Something to think about

infernoinandout · 04-01-2009, 11:33 AM

I know GM sells a lot of vehicles but did you ever think that all the profits from the pre sale camaros will actually go to Wagoner for his 20 million buyout. Then add in 3-4 years r+d, tooling, etc. Exactly how many cars/years does it take to truly show a profit on a new car line?

rolnslo · 04-01-2009, 11:53 AM

Get your facts straight - the $20 million for Wagoner is his pension plan for putting 31 years in at GM, not a golden parachute/buyout. If GM goes into bankruptcy, only $833,000 of that $20 million is protected and he could lose the rest.

Now, figure that GM spent at least $1 billion on R&D, tooling, etc... for the Camaro. GM would have to sell 47620 LS models at a $21000 final invoice (dealer invoice minus any holdbacks, etc...) to recoup that $1 billion. BUT that doesn't take into account that GM is probably putting at least $15000 worth of materials/labor into each vehicle made. That leaves $6000 per vehicle to put towards the initial cost of R&D. They'd need to sell nearly 167,000 LS models to recoup that initial investment. If they can sell 80k per year, that's 2 years to payback the R&D costs, after that the remaining sales can go towards new R&D.

TheClassicCarKid · 04-01-2009, 11:55 AM

It's too bad we can't sell these things like Corollas-400,000 a year, and see profits in the first year.

infernoinandout · 04-01-2009, 12:58 PM

Thats really not to bad on the recovering money side but to reward a person for taking a company to the edge of bankruptcy is what I have a problem with. How much did he make in those 31 years? Reward success not failure.

dbotsfordtat · 04-01-2009, 01:19 PM

His retirement isn't nearly as big as some CEO's, but 20 Million? Did he poop gold coins for GM? The game is rigged.

*DGthe3* · 04-01-2009, 01:29 PM

Yes, Wagoners pension is coming exclusively from Camaro sales, and not a single dime is from his contributions over the last 3 decades.

04-01-2009, 11:33 AM	#1
infernoinandout Drives: 2010 camaross/rs Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: buffalo Posts: 461	Something to think about I know GM sells a lot of vehicles but did you ever think that all the profits from the pre sale camaros will actually go to Wagoner for his 20 million buyout. Then add in 3-4 years r+d, tooling, etc. Exactly how many cars/years does it take to truly show a profit on a new car line?

04-01-2009, 01:29 PM	#6
DGthe3 Moderator.ca Drives: 05 Grand Am GT Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Niagara, Canada Posts: 25,366	Yes, Wagoners pension is coming exclusively from Camaro sales, and not a single dime is from his contributions over the last 3 decades. __________________ Note, if I've gotten any facts wrong in the above, just ignore any points I made with them __________________ Originally Posted by FbodFather My sister's dentist's brother's cousin's housekeeper's dog-breeder's nephew sells coffee filters to the company that provides coffee to General Motors...... ........and HE WOULD KNOW!!!! __________________ Camaro Fest sub-forum

04-01-2009, 11:53 AM	#2
rolnslo Rolling along... Drives: 2011 2SS/RS SGM Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 4,366 View My Garage	Get your facts straight - the $20 million for Wagoner is his pension plan for putting 31 years in at GM, not a golden parachute/buyout. If GM goes into bankruptcy, only $833,000 of that $20 million is protected and he could lose the rest. Now, figure that GM spent at least $1 billion on R&D, tooling, etc... for the Camaro. GM would have to sell 47620 LS models at a $21000 final invoice (dealer invoice minus any holdbacks, etc...) to recoup that $1 billion. BUT that doesn't take into account that GM is probably putting at least $15000 worth of materials/labor into each vehicle made. That leaves $6000 per vehicle to put towards the initial cost of R&D. They'd need to sell nearly 167,000 LS models to recoup that initial investment. If they can sell 80k per year, that's 2 years to payback the R&D costs, after that the remaining sales can go towards new R&D.

04-01-2009, 12:58 PM	#4
infernoinandout Drives: 2010 camaross/rs Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: buffalo Posts: 461	Thats really not to bad on the recovering money side but to reward a person for taking a company to the edge of bankruptcy is what I have a problem with. How much did he make in those 31 years? Reward success not failure.

04-01-2009, 01:19 PM	#5
dbotsfordtat Drives: 2016 Camaro Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Iowa Posts: 499	His retirement isn't nearly as big as some CEO's, but 20 Million? Did he poop gold coins for GM? The game is rigged.