Firearms Section

[Dangeruss]

BTW guys...I heard from what I think is a pretty good source that there will be a price drop and big shipment of SCARs soon.

So besides better supply (which typically drives down cost), FN is supposedly lowering dealer cost. The retail is also supposed to change to $2500 for the 17S (instead of $2900). I hope this guy's info is right. I've been wanting to pick one up, but wasn't willing to pay out the nose for it.

[Mr Twisty]

Originally Posted by Dangeruss

Thanks...definitely one of my favorites. How can you go wrong with 16 rounds of .45?

Originally Posted by shank0668

I need to get a reloading press so bad. My 700 is too expensive to shoot. .308 is what I should have gotten.

You got a nice rifle for the money... once you start reloading you'll be able to load it for not much more than .308

If you don't load too hot, brass will last a long time.

You can get sticker shock from some reloaders equipment, but if you do your homework you can get in to it fairly cheap.

I did one thing that even the hardcore accuracy guys think is overkill... I deprime then clean my brass with a Thumblers Tumbler and SS roller bearing media. Since I clean brass in my kitchen this technique doesn't throw dust like a dry media cleaner.

I also use a scale that's so accurate I have to turn off my ceiling fan and hold my breath to use it ... but those are my two splurges, the rest of my equipment is on the low side, like a Lee classic 4 hole turret press and Lee dies.

[kalimus]

Originally Posted by Dangeruss

I didn't build one...bought a POF P308. Still can't find PMAGs for under $45.00!

3200 for an AR-10 is a lot. Is it worth it? I've wanted an AR-10 for a while, and I am thinking about just building one. The POF is a beautiful looking rifle though....

I think my next buy is going to be a bolt-action in 6.5 creedmoor though. I have a friend that just swapped over to it. He's really impressed with that round, and I read a lot of good things. All things considered, it's not TOO much more than a good .308 round.

[Milk 1027]

Originally Posted by Dangeruss

BTW guys...I heard from what I think is a pretty good source that there will be a price drop and big shipment of SCARs soon.

So besides better supply (which typically drives down cost), FN is supposedly lowering dealer cost. The retail is also supposed to change to $2500 for the 17S (instead of $2900). I hope this guy's info is right. I've been wanting to pick one up, but wasn't willing to pay out the nose for it.

i really hope thats true. id buy a scar over an ar any time

[shank0668]

Originally Posted by Dangeruss

Not just cheaper ammo...cheaper weapon and cheaper magazines.

I chose POF, and really like them, but there are so many weapons to choose from in so many different price ranges. Do you have a budget in mind?

I really like the look of the POF's. Budget... Doesn't really matter, just the longer it takes to get one.

Originally Posted by Mr Twisty

You got a nice rifle for the money... once you start reloading you'll be able to load it for not much more than .308

If you don't load too hot, brass will last a long time.

You can get sticker shock from some reloaders equipment, but if you do your homework you can get in to it fairly cheap.

I did one thing that even the hardcore accuracy guys think is overkill... I deprime then clean my brass with a Thumblers Tumbler and SS roller bearing media. Since I clean brass in my kitchen this technique doesn't throw dust like a dry media cleaner.

I also use a scale that's so accurate I have to turn off my ceiling fan and hold my breath to use it ... but those are my two splurges, the rest of my equipment is on the low side, like a Lee classic 4 hole turret press and Lee dies.

Thanks, yes I will have to get into it. I definitely need to research everything first. I may just buy an expensive setup with my brothers.

[TRC-SS]

Anybody have the Springfield XDS 45cal.

I would love to get my hands on one, looking to see what people think of them. Massachusetts has strict gun laws and this is definately not allowed to be sold here in Mass through a dealer. Even being in Law Enforcement

[kalimus]

Originally Posted by TRC-SS

Anybody have the Springfield XDS 45cal.

I would love to get my hands on one, looking to see what people think of them. Massachusetts has strict gun laws and this is definately not allowed to be sold here in Mass through a dealer. Even being in Law Enforcement

My sister has one. She said it hurts her hands to fire it at the range after awhile. But she's also a baby. What is it about Mass laws that won't let you have an XDS?

[TRC-SS]

Originally Posted by kalimus

My sister has one. She said it hurts her hands to fire it at the range after awhile. But she's also a baby. What is it about Mass laws that won't let you have an XDS?

Must have 10lb trigger pull, external safety switch and loaded one in the chamber indicators

[Dangeruss]

Originally Posted by kalimus

3200 for an AR-10 is a lot. Is it worth it? I've wanted an AR-10 for a while, and I am thinking about just building one. The POF is a beautiful looking rifle though....

I think my next buy is going to be a bolt-action in 6.5 creedmoor though. I have a friend that just swapped over to it. He's really impressed with that round, and I read a lot of good things. All things considered, it's not TOO much more than a good .308 round.

If I wanted to pay that much I would've probably moved up to a KAC.

I picked mine up for $2400. They aren't cheap, but I really wanted gas piston, and got hooked after shooting my friend's P415. It's very solid, and I really like the NP3 coating. It was designed to run completely dry if necessary.

I haven't even had a chance to shoot the .308 yet, but my P415 is great. I took it straight out of the box and shot 200 rounds through it without a hitch.

Originally Posted by Milk 1027

i really hope thats true. id buy a scar over an ar any time

Yea...gonna keep my eye out. If I hear anything else I'll post up.

Originally Posted by shank0668

I really like the look of the POF's. Budget... Doesn't really matter, just the longer it takes to get one.

Thanks, yes I will have to get into it. I definitely need to research everything first. I may just buy an expensive setup with my brothers.

