles they may own and buy a vehicle made before 1990.

aside from that, I suspect there will be a law stating removal of it is a federal crime, like removing air bags, or cats.

even beyond that I would suspect that insurance companies may mandate that if it has been removed or tampered with then your claim or coverage will be denied, and of course GM and many other manufacturers will void your warranty as a result as well.

Personally I don't have an issue with it being there, knowing they have been in cars for at least 15 years to begin with..

What concerns me is the eventual ability for them to be accessed wirelessly at any time, making it possible for various agencies to pull data from the vehicle and use it against you, DMV, Insurance, Police, Etc.

Things are already headed this way with those idiotic ODB plug in deals that several insurance companies are promoting, optional now, but at some point they may become mandatory, and I suspect it will be tied directly into this regulation/law.

ODB III is the first step in this direction, and at some point I suspect it will happen.

[Mutant Racer]

Are you guys going to start arguing about "him" again?

[Mr_Draco]

Originally Posted by Mutant Racer

Wait a minute...if these Black Box's are so good and they've been around for a while why are so many people still being scammed with accident fraud?

Because of three things mostly;

- It is really, really hard to be granted access to it unless the owner requests it and even then it is expansive to do. The last estimate I've seen to have one done cost around $8k.

- Black boxes don't record much information and what they do record won't be able to tell you if it is a scam or not. How fast was the driver going, did they hit the brakes, was the seat belt fastened? Things like that which all can be determined without needing to read the black box. It won't tell you was the driver looking at his phone, was he day dreaming, was he changing the song on the radio or was he a victim of the Swoop and Squat which is the most common insurance scam.

- Most insurance scams do not include the death of someone. The only time I've ever seen access granted was if someone died in the accident.

[jd10013]

Originally Posted by CHMSC

We don't need big brother in our lives anymore than they already are. They listen to our phone calls, check our emails and peek every dam where. Yes they are in most cars but bb is getting ridiculous in what is supposed to be a free county.

speaking of which, I believe there is a law or regulation being pushed that will require cell phone companies to keep all your text messages for 2 years in case they're ever needed.

found it,

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-205_162-...text-messages/

[ChrisBlair]

Originally Posted by ShnOmac

Why?

It only records the information from a few seconds before and after a "event". If your not doing anything wrong it doesn't matter anyway.....

This is the wrong attitude. Think about it. You're not dealing drugs are you? Well good, you don;t mind if the police just come in and do a random search do you? You do? Why? if you're not doing anything WRONG, why would you mind?

Now look, I don't mind the black box for the purposes that so many advocates claim- finding out better ways of making cars safer, etc. But I strongly disagree with the way that private citizens are having their actions monitored all the time. It is, in the USA, expected that a private citizen can expect reasonable privacy.

This is why you have legal concerns over say wiretaps.

Now you might say "this is different". No. In concept it is not. if you think it is 'different', then go back to the drug dealing example and read it again. And don;t look at it as "I don't deal drugs". That's not the point. Look at it as "why should I be monitored if it's assumed I'm doing nothing wrong?"

People are routinely giving up their privacy in the name of 'safety' or some other thing that is on the surface OK. But if you for one second think that it ends with that 'good thing', then you are fooling yourself.

I don't get all bent out of shape over the box in my car, but it boils my blood when I hear somebody say "well if you're not doing anything wrong it doesn't matter". That's the same as "why protest if you've nothing to hide?".

I recommend that you start questioning why you feel it's OK to be monitored in the first place.

[ShnOmac]

Originally Posted by ChrisBlair

This is the wrong attitude. Think about it. You're not dealing drugs are you? Well good, you don;t mind if the police just come in and do a random search do you? You do? Why? if you're not doing anything WRONG, why would you mind?

And this is where we see things differently.... They are not going to just "random search" your black box.

[1 bad azz ls3]

sorry but your car has it already. same control box for the air bags...

[ChrisBlair]

Originally Posted by ShnOmac

And this is where we see things differently.... They are not going to just "random search" your black box.

And you know that how?

Did the dealer dislcose the fact that you could be monitored by it?

There is no governing body that has the right to monitor you if you've done nothing wrong. There are however many that have been given the power to do it by the US populace.

We do see things differently. You don't understand your rights, and I know BS when it's in front of me

Chris, out

[ShnOmac]

Originally Posted by ChrisBlair

We do see things differently. You don't understand your rights, and I know BS when it's in front of me

Chris, out

Have a god day!

[ChrisBlair]

Originally Posted by ShnOmac

Have a god day!

I respect your right to practice any religion you see fit