Silverado HD Bests F-350 in Rumble in the Rockies

[FenwickHockey65]

Chevy vs. Ford in Heavy-Duty Rumble in the Rockies
Link to Article

By Mark Levine
November 15, 2010

In late September, Chevrolet challenged Ford to a real-world showdown in the Colorado Rockies, similar to the Mike Rowe head-to-head towing competitions that Ford has used to promote the capabilities of its F-Series pickups. Ford declined, but the bowtie boys decided to press forward and invited PickupTrucks.com and Diesel Power magazine to witness the test.

We agreed with a few conditions: Chevrolet had to use test trucks purchased off the lot from Chevy and Ford dealers. They couldn't come from GM's captive test fleet. And the trucks had to be as "apples-to-apples" as possible when it came to features and equipment. While Chevrolet originally wanted to test three-quarter-ton HD pickups — the heart of the HD market — we had to use one-ton trucks because that was the only way to match equivalent rear axle ratios of 3.73. We also had to drive and instrument the trucks to measure the results ourselves. Chevy reps would be along for the ride.

Chevrolet met those conditions, and we picked up two brand-new dealer-bought HD pickups in Detroit. The 2011 Chevrolet Silverado 3500 LT four-wheel-drive crew cab came from Mike Savoie Chevrolet in Troy, Mich., with 8 miles on the odometer and 0.9 hours on the engine meter. The 2011 Ford F-350 Super Duty XLT four-wheel-drive crew cab was sold at Harold Zeigler Ford Lincoln in Elkhart, Ind., and driven to Detroit by a third-party fleet service. Two Diesel Power staffers drove the trucks 1,250 miles to Denver.

Full review and stats at the link.

[COPO_Chevy]

Finally some good, real world action between the two. Well done GM!

[chain777]

Now we know why Ford declined the challenge. That was an impressive win for the Chevy. Not only in acceleration, but in braking performance.

[syr74]

I think the real story here is that Ford is obviously not taking the engine-braking application very seriously. For somebody who was saying that the heavy-duty pickup manufacturers needed to look into that setup as a manufacturing possibility long before they actually did that is really disappointing.

That said, I have been thinking for a while that this is an area where the domestics are weaker than a lot of folks realize. Ford virtually never leads in power here and the engine-break issue adds another aspect where the just wont get with the program. GM is still hampering themselves with their front suspension setup and too thin sheet-metal both of which cause durability issues, and Dodge simply will not or cannot design an automatic transmission that is worth considering from a reliability perspective.

Nobody covers all the bases in this segment and, were Toyota or Nissan to take a really well thought out stab at it, I think we might be surprised at how well they could fare here. Somebody in Detroit needs to get it all together on one truck.

[hypurone]

Impressive!

[bigearl]

For me, this confirms a lot of what the grapevine has said about Ford trucks for quite a while. They overrate their tow capacity. Especially on their 1500s, but really across the product line. I don't doubt that they can actually tow the numbers they publish, but it's going to be strugging so hard that it's starting to get unsafe anywhere but relatively flat land.

[TheCaptain]

Gotta love it when a plan comes together!
Chevy for the win!

[DGthe3]

That was pretty surprising. On paper, you'd think that the Ford should win and if not, then they'd at least be pretty close. But it was extremely 1 sided for Chevy. The performance of the F-350 really dropped off as the altitude climbed:

Originally Posted by syr74

Nobody covers all the bases in this segment and, were Toyota or Nissan to take a really well thought out stab at it, I think we might be surprised at how well they could fare here. Somebody in Detroit needs to get it all together on one truck.

Yeah, because their half ton trucks kickass, right?

[bigearl]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Yeah, because their half ton trucks kickass, right?

I agree kind of, but when you look at truck sales- that's a lot of US market potential if they could hit the right combination. Never write them off, the US was all laughing at the little Corolla saying Toyota could never really get into the sedan market in the 80s- then poof *Camry* and the US has been reeling for 20 years.

And this truck is by UD which has been in a partnership with Nissan using Volvo engines for a while. They could probably put something together that's halfway good if they really dedicated their minds to it.

[DGthe3]

Originally Posted by bigearl

I agree kind of, but when you look at truck sales- that's a lot of US market potential if they could hit the right combination. Never write them off, the US was all laughing at the little Corolla saying Toyota could never really get into the sedan market in the 80s- then poof *Camry* and the US has been reeling for 20 years.

And this truck is by UD which has been in a partnership with Nissan using Volvo engines for a while. They could probably put something together that's halfway good if they really dedicated their minds to it.

The big difference is that there was also a JDM for small and midsize cars. All they had to do was tune their product to our tastes and thats that. But what about full size sedans? Unless you go into the luxury brands, the segment is essentially dominated by domestics. Same conditions exist for trucks. North America is pretty much the only place you'll ever see 1 ton pickups (or 3/4 ton, or half ton for that matter). Their small pickups (Tacoma in the US, I forget what their international one is called) do well, but the Tundra doesn't have nearly the same success, and Toyota put a lot of money and effort into it. Meanwhile, the Titan barely even registers to someone considering a 1/2 ton. The same would go for any attempt at something bigger.

[bigearl]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

The big difference is that there was also a JDM for small and midsize cars. All they had to do was tune their product to our tastes and thats that. But what about full size sedans? Unless you go into the luxury brands, the segment is essentially dominated by domestics. Same conditions exist for trucks. North America is pretty much the only place you'll ever see 1 ton pickups (or 3/4 ton, or half ton for that matter). Their small pickups (Tacoma in the US, I forget what their international one is called) do well, but the Tundra doesn't have nearly the same success, and Toyota put a lot of money and effort into it. Meanwhile, the Titan barely even registers to someone considering a 1/2 ton. The same would go for any attempt at something bigger.

I agree with what you are saying. My point is I just hope they don't get complacent in this market.

[Cmicasa the Great XvX]

Originally Posted by syr74

I think the real story here is that Ford is obviously not taking the engine-braking application very seriously.

I think the REAL STORY HERE is that GM WHOOOOOPED that Ford ASS

[syr74]

Originally Posted by DGthe3

Yeah, because their half ton trucks kickass, right?

I didn't say that they would, I said that they could. IMO the door is wide open for Dodge to really kick some sand in the face of Ford and GM by upping their HD diesel game too, although they have consistent problems of their own and it isn't like they are a newcomer.

GM has power delivery, and now stability it would seem as well, down pat. But people who encounter any kind of rough terrain still cringe when they see that torsion bar IFS and Gm has taken a bit of a beating for overall truck durability issues too (the thin sheetmetal story shows no sign of waning for example)

Ford on the other hand seems to think that good enough is good enough because their truck is the best seller and that shows through.

Originally Posted by Cmicasa the Great XvX

I think the REAL STORY HERE is that GM WHOOOOOPED that Ford ASS

I wont steal your joy, laugh it up.

[radz28]

I caught this on Autoblog and LOVE seeing GM colors in front. Considering all the hype, I believe this test was fairly suprising to me.

KUDOS GM!!! Gotta' love those Duramax/Allison commecials, too!!!