Pontiac coming back?

[rbuzz00]

I found an interesting advertisement on the inside of the rear cover of my May/June issue of Car and Driver that brings up more questions than it does answers. The headline is "Make Some Noise...Pontiac Is Back".

It starts off by mentioning that it's been 15 years since Pontiac left and says "America needs us. The future needs us. So Pontiac is back."

It then goes on to say they will first come out with a hybrid system using a battery and electric motor to start a 667-hp-supercharged 372-cubic-inch V-8.

It goes on to say that Pontiac is here to offer a future filled with V-8s, great sounds, gold pinstripe, and window louvers. A V-8 and great sounds sounds great, but I'm not so sure about gold pinstripes and window louvers. Well, maybe to real Pontiac fanatics. It's hard to follow the hidden meaning of all that, but that last part seems to insinuate that something like a Trans Am may be coming.

Nowhere on the ad is there any GM emblem, or the mention of GM, and there is a weird little disclaimer at the bottom of the ad: "Do you need to be told that this advertisement is fake and not to be taken seriously? Our lawyers think you do."

So is Pontiac coming back, or is this just a fake advertisement meant to gauge the interest of GM possible bringing back the iconic Pontiac brand? Or could it be something from one of the manufacturers of clones of various Pontiac models? Like I said, it brings up more questions than it supplies answers.

Surely GM wouldn't be foolish enough to cancel the Camaro only to bring back Pontiac, which would mean that the Trans Am would eventually return.
Performance cars are losing to SUVs as far as sales go, so why would GM reinvent a performance oriented division? What about the switch to EVs? And what could Pontiac bring out that already isn't available with the Chevy brand? Like I said, lots of questions but no answers.

So what do you think? Is this ad just checking for interest in the return of Pontiac, or is it fake, or what?

[Evergreen6]

Anyone can buy ad space in a magazine. The fine print says it all, but hey, it sure created a lot of buzz on the internet, didn't it?

[Mr_Draco]

Yea, the fine print says the ad is fake and not to be taken seriously.

[rbuzz00]

I can't believe it's true, but there has to be something behind it.

Advertising space isn't cheap, and whoever posted this ad did it with the purpose of doing something or getting a response from someone. It would be interesting to find out the reason behind the ad.

Maybe part 2 will be coming soon.

[olrocker]

Don’t play with my emotions

[102SS]

Originally Posted by rbuzz00

I can't believe it's true, but there has to be something behind it.

Advertising space isn't cheap, and whoever posted this ad did it with the purpose of doing something or getting a response from someone. It would be interesting to find out the reason behind the ad.

Maybe part 2 will be coming soon.

Write a letter to the editor.

Surprised nobody read Philip's love for the Alpha Romeo Milano on the previous page

[lbls1]

Question is, why did they fold in the first place? They may have survived their hard times with a little work. They had at least one glimmer of hope at the time that they folded. Perhaps they could've held on for dear life. It was in part of a deal with the US that GM had to close Pontiac.

I don't see GM bringing it back unless they've been in talks with the Biden Administration.

[Evergreen6]

Originally Posted by lbls1

Question is, why did they fold in the first place? They may have survived their hard times with a little work. They had at least one glimmer of hope at the time that they folded. Perhaps they could've held on for dear life. It was in part of a deal with the US that GM had to close Pontiac.

I don't see GM bringing it back unless they've been in talks with the Biden Administration.

The US government hasn't been a shareholder of GM since 2013.

GM would bring back Pontiac if they thought it could be a viable brand. By 2008 GM was nearly bankrupt, and Pontiac wasn't doing well.

[102SS]

Originally Posted by Evergreen6

The US government hasn't been a shareholder of GM since 2013.

GM would bring back Pontiac if they thought it could be a viable brand. By 2008 GM was nearly bankrupt, and Pontiac wasn't doing well.

The thing is Buick sold a lot of cars in China and they had all sorts of new product in the pipeline read to go.

Pontiac on the other hand had very little new product in the final stages of development.

Awesome Bob(Lutz) fought like crazy for the brand but he was fighting a losing battle in the boardroom and with the government

He decided to step down and retire

[olrocker]

Originally Posted by 102SS

The thing is Buick sold a lot of cars in China and they had all sorts of new product in the pipeline read to go.

Pontiac on the other hand had very little new product in the final stages of development.

Awesome Bob(Lutz) fought like crazy for the brand but he was fighting a losing battle in the boardroom and with the government

He decided to step down and retire

Exactly!! See the video I linked below to a great interview Maximum Bob did about Pontiac just last year

Originally Posted by lbls1

Question is, why did they fold in the first place? They may have survived their hard times with a little work. They had at least one glimmer of hope at the time that they folded. Perhaps they could've held on for dear life. It was in part of a deal with the US that GM had to close Pontiac.

