[Hops]

Originally Posted by raptor5244

https://www.motortrend.com/news/2024...ison/?slide=10


Attachment 1109004

Is the ss 1le better price wise comparison? In the track features comparison they say the Camaro comes up short, but list features that are in the 1le package

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by triggerjerk

My buddy's gt350 tips the scales at 3920 with 3/4 tank of fuel by way of comparison.
Since the mach/dark horse most likely shares some of those components i think 4000lb is likely due to all of the new tech and interior material upgrades.

Indeed, the Dark Horse is a chunky horse.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by Hops

Is the ss 1le better price wise comparison? In the track features comparison they say the Camaro comes up short, but list features that are in the 1le package

IMO, the SS 1LE is the best sports car bang for the buck, period. Furthermore, if you are looking for the best handling muscle car, the SS 1LE is the best of the bunch. The ZL1 and ZLE are fantastic as well but they do add some weight and the price tag is now $70-80k. Still a great value for the performance you get but you are in C8 territory and you start cross shopping other high-line vehicles at that price point.

Just look at what else is available in the market...

The new Nissan Z with no mag ride, floaty suspension, no HUD, 4 piston brakes, no Tremec, no dual exhaust and V6 and down 50hp and 100lb ft of torque vs. the LT1 and costs north of $50k assuming you could buy one at MSRP.

Toyota Supra/BMW - great B58 engine, better performer than the Z but you need to like BMWs in order to enjoy this car. May actually have worse visibility than the Camaro and the most annoying wind buffeting ever experienced on a vehicle.

Mustang Mach 1 - too expensive for what you get compared to the SS 1LE, might as well get a ZL1 if you are in the $60k+ territory for a Mach 1.

Dodge - big heavier cruisers, cool looks in the widebody trims but get very expensive once you get in the Hellcats, $80-100k for Redeyes with Jailbreak. Scat Pack is the sweet spot if you just want a V8 cruiser.

You can go down market and still have a lot of fun and lower your cost of fuel and other consumables.

Miata - probably the most fun car to zip around in on the streets. Wind out gears and not reach go to jail limits. 2,332lbs, top goes down and a manual transmission. Loads of fun.

GR86/BRZ - great choice if you want something sporty for $30k or so. Looks good, pretty light. The Boxer is ok but not the most inspiring engine.

[Joshinator99]

Originally Posted by raptor5244

Indeed, the Dark Horse is a chunky horse.

Attachment 1109028

Says the guy with a 3900# Blackwing lol . Although that isn’t too bad these days.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by Joshinator99

Says the guy with a 3900# Blackwing lol . Although that isn’t too bad these days.

True, but at least it is a 4-door luxury sports sedan at that weight so at least there is some excuse.

I have to say, this CT4-V Blackwing feels a lot more nimble than I thought it would. It is a lot easier to chuck around than the ZL1. I think it is the heavy steering of the ZL1 and that extra weight of the LT4 over the nose. The only thing this car needs is the LT1 V8 instead of the LF4 twin turbo V6. The LF4 is great from a power perspective (472hp, 445tq) but lacks the V8 sound track. The CT5-V is the answer but $100k+...

[Joshinator99]

Originally Posted by raptor5244

True, but at least it is a 4-door luxury sports sedan at that weight so at least there is some excuse.

I have to say, this CT4-V Blackwing feels a lot more nimble than I thought it would. It is a lot easier to chuck around than the ZL1. I think it is the heavy steering of the ZL1 and that extra weight of the LT4 over the nose. The only thing this car needs is the LT1 V8 instead of the LF4 twin turbo V6. The LF4 is great from a power perspective (472hp, 445tq) but lacks the V8 sound track. The CT5-V is the answer but $100k+...

Attachment 1109035

Attachment 1109036

Looks great! Seems like the spiritual successor to the ATS-V.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by Joshinator99

Looks great! Seems like the spiritual successor to the ATS-V.

Thanks. I may actually keep this one a while.

It is too bad that Cadillac finally starts to get its mojo back with the Blackwings and now they are going all electric. The CT4/CT5 die with the Camaro.

[triggerjerk]

Originally Posted by raptor5244

True, but at least it is a 4-door luxury sports sedan at that weight so at least there is some excuse.

I have to say, this CT4-V Blackwing feels a lot more nimble than I thought it would. It is a lot easier to chuck around than the ZL1. I think it is the heavy steering of the ZL1 and that extra weight of the LT4 over the nose. The only thing this car needs is the LT1 V8 instead of the LF4 twin turbo V6. The LF4 is great from a power perspective (472hp, 445tq) but lacks the V8 sound track. The CT5-V is the answer but $100k+...

