White House Getting Ready to Force Bankruptcy.

Scott@Bjorn3D · 03-29-2009, 07:21 PM

Fox News just reported that Obama is going to give a deadline tommorrow to get concessions from bond holders and unions or he will not give money and force bankruptcy. This breaking right after they announced Obama forced Wagoner out.

cyberbro · 03-29-2009, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott@Bjorn3D

Fox News just reported that Obama is going to give a deadline tommorrow to get concessions from bond holders and unions or he will not give money and force bankruptcy. This breaking right after they announced Obama forced Wagoner out.

A Dem trying to break the union? I wonder how many members voted for him?

Zabo · 03-29-2009, 08:18 PM

This whole damn thing has turned into a giant game of chicken. There are better ways than strong arming them, but aparently Obama sees this as an only option. I think we should all buy stock in Rolaids and Tylenol.

Number 3 · 03-29-2009, 08:33 PM

I think the Union put a lot of stock in Obama protecting them. I think this is a clear statement that he expects them to be in line with the rest of the industry in order to provide addtional funds. The bond holders were clearly holding out. If bankruptcy they would then depend on the courts and that is a poor position to be in. He is basically pushing them to get an agreement done as was expected under the Bush administration, by March 31.

detroitboy · 03-29-2009, 10:15 PM

Get your Camaro now while you still can. Anything can happen from now on....

Supermans · 03-29-2009, 10:20 PM

My prediction is the union will make some small concessions and the bailout will be given.. Then in six months or less GM is broke yet again and they will be aksing for another bailout and at that point, the Government after another loan will take even more control over GM until it controls it completely..I'm hoping bankruptcy does occur but I am doubtful it will considering Obama's record..It'll be an interesting day tomorrow..

FenwickHockey65 · 03-29-2009, 10:22 PM

Breaking news...

GM has 60 days to prove viability.

Chrysler has 30.

See ya Chrysler. It's been nice knowing you.

Supermans · 03-29-2009, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FenwickHockey65

Breaking news...

GM has 60 days to prove viability.

Chrysler has 30.

See ya Chrysler. It's been nice knowing you.

Where is the link?

FenwickHockey65 · 03-29-2009, 10:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Supermans

Where is the link?

http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/f...ructure-77243/

camaro5 · 03-29-2009, 10:35 PM

GM is asking their bondholders to give up two-thirds of the value of said bonds.

Nobody wants to give up two-thirds of their investment, but if GM files bankruptcy, the bondholders get nothing.

That's why GM will not meet the requirements specified - the bondholders say NO.

Justin · 03-29-2009, 10:38 PM

I'm starting to think that bankruptcy might be a better option. The media has been dragging GM's name around as it is. At least with bankruptcy they can shed some of the debt.

PQ · 03-30-2009, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justin

I'm starting to think that bankruptcy might be a better option. The media has been dragging GM's name around as it is. At least with bankruptcy they can shed some of the debt.

Problen is their suppliers are the debtees. And if they don't get paid they go out of business and the whole thing crumbles anyway.

This is why I went ahead and ordered my car. I just hope they build mine before some of this hits the fan. Like a V8 kill.

Tomash · 03-30-2009, 05:32 PM

(a small rant following -- be warned)

I still don't manage to understand how could they (GM, as I don't care about Chrysler anyway) screw it up so powerfully?
GM has Opel in Germany (with factories all over Europe) which is one of the most successful car companies selling in Europe and definitely bringing big profit for the GM (actually so big Opel wants to separate from GM to not get drained of its money by dying company).
GM has the whole ex-Daewoo stack (same thing about factories) doing cheap and popular (in developing countries, in Europe aswell) cars branded Chevrolet (Lacetti, Aveo, Epica, now Cruze). They definitely are profitable, as based on old and working platforms (no R&D costs) and selling well. (Daewoo Lanos, based on 30+ yrs old GM T platform, is still manufactured and sold in Ukraine -- and being damn popular!)
GM has Saab in Sweden which may have been a bit under the line recently, but not enough to drag the whole group down (it was always a relatively small manufacturer).

How much have they failed in US so that even big income from the whole european market is not enough? It means a giant, epic FAIL -- to eat out whole profit from outside US and still be on the red.

This means GM has lost on its homeground -- the US Market. Lost to what, Toyota and Honda? Wow.

