MR HYDE IS COMING TO LIFE

[garcmol]

W

T

F,

over????



Blue painter's tape over the chrome areas when you start wrenching. It can save the day.

What a mess.

[Dr Jkel]

Originally Posted by garcmol

W

T

F,

over????



Blue painter's tape over the chrome areas when you start wrenching. It can save the day.

What a mess.

I said the exact same thing......We are going to wait to pull the fuel injection unit until we get the motor out of the truck and on a stand....It will make working on it alot easier and alot easier to clean.

[Dr Jkel]

Tuesday February 21, 2012

Time for some more updates and lessons learned.........

We have spent the better part of a week tuning the truck. We are using TunerPro from Moates since it is probably the best for TPI/MPI units and they have all the hardware and software needed to be able to tune a vehicle.

Friday night we " THOUGHT " we had the tune pretty good...it was idling fine, no surging, no bucking and it started every time on the first try....but as I said we "THOUGHT". We had tried a "Redneck" fix on the vacuum leak ( Duct Tape) just to see if we could get it consistent.

Since the idle was going so well we decided to increase the load.....and then the problems started. To get the truck to dile correctly we tuned in 15 psi of vacuum at idle.

We ran it up a couple of times to around 4 k rpm's and the vacuum leak came back. No matter what we did it still had a leak. Since the upper air intake and risers are secured to the lower intake manifold I asked Matt a simple question.....Do you think the bolts are loose and what would happen if the came out?

Matt immediately turned off the truck and explained that if the internal bolts came loose that it could ruin the motor if the went into the oil ports. So we decided to take the whole fuel injection unit off. We were going to do this once it was painted but the thought of a loose bolt grenading the motor changed our minds.

So we took the top off the motor. Once we got the throttle body off we noticed fuel squirting in the top of the air intake from a vacuum line going to the fuel pressure regulator....????? I just put a brand new one on it...didn't understand that.

Once we got everything un-attached we pulled the unit and started taking it apart. Good thing was the bolts had no way of coming out since they secured them with SILICONE What is it with the silicone????

Once we got the whole thing disassembled we started checking things. So as I cleaned all the mounting surfaces to get rid of the silicone Matt checked them for straigtness. We also noticed that all the mounting surfaces were "CHROME".

Chrome is not even and will never be flat....NEVER. So trying to seal a joint with a gasket is futile...that is why they used SILICONE Every flat surface - intake to heads, intake to risers, riser to upper intake were chrome and were not flat. You could actually set the pieces on each other and the would wobble....No wonder we had vacuum leaks.

We also noticed that one of the interior runners had a hole in it....it looks like a casting hole so basically air was not going into the runner but under the bottom intake manifold.

Upon further inspection the riser blocks were not port matched to neither the top nor bottom intake manifold.....While this may not actually hurt it does kill power. So Sunday Night I went to bed really pissed.

More on the next post.

[Dr Jkel]

After a nights sleep I discussed with Matt what my options were....and basically I had two...fix what I have or buy new.......Machine cost would be pretty high we assumed not to mention re-chroming everything if the slipped.

So I called Street and Performance...the manufacturors of the unit. I explained what was happening and the problems I had and the only solution I knew of was to take it to a machine shop and have everything milled flat.

LUCKILY the owner told me to send it all back to him and he would fix what needs fixing...SO today UPS will be taking it back...I have no idea how long it will take...hopefully not long.

So with that "Hopefully" being resolved and really waiting on the I decided to take the transmission out and get it fixed during all this wait time. Of course this was quite comical.

I went to Matts shop and he loaned me some tools that would make it easier for me. I already had a transmission jack so we are good to go.......welll maybe.

Transmission fluid does not taste good at all......Just because you drain the tranny doesn't mean it is empty so when I loosened the cooler lines ...you guessed it I got a mouth full. It ain't funny.

Havint not pulled a transmission for some 20 years I had forgotten some things but after a while I had everything loose and slowly started lowering the tranny......Woooo it's out........Now the problem is how do I get it out from under the truck. Seems the tranny jack is a little high and wouldn't let it go low enough to get it out from under the truck while on the jack......I tried jacking the truck up but the jack stands we already at the highest point. I guess I could have stacked wood under the jack stands and raised it that way but that didn't really seem like a good idea to me, especially since I was all by myself.

So I did the next best thing....I took a BFH.....NO Not really I slowly slid the tranny off the jack onto the floor and I had enough room to slide it from under the truck......My poor new garage floor.

Finally I got it out, loaded on the truck and took it to the shop.

Once there they did a quick tear down to see what the problem was and as suspected the 3/4 clutches were toast......It did appear that the unit had been recently rebuilt so I guess idiot didn't lie about that but the unit was not a TCI Streetfighter 600........This 700R4 was originally a tranny for a V-6 S-10 and when they built it they went back completly stock and with upwards of 500 hp it just aint gonna work...keep in mind that we have yet to make the truck run correctly but on our little initital test drive I guess it fried it, or the 6 miles that idiot put on it....either way it would have never held up.

So they are going to put some hardened stuff in the internal parts, use some heavy duty clutches, change the 165hp servo to a more appropriate one, use a heavy duty band and upgrade all the little things they know how to do to make it last under the current HP load........Luckily I got to see a 700R4 they built in action. It has been built for 8 years, has 650 hp behind it and they dog the piss out of the car...so if it will last in that I am sure mine will be fine.

So now the wait game happens...waiting on the tranny to be built and waiting on Street and Performance to do their thing.......hopefully once I get it all back and installed we won't have ANY more issues

We shouldn't.....the only thing we haven't took apart is the motor and rear end and we just might look at the rear end while we are waiting...but it didn't have any whining....just have to see what Matt says.

