2015 Challenger Hellcat 707 HP

[SpeedIsLife]

Originally Posted by SEVEN-OH JOE

S550 will also underpin at least a Lincoln variant. You'll recall when, in late-'10, a significant redesign of the chassis took place...AFTER Farley deemed it necessary to have broader use and to help him with his then-new task of "saving" Lincoln.

How will THAT turn out?

Pot - Kettle - Black

Stop repeating the jagged one's nonsensical rants and rationale. You're better that that. Or should be...

Lol ThePill? He's a shouting madman, I came to that conclusion on my own based on experience with the LX and Zeta platforms.

[Q'smuscle]

Originally Posted by rocket403

People buying the Challenger and Charger know it is a bigger platform and like that, so your saying it like that is not a selling point. If I wanted a smaller car I would have got the Camaro or Mustang.

I see the challenger being bigger in size but interior definitely isn't that much noticeable! I like the Challenger and it's size but when I was buying my first 5th Gen ! I sat in a SRT with all options and the sale person just kept bragging about the interior space and I was like what the crap it isn't that noticeable!

[LostPony]

Originally Posted by SEVEN-OH JOE

S550 will also underpin at least a Lincoln variant. You'll recall when, in late-'10, a significant redesign of the chassis took place...AFTER Farley deemed it necessary to have broader use and to help him with his then-new task of "saving" Lincoln. The "changes" that forced Pericak to eat his "gonna lose at least 200 lb." words.

How did THAT turn out?

Pot - Kettle - Black

Stop paraphrasing the jagged one's nonsensical rants and rationale. You're better than that. Or should be...

You're right that the S500 might underpin a Lincoln variant, but such a thing is still just a rumor and no one has even seen a mule running around yet. It does not however change the fact that the S550 came into being because it was for the Mustang first, and not as the secondary reason.

Now before anyone gets their panties in a wad, I do think that an Alpha based Camaro is going to be light years better than a Zeta based Camaro, regardless of whether the platform was designed primarily for the Camaro, or underpins multiple vehicles.

It remains to be seen what Chrysler will do with a next gen car, but I am pretty sure they know that if they want to equal the sales of Mustang/Camaro they will need to downsize. They may decide they are happy being a larger alternative even if it means fewer sales in the end.

[Q'smuscle]

Originally Posted by LostPony

You're right that the S500 might underpin a Lincoln variant, but such a thing is still just a rumor and no one has even seen a mule running around yet. It does not however change the fact that the S550 came into being because it was for the Mustang first, and not as the secondary reason.

Now before anyone gets their panties in a wad, I do think that an Alpha based Camaro is going to be light years better than a Zeta based Camaro, regardless of whether the platform was designed primarily for the Camaro, or underpins multiple vehicles.

It remains to be seen what Chrysler will do with a next gen car, but I am pretty sure they know that if they want to equal the sales of Mustang/Camaro they will need to downsize. They may decide they are happy being a larger alternative even if it means fewer sales in the end.

I would hate to see the challenger get smaller! I don't see why it has to be smaller just to sell like the other two ! Because I bet if the Camaro or mustang was the same size they would still sale way more!

[SEVEN-OH JOE]

Originally Posted by LostPony

You're right that the S500 might underpin a Lincoln variant, but such a thing is still just a rumor and no one has even seen a mule running around yet. It does not however change the fact that the S550 came into being because it was for the Mustang first, and not as the secondary reason.

Now before anyone gets their panties in a wad, I do think that an Alpha based Camaro is going to be light years better than a Zeta based Camaro, regardless of whether the platform was designed primarily for the Camaro, or underpins multiple vehicles.

It remains to be seen what Chrysler will do with a next gen car, but I am pretty sure they know that if they want to equal the sales of Mustang/Camaro they will need to downsize. They may decide they are happy being a larger alternative even if it means fewer sales in the end.

If you're going to fashion yourself as an all-seeing and all-knowing car critic, then you KNOW the capabilities demonstrated by the Alpha chassis in ATS and CTS forms.

Imagine, to Chevrolet's wonder, being able to use Car of the Year and BMW comparo-winning "Cadillac-derived" underpinnings in a mid-$20s-and-up Camaro!!

And YOU would have the world think this is some sort of sub-standard compromise?!

Nice try...

To Ford's credit, they saw the writing on the wall and "borrowed" a page from the GM Playbook when developing AND revising the S550 platform. After all, how long has Alpha been known about? Long before late-'10, when Farley "changed" things for the Mustang and soon-to-follow Lincoln.

FACT.

[LostPony]

Originally Posted by SEVEN-OH JOE

If you're going to fashion yourself as an all-seeing and all-knowing car critic, then you KNOW the capabilities demonstrated by the Alpha chassis in ATS and CTS forms.

Imagine, to Chevrolet's wonder, being able to use Car of the Year and BMW comparo-winning "Cadillac-derived" underpinnings in a mid-$20s-and-up Camaro!!

And YOU would have the world think this is some sort of sub-standard compromise?!

Nice try...

To Ford's credit, they saw the writing on the wall and "borrowed" a page from the GM Playbook when developing AND revising the S550 platform. After all, how long has Alpha been known about? Long before late-'10, when Farley "changed" things for the Mustang and soon-to-follow Lincoln.

FACT.

What part of :

"I do think that an Alpha based Camaro is going to be light years better than a Zeta based Camaro, regardless of whether the platform was designed primarily for the Camaro, or underpins multiple vehicles."