I don't see GM bringing it back unless they've been in talks with the Biden Administration.

It’s true the Feds forced them to axe the division. But that was 3 administrations ago. If GM wanted to they could resurrect the brand now. The logo, history, and copyrights to the brand are still owned by GM.

Originally Posted by Evergreen6

The US government hasn't been a shareholder of GM since 2013.

GM would bring back Pontiac if they thought it could be a viable brand. By 2008 GM was nearly bankrupt, and Pontiac wasn't doing well.

It was not doing well because it had lackluster product that was just rebadged Chevies.

Here’s a great interview with Bob Lutz just last year. He knew how to save Pontiac if the feds had just listened to him. This is why he’s one of the best automotive product specialists in history. He knew exactly what Pontiac needed to regain profitability.

Oh yeah, he also has some great things to say about our Camaros…… coming from him you know we have some of the best cars GM ever made. Evah!!

https://youtu.be/PJ7fyx9yQAU?si=c6IG6Si1L-uGKtph

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by olrocker

Exactly!! See the video I linked below to a great interview Maximum Bob did about Pontiac just last year




It’s true the Feds forced them to axe the division. But that was 3 administrations ago. If GM wanted to they could resurrect the brand now. The logo, history, and copyrights to the brand are still owned by GM.



It was not doing well because it had lackluster product that was just rebadged Chevies.

Here’s a great interview with Bob Lutz just last year. He knew how to save Pontiac if the feds had just listened to him. This is why he’s one of the best automotive product specialists in history. He knew exactly what Pontiac needed to regain profitability.

Oh yeah, he also has some great things to say about our Camaros…… coming from him you know we have some of the best cars GM ever made. Evah!!

https://youtu.be/PJ7fyx9yQAU?si=c6IG6Si1L-uGKtph

During the walk up to bankruptcy one thing was very clear…GM had too many brands to feed and too many nameplates within each brand. What wasn’t clear was which brands should survive and which should die. Oldsmobile and Buick had a lot of overlap. Pontiac and Chevrolet had a lot of overlap. GMC and Chevrolet had a lot of overlap. Saturn was its own thing, but beginning to look a lot more like slightly higher priced Chevrolets every day. Cadillac was its own thing. Hummer and Saab were in the mix but it was clear early on that they were goners.

Originally the Automotive Task Force wanted to GM to nuke Buick and GMC. GM pushed back. GMC had more conquest sales than any other division, so even though it’s trucks overlapped Chevrolet trucks big time, they were sold to people who wouldn’t set foot in a Chevrolet dealership and they were profitable. GMC saved. Buick was saved primarily on the potential of Buick in China. Oldsmobile was already on its way out, as were Saab and Hummer, so that just left Pontiac and Saturn to be dealt with. Neither had anything in the upcoming portfolios that wasn’t already covered by Chevrolet except the Kappa twins, Solstice and Skyy. Both were low volume roadsters nearing the end of their first generation and in search of a better platform for the next(?) generation. Easy kills.

The humorous thing is that in parallel to this is the Automotive Task Force was also pushing GM to absorb Chrysler and all those brands. Took about a week for us to show them that it would require either adding a number of additional brands (too many brands being a key reason for the bankruptcy position) and that the remedy to that would hav been to combine brands (Dodge = Pontiac, Chrysler = Buick, Plymouth = Chevrolet) and reduce thousands of people. We all know how that played out. Keep Hemi or Small Block? Keep HFV6 or PentaStar? The only easy part of the equation is that GM transmissions would be the standard.

[olrocker]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

During the walk up to bankruptcy one thing was very clear…GM had too many brands to feed and too many nameplates within each brand. What wasn’t clear was which brands should survive and which should die. Oldsmobile and Buick had a lot of overlap. Pontiac and Chevrolet had a lot of overlap. GMC and Chevrolet had a lot of overlap. Saturn was its own thing, but beginning to look a lot more like slightly higher priced Chevrolets every day. Cadillac was its own thing. Hummer and Saab were in the mix but it was clear early on that they were goners.

Originally the Automotive Task Force wanted to GM to nuke Buick and GMC. GM pushed back. GMC had more conquest sales than any other division, so even though it’s trucks overlapped Chevrolet trucks big time, they were sold to people who wouldn’t set foot in a Chevrolet dealership and they were profitable. GMC saved. Buick was saved primarily on the potential of Buick in China. Oldsmobile was already on its way out, as were Saab and Hummer, so that just left Pontiac and Saturn to be dealt with. Neither had anything in the upcoming portfolios that wasn’t already covered by Chevrolet except the Kappa twins, Solstice and Skyy. Both were low volume roadsters nearing the end of their first generation and in search of a better platform for the next(?) generation. Easy kills.

