Not Good, GM wants another 16 or is it 9 Billion to Survive.

[BigRigMike]

Originally Posted by Supermans

However as long as the Union is spending money to get special favors from elected officials and so forth along with the other shenanigans they seem to do, that needs to stop. .

Both Pro-Union and Anti-union groups donate. Wait for EFCA and the money from both sides will really start to flow.

Originally Posted by Supermans

If you read my posts, Under Chapter 11, I am all for helping retirees and current employees that were promised all sorts of benefits however newer employees should fall under different benefits and so on that are more in line to be competitive with the foreign car companies that operate within the US and pay US wages.

That is why I said my comments about that were not directed at you. And the UAW has already agreed to reduced benefits for new employee's.

Originally Posted by Supermans

I am simply viewing this thru a lens of conservative and keeping our country a free Republic and away from socialism in any form.

I am trying to get away from the lens and not let party politics get in the way. :flag2: Sometimes the best thing to do is flip between MSNBC and FOX.

As for Socialism I wish all of the representatives that feel we are moving towards Socialism would start a bill to completely dismantle Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, and unemployment benefits since those are the true Socialistic programs. If Socialism is the enemy then these programs should have been dissolved in 2000 for the benefit of the country.

Even though medicare saved the life of my father and kept my family from financial ruin so that we can all have productive lifes and are not living under a bridge panhandling even though we have health insurance, but hey it is a social program so get rid of it.

Mods if the last two paragraphs are too political feel free to delete them.

[Supermans]

Originally Posted by BigRigMike

Both Pro-Union and Anti-union groups donate. Wait for EFCA and the money from both sides will really start to flow.



That is why I said my comments about that were not directed at you. And the UAW has already agreed to reduced benefits for new employee's.




I am trying to get away from the lens and not let party politics get in the way. :flag2: Sometimes the best thing to do is flip between MSNBC and FOX.

As for Socialism I wish all of the representatives that feel we are moving towards Socialism would start a bill to completely dismantle Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, and unemployment benefits since those are the true Socialistic programs. If Socialism is the enemy then these programs should have been dissolved in 2000 for the benefit of the country.

Even though medicare saved the life of my father and kept my family from financial ruin so that we can all have productive lifes and are not living under a bridge panhandling even though we have health insurance, but hey it is a social program so get rid of it.

Mods if the last two paragraphs are too political feel free to delete them.

I understand how you feel. When I say I am against socialism, I am not talking about getting rid of medicare and medicaid or the social security. We all have to care for those who can't take care of themselves. And that is where I draw the line. If you can get up and go to a job everyday after getting the free and equal public education everyone gets...Then there is no excuse when you get into risky financial situations like buying a house when you can't afford it and then not paying the mortgage but having enough money to buy furniture, a flatscreen TV, a home entertainment system to go along with it, etc. and drive a vehicle you cannot afford either. My wife see's people coming up in the pharmacy with medicaid driving up in a Lexus.. People cheat the system and why should people who pay their mortgage on time, don't get into risky situations be the ones who bail them out?? The more power you give to the Government, the more control, the worse everything gets and it won't take long either. I'm all for regulating medication costs and regulating health insurance costs, making it affordable to all. But I am against universal healthcare which will lower the quality of our health services tremendously not to mention research and development for medications will drop by over 90% of what it is today since they won't be getting the returns they currently are getting. However I would be happy to lower the costs of medications which will drop R&R but not to the same levels as it would be with universal health care.

I'm glad that I live in the USA and that we can have different points of view and be able to discuss them without throwing punches. Well, that is kinda hard on a forum anyways.. However, back on topic and sorry mods again but I felt I had to explain where i am coming from and explain what lens I am seeing all this thru. Especially since I was mischaracterized by BigRigMike as wanting to get rid of Medicaid and Medicare along with social Security...

[BigRigMike]

Originally Posted by Supermans

Especially since I was mischaracterized by BigRigMike as wanting to get rid of Medicaid and Medicare along with social Security...

I said Representatives not you. I may have used your quote at the top but not everything is directed at you. Sorry

And you can draw the line wherever you like but Reagan considered Medicare Socialism and that it threatened our freedom. I am just frustrated at how easily Socialism is being thrown around. If you support Medicare then you must be a socialist.....See it doesn't always work. I don't consider you a socialist because you support Medicare. But if you support universal healthcare then you are a socialist which bothers me.

And yes there will always be people that abuse the system. No system is perfect.

The problem is that if my moron neighbor goes into foreclosure then I lose a ton of money. So no matter what happens it is going to cost me money. Do I support bailing out people that can't afford a house because they can't manage money NO. Should we help out someone who going into foreclosure because they lost their job and are having a problem paying YES.

Anyways it is time for me to go home and I don't have internet at my house so I won't get to read anything more until Monday.