Sounds like I don't think it will be???

[LostPony]

Sorry, I should add " a compromised design" after "Sounds like it will be"

Reach down, pinch forefinger and thumb together and remove panties from crack...

[LostPony]

Originally Posted by Q'smuscle

I would hate to see the challenger get smaller! I don't see why it has to be smaller just to sell like the other two ! Because I bet if the Camaro or mustang was the same size they would still sale way more!

It may not need to. I just think that those who did buy it did so because it was larger, and many potential buyers decided not to buy and went to Camaro or Mustang again, due to size. How many decided one way or the other could effect final sales numbers for all three cars.

If memory serves, which it often doesn't so I will use these numbers as a rough guess, Mustang and Camaro sell about 9,000 units or so a month. The Challenger about half that with 4,500 sales. If 1000 or so people each walked away from Camaro and Mustang and bought the Challenger because it was closer in size and performance that would knock each down to 8,000 and Chally up to 6,500. Much closer comparison.

Now one could also argue that Challenger could lose 1,000 or more sales too because of it getting smaller. This is why I'm glad I don't have to plan any vehicle!! I just get to enjoy the ones that are made in the end!

[SEVEN-OH JOE]

Originally Posted by LostPony

If memory serves, which it often doesn't so I will use these numbers as a rough guess, Mustang and Camaro sell about 9,000 units or so a month. The Challenger about half that with 4,500 sales. If 1000 or so people each walked away from Camaro and Mustang and bought the Challenger because it was closer in size and performance that would knock each down to 8,000 and Chally up to 6,500. Much closer comparison.

...and NOW we have the true intent of this interminable thread, finally exposed...

As has been raised before, you do NOT see 100+ page threads on these cars on a Mustang site. Anywhere. But we do here.

Thanks for admitting the insidiousness of this.

[rocket403]

Originally Posted by Q'smuscle

I see the challenger being bigger in size but interior definitely isn't that much noticeable! I like the Challenger and it's size but when I was buying my first 5th Gen ! I sat in a SRT with all options and the sale person just kept bragging about the interior space and I was like what the crap it isn't that noticeable!

Challenger does have a bigger back seat, as my family Daily driver for half of the year it needs be able to take the family, trunk is much bigger than the Camaro and Mustang. The front seating is close but there is a bit more room in the Challenger.

[LostPony]

Originally Posted by SEVEN-OH JOE

...and NOW we have the true intent of this interminable thread, finally exposed...

As has been raised before, you do NOT see 100+ page threads on these cars on a Mustang site. Anywhere. But we do here.

Thanks for admitting the insidiousness of this.

Dammit Joe! You busted me! I have been sent here by the Italian and American governments to steal sales away from GM and Ford to help prop up Chrysler without having to resort to yet another bailout.

You do make me laugh Joe, I'll give ya that!

[Q'smuscle]

Originally Posted by LostPony

It may not need to. I just think that those who did buy it did so because it was larger, and many potential buyers decided not to buy and went to Camaro or Mustang again, due to size. How many decided one way or the other could effect final sales numbers for all three cars.

If memory serves, which it often doesn't so I will use these numbers as a rough guess, Mustang and Camaro sell about 9,000 units or so a month. The Challenger about half that with 4,500 sales. If 1000 or so people each walked away from Camaro and Mustang and bought the Challenger because it was closer in size and performance that would knock each down to 8,000 and Chally up to 6,500. Much closer comparison.

Now one could also argue that Challenger could lose 1,000 or more sales too because of it getting smaller. This is why I'm glad I don't have to plan any vehicle!! I just get to enjoy the ones that are made in the end!

Yea, I just think that the challenger didn't sell as much as the other two do to the other two having a convertible option , more attractive interior and offering more than just the retro body! Like headlights and more after market accessories! I know these new ones offer some of that but the taillights , the rear , front grille, nor interior us better looking to me than the previous model!

Originally Posted by rocket403

Challenger does have a bigger back seat, as my family Daily driver for half of the year it needs be able to take the family, trunk is much bigger than the Camaro and Mustang. The front seating is close but there is a bit more room in the Challenger.

Yea, i was talking about the backseat space and i had to look more than once to notice more space, it's there but not that big like some be bragging about over the Camaro!

[HEMI DAVE]

I am just hearing the hellcat just knocked off a 10.48 on drag radials in south texas. 11.05 on stock tires. No shiznit. Gathering more info!

Edinburg raceway facebook page has some info

I found the time slips........

[DDoug]

Wow, the Mopar Guys I know are hardcore, to-the-marrow fanatics!

Some of these loose screws have been waiting for this car for 40 years!

They don't want a faster, smaller, better handling, or whatever your silly argument against this car is. They want a to-the-marrow, throw back, hard core, straight line behemoth that scares them a little bit and scares the wife bad enough to walk 5 feet away from it when it's standing still.

Since these cars are going for $85k+ OTD, they can buy a faster Mopar at that price point right now!

They don't want it!!

I'll say that again.

They don't want it !!!!!!!

Last I checked, manuals were outselling automatics about 3 to 1.

Does that sound like someone who is looking for the "fastest" set up?

Hell, no! It's not about the destination, it's about arriving side ways with a Duke's of Hazzard "YEE HAW!!!" and a smile so big, make you wanna smack yo mama!!

Some of y'all are losing this perspective. It really is about the journey, and not about who gets there first.