The humorous thing is that in parallel to this is the Automotive Task Force was also pushing GM to absorb Chrysler and all those brands. Took about a week for us to show them that it would require either adding a number of additional brands (too many brands being a key reason for the bankruptcy position) and that the remedy to that would hav been to combine brands (Dodge = Pontiac, Chrysler = Buick, Plymouth = Chevrolet) and reduce thousands of people. We all know how that played out. Keep Hemi or Small Block? Keep HFV6 or PentaStar? The only easy part of the equation is that GM transmissions would be the standard.

Someone I used to work with bought a brand new 2006 Sky Redline. In midnight blue with black interior. Fantastic car with the turbo 4 and 5 speed and 20” alloys. I always thought they looked much better inside and out than the Solstice. Clean, crisp lines and a sharp, aggressive nose.

Yes most of that is pretty much what Bob said in the interview. There’s more parts to it with Adam on his Rare Classic Cars channel on YouTube and IIRC Bob also alluded to the whole Chrysler proposal (of course he used to work there as well).

But when the task force refused to listen to Bob’s proposal to save Pontiac is when he “had enough of this (stuff)” and retired.

Unreal how sharp he still is at 92. And like George Burns, always with a big stogey in hand

[lbls1]

Originally Posted by Martinjlm

During the walk up to bankruptcy one thing was very clear…GM had too many brands to feed and too many nameplates within each brand. What wasn’t clear was which brands should survive and which should die. Oldsmobile and Buick had a lot of overlap. Pontiac and Chevrolet had a lot of overlap. GMC and Chevrolet had a lot of overlap. Saturn was its own thing, but beginning to look a lot more like slightly higher priced Chevrolets every day. Cadillac was its own thing. Hummer and Saab were in the mix but it was clear early on that they were goners.

Originally the Automotive Task Force wanted to GM to nuke Buick and GMC. GM pushed back. GMC had more conquest sales than any other division, so even though it’s trucks overlapped Chevrolet trucks big time, they were sold to people who wouldn’t set foot in a Chevrolet dealership and they were profitable. GMC saved. Buick was saved primarily on the potential of Buick in China. Oldsmobile was already on its way out, as were Saab and Hummer, so that just left Pontiac and Saturn to be dealt with. Neither had anything in the upcoming portfolios that wasn’t already covered by Chevrolet except the Kappa twins, Solstice and Skyy. Both were low volume roadsters nearing the end of their first generation and in search of a better platform for the next(?) generation. Easy kills.

The humorous thing is that in parallel to this is the Automotive Task Force was also pushing GM to absorb Chrysler and all those brands. Took about a week for us to show them that it would require either adding a number of additional brands (too many brands being a key reason for the bankruptcy position) and that the remedy to that would hav been to combine brands (Dodge = Pontiac, Chrysler = Buick, Plymouth = Chevrolet) and reduce thousands of people. We all know how that played out. Keep Hemi or Small Block? Keep HFV6 or PentaStar? The only easy part of the equation is that GM transmissions would be the standard.

I remember hearing about it on the Internet. Actually it made the news. I saw that move as a desperation act, and that it would be problematic at best. All of those brands mixed up in a single bag, and historically those models were separate and competitive. The other problem I saw was that Toyota would eventually overtake this big fat new conglomerate with GM and those Hemis. To me it was the best thing to keep the two companies separate.

[Martinjlm]

Originally Posted by olrocker

Someone I used to work with bought a brand new 2006 Sky Redline. In midnight blue with black interior. Fantastic car with the turbo 4 and 5 speed and 20” alloys. I always thought they looked much better inside and out than the Solstice. Clean, crisp lines and a sharp, aggressive nose.

Yes most of that is pretty much what Bob said in the interview. There’s more parts to it with Adam on his Rare Classic Cars channel on YouTube and IIRC Bob also alluded to the whole Chrysler proposal (of course he used to work there as well).

But when the task force refused to listen to Bob’s proposal to save Pontiac is when he “had enough of this (stuff)” and retired.

Unreal how sharp he still is at 92. And like George Burns, always with a big stogey in hand

Fun fact. I used to sit along the wall behind him (and my boss) in one of the forums where these discussions were taking place. Always liked to hear Bob’s perspective on things.

Fun fact#2: During the wind down of Pontiac I went to the local Pontiac / Buick dealer to get an oil change on my assigned vehicle. They had a Solstice GXP Coupe in the showroom that between the GM discounts and the money on the hood to clear out Pontiac inventory, I could have rolled out of the showroom for about $12,000. Called the wife to ask permission and got a David Letterman Top 10 list of why I shouldn’t do that. A few years later I was in my Chevy dealership getting a vehicle serviced and they had a Camaro Fifty SS Convertible in the showroom. Learning my lesson from the Solstice experience, I bought it and begged forgiveness. That’s why you guys have to put up with me today.