I did a ton of research on my own, and ultimately had the chance to shoot the POF. At this level you should also look at LWRC, Larue Tactical, Noveske, Daniel Defense, etc.

You can also save some money with Colt, DMPS, Troy and endless other brands. They're all great weapons, and should do everything you need them to. Many of the guys in this thread know a lot more than I do, and a lot of them build their own.

I'd hit your local range and try some out and figure out what's best for you. Good luck.

[Bhobbs]

Originally Posted by shank0668

I think I retract my desire for a .338... DAMN AMMO IS EXPENSIVE. .300 win mag it is...

You gotta pay to play. Reloading takes.338 LM down to $1.50 per shot from what I have seen. That includes a few reloads on the brass.

[kalimus]

Originally Posted by Dangeruss

If I wanted to pay that much I would've probably moved up to a KAC.

I picked mine up for $2400. They aren't cheap, but I really wanted gas piston, and got hooked after shooting my friend's P415. It's very solid, and I really like the NP3 coating. It was designed to run completely dry if necessary.

I haven't even had a chance to shoot the .308 yet, but my P415 is great. I took it straight out of the box and shot 200 rounds through it without a hitch.

My AR is a gas impingement. There are a advantages and disadvantages to each system. I would like a piston rifle as well, because I think in a SHTF situation, the piston rifle will be better suited as it doesn't require the same level of cleaning (all that gas doesn't get into the upper). On the other hand, it is more parts to possibly fail, they are generally more expensive, and the hit of the piston can cause the bolt assembly to "see-saw".

That being said, I've never read anythign about noticable increased wear on a piston system, or it's piston being fragile. And as far as DI goes... the Filthy 14 is proof of how much buildup it can take without cleaning, as long as it's lubed. A piece from that article:

We received the carbine in late 2008 and put #14 into service shortly thereafter.
At Brady, Texas, in March 2009, it suffered a malfunction, which was reduced with Immediate Action. The bolt was wiped down at 6,450 rounds.
At Prairie du Chien, Wisconsin, in May 2009, it had several failures to extract, and the extractor spring was replaced at 13,010 rounds. This is far beyond the normal extractor spring life under these conditions.
At Wamego, Kansas, in June 2009, two bolt lugs broke at 16,400 rounds. We replaced the BCG. Considering the firing schedule, this is within normal parameters.
At Columbus, Ohio, in November 2009, we had several failures to extract at 24,450 rounds. The shooter gave it a field cleaning and replaced the extractor and extractor spring.
At 28,905 rounds, we finally cleaned Filthy 14. As part of our year-end maintenance schedule, we inspect and replace parts as necessary. Filthy 14 looked like the inside of the crankcase of Uncle Ed’s ’49 Packard. It was disgusting to look at and contaminated everything near it, somewhat like the toner cartridges for old printers.
I plopped it into a parts washer filled with Slip 725 parts cleaner, and 20 minutes later it was clean. Mostly clean, anyway.
We have never used a bore brush in the barrel of this gun. We did run a patch down the barrel twice, but that was all. At 50 yards it still shoots two-inch groups, and we understand that it might not at 100 yards and beyond, but we are happy with the fact that, even at 50 yards, the gun is capable of tighter groups than most of the people running it.
We have never used a chamber brush in this gun either. We were often told that this was an absolute must.
Sure…
At the last class in Casa Grande, Arizona, at approximately 30,000 rounds, we had several failures to extract. We replaced the extractor spring and wiped down the BCG.

That's pretty impressive for any gun. I likely will never fire 30,000 rounds through my rifle. I guess there really isn't much of anything that says "DI or Pison is better than another". I HAVE heard they feel a little different to shoot as far as recoil is concerned, but I haven't had the opportunity to see for myself.

[Dangeruss]

Originally Posted by kalimus

My AR is a gas impingement. There are a advantages and disadvantages to each system. I would like a piston rifle as well, because I think in a SHTF situation, the piston rifle will be better suited as it doesn't require the same level of cleaning (all that gas doesn't get into the upper). On the other hand, it is more parts to possibly fail, they are generally more expensive, and the hit of the piston can cause the bolt assembly to "see-saw".

That being said, I've never read anythign about noticable increased wear on a piston system, or it's piston being fragile.

Yea...I went through all the piston vs DI stuff, and ultimately settled on piston. It is more expensive, and does weigh more, but it shoots great with very little lubrication. I also enjoy the shorter cleaning time.

Carrier tilt (or "see-saw") is really a thing of the past in most good modern piston systems.

A lot of high end manufacturers (POF, LWRC, HK, F/N) are using pistons even with the higher costs. If they can bring the cost down, I think you'll see more people picking them up.

[2010SS2SS]

Piston runs cooler and cleaner....

Simple as that! Without the carbon laiden gases being pushed back into the chamber like DI rifles the weapons stay cleaner. As for potential failures they are about the same.

Stoner actually wanted the gas piston set up in the AR's from day one but was over riden by Armalite execs

[AZ Charlie]

Originally Posted by 2010SS2SS

Piston runs cooler and cleaner....

Simple as that! Without the carbon laiden gases being pushed back into the chamber like DI rifles the weapons stay cleaner. As for potential failures they are about the same.

Stoner actually wanted the gas piston set up in the AR's from day one but was over riden by Armalite execs

I second that...I run piston even with my SBR AR. It makes a huge difference running a suppressor as well - much cleaner and alot less gas blowback.

Here is a pic of my Scar heavy (I am on the right)...Love the Scar 16 and 17!