Attachment 1109035

Attachment 1109036

If you had to choose one between the ZL1 and your BW, which one would it be?

[90503]

I found this article interesting. Mustang coming out with new ICE Mustangs, as Camaro ends ICE with a 2,000 unit Commemorative Edition. Not sure if this is still a Camaro plan, but it's all I could find.

Mustang is doing it right keeping ICE around. They will have an even bigger win once this unworkable Electrical/EV Transition collapses in a few more years.

https://www.motortrend.com/news/cama...ctors-edition/

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by triggerjerk

If you had to choose one between the ZL1 and BW, which one would it be?

Hmm, right now the Blackwing. It is a better all around performance sedan that checks more boxes for me right now.

I owned 2021 ZL1 with the A10 for a little over a year before trading it for the CT4V Blackwing last month. The BW is a manual so much more engaging to drive. I am getting a little older so I find I am starting to appreciate the luxury plus performance the Blackwing offers.

For example, I like the BW visibility and seating position better. The seats are more comfortable, normal trunk opening four doors if you need to haul the kids around. I also like the improved cluster gauges, Performance steering wheel with V-Mode and PTM buttons. You also get MyMode, magride 4.0 is noticeably better, the adjustable brake by wire pedal firmness is actually pretty cool. I also appreciate some of the other features we don’t get in the Camaro like rain sensing wipers, front parking sensors and a wireless charging pad in a usable location. The 15 speaker AKG sound system if very good as well. If you want to go crazy on options you can get massaging seats and a bunch of carbon fiber and if you track the car you can get PDR and HUD.

Now the ZL1 is obviously much more visceral and the LT4 just pulls and pulls with the Supercharged V8 soundtrack so when it comes to spirited driving only the ZL1 delivers but to be honest it is over the limit for me and the roads I have access to. In order to enjoy it you have to put your foot in it and triple digits are so effortless in the ZL1, which great but also a bit frustrating. I think if I had the M6 in the ZL1 I would enjoy it more but the gearing is so tall and you can’t really wind them out when you hit 60mph in 1st, 83mph in 2nd and 113mph in 3rd unless you live in the desert somewhere. The 4BW is geared like an SS. Still very quick for the street but more enjoyable gearing ratios IMO. The CT5V-Blackwing is basically a 4 door ZL1. I am sure it is fantastic but they are over $100k, so you lose that performance bang for the buck that the ZL1 offers.

So I really enjoy both, it just depends what your priorities are and what you want most out of the car.

[CHASLT1]

Originally Posted by raptor5244

I wouldn't be surprised. The days of lightweight cars are over unless you prefer a Miata, which is a ton of fun to drive by the way. Anyway, the last lightweight 400hp V8 sport car I owned was a 2002 C5 Z06. That is one car I owned that I would like back. Just imagine if these 500hp cars were 3000lbs again. They would be an absolute riot.

Attachment 1109019

The Miata needs a real engine. I would love one with a V8 or at least a EV version with 400hp. Glad i am back in a C6 after 2 years without.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by BuckeyeROC

The C6 Z06 might be the sweet spot for many of you. 3100 lbs, 505HP LS7. Heads, cam, intake, exhaust and you have a 3100 lbs ~600 rwhp N/A missile. If you can handle the country club parking lot exterior.

[raptor5244]

Originally Posted by CHASLT1

The Miata needs a real engine. I would love one with a V8 or at least a EV version with 400hp. Glad i am back in a C6 after 2 years without.

They did improve it a bit with the ND2. It likes to rev now to 7500 rpm and doesn’t run out of breath up there like the ND1 did but I hear you. I think around 250hp is all you need in that little 2,300 lb car to make it ridiculous.

The issue now is cost. I never thought I would see the day when a fully loaded Miata would cost over $40k.

[m6-lt1]

Originally Posted by BuckeyeROC

The C6 Z06 might be the sweet spot for many of you. 3100 lbs, 505HP LS7. Heads, cam, intake, exhaust and you have a 3100 lbs ~600 rwhp N/A missile. If you can handle the country club parking lot exterior.

Strongly considering a c6 z06 as I’ve wanted one for over 10 years now, but the head issue scares me. Also with the entire rear subframe needing to be dropped in order to change the clutch, fix any fuel crossover/sender issues, etc is also a deterrent.

Right now I’m between a used zl1, c6z, SS 1le, and new mustang. 1le is in last place because I believe in always going up in horsepower. I also love the simple and clean “country club” exterior of the C6 z06. Now that the c7 has aged, I have learned to appreciate the c6 design for how simple and clean the lines are. I just would prefer a 2020+ vehicle over something that old.