GM beats June sales forecast

[stovt001]

Touche. I get the whole ice age thing too. When most people say global warming, they mean man-made global warming and that included me.

[chadrcr]

Originally Posted by stovt001

Touche. I get the whole ice age thing too. When most people say global warming, they mean man-made global warming and that included me.

just kiddin about the iceage-global warming
I think 'man' might impact global temps, we should try to be responsible... but I am not convinced that the good old globe really cares what we do... within reason.

[Nickdago]

Originally Posted by chadrcr

So, now we can all be friends and buy many Camaros... OR a little gas...

I was thinking maybe we just make our own gas, what do you think

[Nickdago]

Originally Posted by stovt001

Apologies to the mods for continuing this. I promise I won't get into gas prices vs alternatives again. I just want to say I think everyone totally misunderstood what I'm saying. It appears people think I'm arguing for government intervention of global warming policies. However, exactly the opposite is true. I oppose any government price manipulation, up or down. I believe that the market and the market alone should determine prices. I'm also very much against Gore and his followers. I believe global warming is a scam. To clarify my position, I'm simply stating that market conditions have created an environment that has brought popular attention to the inventions of brilliant Americans (as well as others) that would otherwise be ignored, and as such I oppose artificially lowering prices because it would stifle this free market innovation. Sorry for bringing this up again, but I wanted to clarify because it looks like much of this debate resulted from me not being as clear as I should have.

Actually I appreciate the clarification and agreee, however it seems that prices are already being manipulated and all of us Car Lovers are taking it in the gas tank. How about we clean house (congress) and start over. No life time politicians and no lawyers.

[Nickdago]

Originally Posted by chadrcr

just kiddin about the iceage-global warming
I think 'man' might impact global temps, we should try to be responsible... but I am not convinced that the good old globe really cares what we do... within reason.

Agree

[chadrcr]

Originally Posted by Nickdago

I was thinking maybe we just make our own gas, what do you think

I just made some gas..... oh, you mean fuel. That was what I was sayin earlier, growin up on the farm, we tried to get into the ethanol business in the (late)70's, when gas went nuts the second time. I was too young to contribute, but I do remember that we had a pickup that ran on propane OR gas.... I had forgotten about that. How much is propane now??? We had propane tractors too, as well as diesel.
Since gasoline used to be the (waste) by-product of kerosene, maybe 'we' can utilize each barrel of crude more efficiently with more development...
I have the E85 5.3 in my GMC, just need to find a station that sells E85 within 1,000 miles. It did get worse mileage when I used it, but it was nice to think the $$$ were not going to OPEC.

[Nickdago]

Originally Posted by chadrcr

I just made some gas..... oh, you mean fuel. That was what I was sayin earlier, growin up on the farm, we tried to get into the ethanol business in the (late)70's, when gas went nuts the second time. I was too young to contribute, but I do remember that we had a pickup that ran on propane OR gas.... I had forgotten about that. How much is propane now??? We had propane tractors too, as well as diesel.
Since gasoline used to be the (waste) by-product of kerosene, maybe 'we' can utilize each barrel of crude more efficiently with more development...
I have the E85 5.3 in my GMC, just need to find a station that sells E85 within 1,000 miles. It did get worse mileage when I used it, but it was nice to think the $$$ were not going to OPEC.

No I mean Gas lol My Avalanche burns E85 which I can buy for somewhere between 2.59 and 2.79 a gallon. I do save about 10 bucks for every 300 miles which is not much but it is nice to fill up a thirty gallon tank and pay only $77.00. At least it feals better at the time, otherwise it is well over 100 bucks

[chadrcr]

Originally Posted by Nickdago

No I mean Gas lol My Avalanche burns E85 which I can buy for somewhere between 2.59 and 2.79 a gallon. I do save about 10 bucks for every 300 miles which is not much but it is nice to fill up a thirty gallon tank and pay only $77.00. At least it feals better at the time, otherwise it is well over 100 bucks

I went to Iowa/Missouri in 2006, gas was 2.75, E85 was 2.25. It was about break even then, but it sounds really good at 2.59. I would have to burn three tanks af opec to get to the closest E85 station. I need to do a search to confirm that, but I know they need to make a lot more E85 stations.

[Chevyrocker]

Just so everyone understands this E85 stuff...In order for it to make sense from a financial stand point, with the mileage that you lose burining E85, it would have to cost you no less than $0.55 less per gallon than regular gasoline (assuming gas is at $4.00/gal). Otherwise, you're better off paying the extra cash for good 'ol regular gas.

Another fun fact. GM has over 2,000,000 E85 capable vehicles on the road TODAY. If each and every one of those vehicles burned E85 exclusively, we would save over 2 billion gallons of gas a year.