[Darth_Emma]

Damn. Nothing... absolutely NOTHING was done properly on the truck at the "idiot" shop. I feel for you. I fo not have the intestinal fortitude to stick with it like you have. You find a problem and you fix it. I really admire that. The feeling of satisfaction will be all the greater when it is done and done right this time.

[garcmol]

This sucks. But it will be done right this time!

Are you holding onto this programming software? Just curious because it sounds like your truck has the same ECM as my 91 (and nooooooooo one seems to tune it anymore). I don't know shit about PROM chips or burning chips, but would love to get this car datalogged before F Body Gathering.

[Dr Jkel]

Originally Posted by Darth_Emma

Damn. Nothing... absolutely NOTHING was done properly on the truck at the "idiot" shop. I feel for you. I fo not have the intestinal fortitude to stick with it like you have. You find a problem and you fix it. I really admire that. The feeling of satisfaction will be all the greater when it is done and done right this time.

Yeah you are so right...NOTHING that has been done on this truck has been done right....NOTHING.....The fuel injection system is more on the manufacturor BUT it all should have been checked before it was installed. I know they had troubles making it run and instead of finding the issues the just "Rednecked" it up........Once I get all my ducks in a row they will wish they had.

Originally Posted by garcmol

This sucks. But it will be done right this time!

Are you holding onto this programming software? Just curious because it sounds like your truck has the same ECM as my 91 (and nooooooooo one seems to tune it anymore). I don't know shit about PROM chips or burning chips, but would love to get this car datalogged before F Body Gathering.

You are right that it wil be done right now but the frustration is that I already paid to have this done and now I am having to fix it. Street and Performance said it will probably take about 2 weeks to fix this stuff....so I am looking at about three weeks before I even get it back...probably more like a month.....so my goal of driving it on my birthday is pretty much a pipe dream at this time.


As far as the tuning items....Matt has all of it stored on his computer...I purchased some of the hardware stuff to help him use it on the TPI...it really does me no good...I figured for all his help it was the least I could do.....BUT I am way ahead of you on this...I already talked to Matt about your '91 and in true Matt fashion he said he would look at yours anytime Got ya covered.

[garcmol]

Originally Posted by Dr Jkel

Yeah you are so right...NOTHING that has been done on this truck has been done right....NOTHING.....The fuel injection system is more on the manufacturor BUT it all should have been checked before it was installed. I know they had troubles making it run and instead of finding the issues the just "Rednecked" it up........Once I get all my ducks in a row they will wish they had.



You are right that it wil be done right now but the frustration is that I already paid to have this done and now I am having to fix it. Street and Performance said it will probably take about 2 weeks to fix this stuff....so I am looking at about three weeks before I even get it back...probably more like a month.....so my goal of driving it on my birthday is pretty much a pipe dream at this time.


As far as the tuning items....Matt has all of it stored on his computer...I purchased some of the hardware stuff to help him use it on the TPI...it really does me no good...I figured for all his help it was the least I could do.....BUT I am way ahead of you on this...I already talked to Matt about your '91 and in true Matt fashion he said he would look at yours anytime Got ya covered.

I know you paid for this and having to go back and do it yourself is absolute !! Don't know how that shop could even look at a customer and be happy with their product. Guess we know now why he kept insisting on keeping the truck. Just

That's cool that Matt would do that! I think I need an O2 sensor, and even if I don't it can't hurt. But mine idles rough until it's warmed up. Then smooth as could be. So something with cold cycle is off (or the O2 is jacked). The cats are off, not by me. I'm finishing it up soon I hope.

[Dr Jkel]

I will ask him about the cold start problem but when you get ready just let me know...Matt will be more than glad to look at it for you.

[garcmol]

This 700R4 was originally a tranny for a V-6 S-10

I'll tell you, it's scary how close the parts on an S10 blazer/pick up and a third gen camaro are. The rear axle can swap, lots of guys in the 90s were dropping V8s in their S10s cause the transmission just needed a bellhousing swap to fit. You can still buy that bellhousing! Which I suspect is on your truck That's a shame.

[Dr Jkel]

The Transmission man ( Tim) said it was for a V-6 and then he showed me the difference in the cases. It is a slight difference and it seems that a tab is shortened to fit in the tranny tunnel, but everything inside is the same except for part strength....the V-6 was good for about 250 horse in the 90's and when I put nearly 500 behind it ....well it didn't last past the test drive.

[PeeBee]

Originally Posted by Dr Jkel

The Transmission man ( Tim) said it was for a V-6 and then he showed me the difference in the cases. It is a slight difference and it seems that a tab is shortened to fit in the tranny tunnel, but everything inside is the same except for part strength....the V-6 was good for about 250 horse in the 90's and when I put nearly 500 behind it ....well it didn't last past the test drive.

Hmm.. Know how you feel... When I test drove the Tuscan (95% finished, in September 2010), it still had the T5 gearbox. It lasted for about a day, then 3rd gear gave in...

Took it back to England, and it's been there since then... Few weeks ago they called that they'll replace the supercharger with a turbocharger as they can't get the 600hp I asked for (out of a 4 liter, NA 400hp racey engine). Wonder how long it'll take this time, before I can drive it again...

[Dr Jkel]

Originally Posted by PeeBee

Wonder how long it'll take this time, before I can drive it again...

Thats what I have been saying for the past 10 years.......I know it ain't funny.

[PeeBee]

I'm half way, compared to you... 5 years...

And 6 months on the Camaro thanks to the stupid government here :(:(:(