I've seen a lot of crappy decisions going out from GM in recent years. I don't even want to talk about american market, as being an european I don't know anything about it. But treating Europe like a 2nd-class client was aiming straight for the knee -- and it landed. Europe hasn't seen official dealerships selling Corvettes (which ARE popular and liked in Europe, and their prices would make them definitely competitive to Porsche and other supercars) or other high-performance cars. GM has recently shut down a Hummer factory, because SUV sales dramatically dropped in US -- at the same time in Europe SUVs have seen the biggest growth in sales in 2008 (!) and I see Toyota's RAV4 or Honda's CRV and HRV all over the place (together with more expensive BMW X3 and X5 and Audi's SUVs).

As for the pony cars... do you know how many Ford dealerships in Europe oficially sell new Mustangs? None. Do you want to know how easy is to spot a individually-imported Mustang? Definitely harder that it would be had they been sold here officially, but still there's a lot of them. Hell, even I'm thinking about getting a Mustang from such importer, because GM doesn't want me to buy a Camaro easily in Europe. AND they've blocked american dealers from selling Camaro's overseas.
GM has announced availability of Camaro in Europe, even gave the price tag (17k EUR base) and... nothing. Not a word. No preorder for europeans. European Opel/Chevrolet dealers don't know crap about Camaro availability (it's spring 2009, goddamit!). You don't want to sell me a Camaro? Fine, I'll go visit Nissan dealership -- they're selling 350Z (and will be 370) since the very beginning of the model.

Anyone still wondering why The Big Three already lost the european market?
With it's full economy that hasn't been struck by recession as powerfully as the american one?
The Big Three has been outsmart by short and very clever people from a small, island country far away from both Europe and the US. Way to go, champs!

03-29-2009, 07:21 PM	#1
Scott@Bjorn3D Drives: Kami, 2013 2SS LS3 Luvin Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Eufaula, Alabama Posts: 6,427	White House Getting Ready to Force Bankruptcy. Fox News just reported that Obama is going to give a deadline tommorrow to get concessions from bond holders and unions or he will not give money and force bankruptcy. This breaking right after they announced Obama forced Wagoner out.

03-29-2009, 08:33 PM	#4
Number 3 Hail to the King baby! Drives: '19 XT4 2.0T & '22 VW Atlas 2.0T Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Illinois Posts: 12,306 View My Garage	I think the Union put a lot of stock in Obama protecting them. I think this is a clear statement that he expects them to be in line with the rest of the industry in order to provide addtional funds. The bond holders were clearly holding out. If bankruptcy they would then depend on the courts and that is a poor position to be in. He is basically pushing them to get an agreement done as was expected under the Bush administration, by March 31. __________________ "Speed, it seems to me, provides the one genuinely modern pleasure." - Aldous Huxley

03-29-2009, 10:15 PM	#5
detroitboy Pinholic Drives: 11 Silverado, 08 Shelby GT500 Conv. Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Macomb, Mi Posts: 697	Get your Camaro now while you still can. Anything can happen from now on.... __________________ Almost had a 2SS/RS, IOM, orange accent interior, 6 speed manual, sunroof & polished wheels ordered 01/19/07 3000 - 2/27/09 3400 - 3/27/09 3800 - 4/17/09 (built and lost in the vortex) ship date ??????? (I gave up and got a GT500) 5/11/09 - order cancelled 5/27/09 - vehicle arrived at dealership for whoever bought it after me

03-29-2009, 10:20 PM	#6
Supermans Camaro & Stang Enthusiast Drives: 2011 Mustang 5.0 in Kona Blue Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Miami Posts: 4,729 View My Garage	My prediction is the union will make some small concessions and the bailout will be given.. Then in six months or less GM is broke yet again and they will be aksing for another bailout and at that point, the Government after another loan will take even more control over GM until it controls it completely..I'm hoping bankruptcy does occur but I am doubtful it will considering Obama's record..It'll be an interesting day tomorrow.. __________________ Bought my Camaro from Eric Hall(817) 421-7266

03-29-2009, 10:22 PM	#7
FenwickHockey65 General Motors Aficionado Drives: 2023 GMC Canyon, 2023 Expedition Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Florida Posts: 37,375 View My Garage	Breaking news... GM has 60 days to prove viability. Chrysler has 30. See ya Chrysler. It's been nice knowing you. __________________ 2023 GMC Canyon Elevation 2023 Ford Expedition SSV (State-Issued)

03-29-2009, 08:18 PM	#3
Zabo Gunning for Sixth Drives: '03 ZR2 Blazer Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Woodhaven, Michigan Posts: 9,358 View My Garage	This whole damn thing has turned into a giant game of chicken. There are better ways than strong arming them, but aparently Obama sees this as an only option. I think we should all buy stock in Rolaids and Tylenol.