[chadrcr]

Originally Posted by Nickdago

No I mean Gas lol My Avalanche burns E85 which I can buy for somewhere between 2.59 and 2.79 a gallon. I do save about 10 bucks for every 300 miles which is not much but it is nice to fill up a thirty gallon tank and pay only $77.00. At least it feals better at the time, otherwise it is well over 100 bucks

asuming his real gas is near $4.00, gotta be saving more than .55

Originally Posted by chadrcr

I went to Iowa/Missouri in 2006, gas was 2.75, E85 was 2.25. It was about break even then, but it sounds really good at 2.59. I would have to burn three tanks af opec to get to the closest E85 station. I need to do a search to confirm that, but I know they need to make a lot more E85 stations.

in 06 it WAS 50 cents less.... 2.25 < 2.75

Originally Posted by jsenn

Just so everyone understands this E85 stuff...In order for it to make sense from a financial stand point, with the mileage that you lose burining E85, it would have to cost you no less than $0.55 less per gallon than regular gasoline (assuming gas is at $4.00/gal). Otherwise, you're better off paying the extra cash for good 'ol regular gas.



Another fun fact. GM has over 2,000,000 E85 capable vehicles on the road TODAY. If each and every one of those vehicles burned E85 exclusively, we would save over 2 billion gallons of gas a year.

great

[Nickdago]

Originally Posted by chadrcr

asuming his real gas is near $4.00, gotta be saving more than .55



in 06 it WAS 50 cents less.... 2.25 < 2.75



great

With all those E85 vehicles on the road you would think they would come up with a more effecient way to make ethanol instead of using corn which is one of the most ineffecient ways. Also. the reason I really only save about ten bucks is the mileage difference I get between burning ethanol as opposed to gas is pretty dramatic. From around 16 to 17 mpg w/gas down to 11 mpg with ethanol, however even at $2.79 a gallon is it still more economical to burn ethanol right now. If it gets much higher though or gas comes down some the benefit would start to diminish quite rapidly. And considering they say that to produce a gallon of ethanol using corn actually puts as much carbon in the atmosphere as 1.3 gallons of gas, without a financial benefit there is really no reason to burn ethanol.

[chadrcr]

Originally Posted by Nickdago

With all those E85 vehicles on the road you would think they would come up with a more effecient way to make ethanol instead of using corn which is one of the most ineffecient ways. Also. the reason I really only save about ten bucks is the mileage difference I get between burning ethanol as opposed to gas is pretty dramatic. From around 16 to 17 mpg w/gas down to 11 mpg with ethanol, however even at $2.79 a gallon is it still more economical to burn ethanol right now. If it gets much higher though or gas comes down some the benefit would start to diminish quite rapidly. And considering they say that to produce a gallon of ethanol using corn actually puts as much carbon in the atmosphere as 1.3 gallons of gas, without a financial benefit there is really no reason to burn ethanol.

yea, I lost about 30% mpg, but it was near 30% cheaper ( 2006 )
I would rather burn American Corn (for now) than OPEC oil, and work on the alternatives for making E-85.
There is the propane/ natural gas option for some cars; If we can go back to the 70's, we had a propane capable Ford pickup.

[Mr. Wyndham]

Originally Posted by Nickdago

With all those E85 vehicles on the road you would think they would come up with a more effecient way to make ethanol instead of using corn which is one of the most ineffecient ways.

They have already, the next step is putting up plants to make the stuff. (there should be ine up between now, and this time next year from Coskata)

Anyways, there was some decent conversation going on in here. Perhaps, it can be continued?
http://www.camaro5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4223

[Nickdago]

Wow what an eye opener. I don't know how many of you were able to catch that Ted Koppel special on China and the auto industry but that was scary. American industry as well as the goverment better get off their complacent butts and get with it because China is waiting for no one. One thing is for sure no matter how much we conserve here in the US it is not going to help even a little bit. The planned consumption in China and the rest of the world is going to outstrip anything we could even begin to imagine. In the short run if we do not start drilling for oil and do it now we are going to be in huge trouble, I would even say our way of life is without a doubt in jepordy. Time to stop complaining and start doing something about it. All the green technology in the world is not going to help us in the near future.

They talked about how the Chineese are learning everything they can from the American car companies and then starting their own car companies with the goal of coming to the US market and dominating here as well. Even Ford and GM look like they may even build cars in China and then ship them all over the world. Times are a changing and we might find ourselves in a situation we have not been used to for decades, second place. They are talking about the auto industry overtaking the American Auto industry within years.

Apparently GM has had a foothold in China for decades and because of this Buick is the number one car there and is considered a premium high quality car. Imagine that, we have to take our cars to China to get people to appreciate them while here in America all people can do is complain about how our jobs are being shipped overseas and then turn around and buy a Toyota.

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