Video: 2013 Cadillac ATS at the Nurburgring

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65

Gen V V8s will be designated LT.

I figured they'd go with GOD1 or GOD2. But seriously, that may turn out to be a little confusing for the company.

Originally Posted by DGthe3

If true, I will be very surprised.

[truth411]

Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65

ATS engines will be...

2.5L Naturally Aspirated I-4 (Export Markets only)
2.0L Turbocharged High-Output I-4
3.6L LFX V6
6.2L LT1 V8 (V-series)

My only concern is the LFX as the mid trim sport level. It's going to have a hard time competing with BMW 335i turbo 3.0 v6 making 300+ HP and more importantly 300+ lbs of torque. I was hoping gm would have their TT V6 ready. If there is no Z28, an ATS-V might be my next vehicle.

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by a_Username

I figured they'd go with GOD1 or GOD2. But seriously, that may turn out to be a little confusing for the company.

They've been recycling names for a while now. For example, the 'L99' was used in Caprices during the mid 90's. Back then it was a 4.3L cousin to the LT1. The LS6 was a high output 454 big block in the 70's

That said ... I would have thought that for the next series of engines they'd go from 'LS' to 'LR'

[ParisTNDude]

I would bet on a turbocharged, dual overhead cam, direct injected, variable valve timing, 3.6-3.8 engine with somewhere in the 350-380 HP range. That in a 3300-3400 lb sedan would compete well with BMW and Audi, especially with magnetic ride technology and good tires.

[FenwickHockey65]

Originally Posted by truth411

My only concern is the LFX as the mid trim sport level. It's going to have a hard time competing with BMW 335i turbo 3.0 v6 making 300+ HP and more importantly 300+ lbs of torque. I was hoping gm would have their TT V6 ready. If there is no Z28, an ATS-V might be my next vehicle.

A 3.0L TT LF3 V6 is in development but it's unknown if ATS will get it. CTS would be a more possible candidate, XTS is definite.

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by ParisTNDude

I would bet on a turbocharged, dual overhead cam, direct injected, variable valve timing, 3.6-3.8 engine with somewhere in the 350-380 HP range. That in a 3300-3400 lb sedan would compete well with BMW and Audi, especially with magnetic ride technology and good tires.

That weight looks very optimistic to me. The FWD 2.0L turbo Sonata weighs about 3400 lbs, and you're saying a RWD luxury sport sedan with a V6 is going to weigh that much, or less? I don't see it happening any time soon. A comparable 3 series or C class to what you mentioned is in the 3600-3700 lb range. And if GM is planning on putting a V8 under the hood, expect the ATS to be the heaviest of the bunch. Even if they don't ... I'd still expect the ATS to be the heaviest of the bunch, GM is known for many things ... but saving weight is not one of them

[Black5thgen]

2 things pop into my head.

1) It looks like it's moving pretty well and looks awesome. I want one!!

2) If the 6th gen is based off the ATS platform it looks like it will have smaller wheels. 5th gen could be the only generation to get 20's and that's a good thing IMO.

[a_Username]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

That weight looks very optimistic to me. The FWD 2.0L turbo Sonata weighs about 3400 lbs, and you're saying a RWD luxury sport sedan with a V6 is going to weigh that much, or less? I don't see it happening any time soon. A comparable 3 series or C class to what you mentioned is in the 3600-3700 lb range. And if GM is planning on putting a V8 under the hood, expect the ATS to be the heaviest of the bunch. Even if they don't ... I'd still expect the ATS to be the heaviest of the bunch, GM is known for many things ... but saving weight is not one of them

Your expecting ~3750 lbs or so? That doesn't look like that much of an improvement over the Zeta platforms.

[lil_chef]

Originally Posted by a_Username

Your expecting ~3750 lbs or so? That doesn't look like that much of an improvement over the Zeta platforms.

i don't think the ATS is much smaller than the CTS and that looks like 500-600 LB of savings over the CTS. we could attribute about 200-300 LB to the decrease in size and 300-400 lb of savings from the new platform. not bad if you ask me.

that would also put the camaro into the 3400-3600 LB range which is where we all wanted to see the 5th gen at before it was officially revealed. and that also would put it right with where the current mustang is at.

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by a_Username

Your expecting ~3750 lbs or so? That doesn't look like that much of an improvement over the Zeta platforms.

Yes and no. I don't expect radical improvements, but that is still a pretty big improvement. A ~3750 lb ATS would be a midsize luxury car with a turbocharged V6. The ~3750 lb V6 Camaros lack forced induction and a lot of the luxury appointments you'd find in a Cadillac.

Or, we can think of it the other way. A V8 engine would weigh about the same as a forced induction V6, and they'd need roughly equal drivetrain components so the overall weight difference between them would be minimal. And they could pull at least 50 lbs of luxury out of the car going from Cadillac to Camaro, maybe 100. That would put a 6th gen SS at 3650-3700 lbs, or about 150-200 lbs less than what the SS starts at today. Thats pretty substantial, and within 100 lbs of the Mustang GT.

And if Ford goes to an IRS & increases the chassis rigidity (for both safety regs and to improve the handling) they're going to have a hard time keeping weight the same between generations, let alone losing any. So come 2016 I expect the Camaro & Mustang to weigh within about 50 lbs of each other, and I'd flip a coin to pick which one will be lighter.

[lil_chef]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Yes and no. I don't expect radical improvements, but that is still a pretty big improvement. A ~3750 lb ATS would be a midsize luxury car with a turbocharged V6. The ~3750 lb V6 Camaros lack forced induction and a lot of the luxury appointments you'd find in a Cadillac.

Or, we can think of it the other way. A V8 engine would weigh about the same as a forced induction V6, and they'd need roughly equal drivetrain components so the overall weight difference between them would be minimal. And they could pull at least 50 lbs of luxury out of the car going from Cadillac to Camaro, maybe 100. That would put a 6th gen SS at 3650-3700 lbs, or about 150-200 lbs less than what the SS starts at today. Thats pretty substantial, and within 100 lbs of the Mustang GT.

And if Ford goes to an IRS & increases the chassis rigidity (for both safety regs and to improve the handling) they're going to have a hard time keeping weight the same between generations, let alone losing any. So come 2016 I expect the Camaro & Mustang to weigh within about 50 lbs of each other, and I'd flip a coin to pick which one will be lighter.

the mustang is getting smaller as well, doesn't that in itself increase rigidity? almost like a win/win situation.

[Kyle2k]

Originally Posted by lil_chef

the mustang is getting smaller as well, doesn't that in itself increase rigidity? almost like a win/win situation.

Nope, it doesn't, but it will still be fun to see what they come up with.

[lil_chef]

Originally Posted by Kyle2k

Nope, it doesn't, but it will still be fun to see what they come up with.

maybe i'm thinking of rigidity differently but decreasing the size of the frame while keeping the same design would make it harder to "bend/twist" and therefore increase rigidity?

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by Kyle2k

Nope, it doesn't, but it will still be fun to see what they come up with.

Actually, it does ... but its on a different order of magnitude than whats required. Tweaking the dimensions a bit can make it, lets say for the sake of argument, 5% stronger. But to meet increasing regulations, some things need to be say 50% stronger. And for something like the torsional rigidity (for handling), an automaker can improve it by a factor of 10, or even more in some instances.