03-29-2009, 10:35 PM	#10
camaro5 Drives: X-15 Velocipede Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: SW Florida Posts: 4,630	GM is asking their bondholders to give up two-thirds of the value of said bonds. Nobody wants to give up two-thirds of their investment, but if GM files bankruptcy, the bondholders get nothing. That's why GM will not meet the requirements specified - the bondholders say NO. __________________ Go from the presence of a foolish man, when thou perceivest not in him the lips of knowledge General Motors ASEP, A.S. Automotive Technology, Telecommunications Specialist, CISCO Network Engineer STANDARD DISCLAIMER camaro5 is furnishing this information "as is". camaro5 does not provide any warranty of the information whatsoever, whether express, implied, or statutory, including, but not limited to, any warranty of merchantability or fitness for a particular purpose or any warranty that the contents of the information will be error-free.

03-29-2009, 10:38 PM	#11
Justin Camaro5's Cell Phone Geek Drives: '02 V6 Camaro. 5 speed manual. Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Pennsylvania Posts: 406	I'm starting to think that bankruptcy might be a better option. The media has been dragging GM's name around as it is. At least with bankruptcy they can shed some of the debt. __________________ 2SS RJT with black rally stripes, RS package, sunroof, painted engine block cover. It's either that or a damned similar 'vert in a few years.

03-30-2009, 05:32 PM	#13
Tomash Drives: (black 2SS Camaro), Suzuki SX4 Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Poland Posts: 205	(a small rant following -- be warned) I still don't manage to understand how could they (GM, as I don't care about Chrysler anyway) screw it up so powerfully? GM has Opel in Germany (with factories all over Europe) which is one of the most successful car companies selling in Europe and definitely bringing big profit for the GM (actually so big Opel wants to separate from GM to not get drained of its money by dying company). GM has the whole ex-Daewoo stack (same thing about factories) doing cheap and popular (in developing countries, in Europe aswell) cars branded Chevrolet (Lacetti, Aveo, Epica, now Cruze). They definitely are profitable, as based on old and working platforms (no R&D costs) and selling well. (Daewoo Lanos, based on 30+ yrs old GM T platform, is still manufactured and sold in Ukraine -- and being damn popular!) GM has Saab in Sweden which may have been a bit under the line recently, but not enough to drag the whole group down (it was always a relatively small manufacturer). How much have they failed in US so that even big income from the whole european market is not enough? It means a giant, epic FAIL -- to eat out whole profit from outside US and still be on the red. This means GM has lost on its homeground -- the US Market. Lost to what, Toyota and Honda? Wow. I've seen a lot of crappy decisions going out from GM in recent years. I don't even want to talk about american market, as being an european I don't know anything about it. But treating Europe like a 2nd-class client was aiming straight for the knee -- and it landed. Europe hasn't seen official dealerships selling Corvettes (which ARE popular and liked in Europe, and their prices would make them definitely competitive to Porsche and other supercars) or other high-performance cars. GM has recently shut down a Hummer factory, because SUV sales dramatically dropped in US -- at the same time in Europe SUVs have seen the biggest growth in sales in 2008 (!) and I see Toyota's RAV4 or Honda's CRV and HRV all over the place (together with more expensive BMW X3 and X5 and Audi's SUVs). As for the pony cars... do you know how many Ford dealerships in Europe oficially sell new Mustangs? None. Do you want to know how easy is to spot a individually-imported Mustang? Definitely harder that it would be had they been sold here officially, but still there's a lot of them. Hell, even I'm thinking about getting a Mustang from such importer, because GM doesn't want me to buy a Camaro easily in Europe. AND they've blocked american dealers from selling Camaro's overseas. GM has announced availability of Camaro in Europe, even gave the price tag (17k EUR base) and... nothing. Not a word. No preorder for europeans. European Opel/Chevrolet dealers don't know crap about Camaro availability (it's spring 2009, goddamit!). You don't want to sell me a Camaro? Fine, I'll go visit Nissan dealership -- they're selling 350Z (and will be 370) since the very beginning of the model. Anyone still wondering why The Big Three already lost the european market? With it's full economy that hasn't been struck by recession as powerfully as the american one? The Big Three has been outsmart by short and very clever people from a small, island country far away from both Europe and the US. Way to go, champs!

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