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blaSSt · 05-23-2008, 03:53 PM

Basically my response to Dragoneye earlier.

It's easy to see converting food crop is bad.

People say celluosic Ethanol can displace a LOT. How much is a LOT? How about 5%? How can we get there?

Household Garbage
Ethanol from 'garbage' has extremely low yield. Typical household garbage is expected to yield 4-10 gallons per ton. Waste average is 1000 lbs. per yer per person. Garbage from 300 million people 'could' generate about 1.5 billion gallons per year. There's 1%.

Tires
100% of the tires sold in the US (say they each generate equivalent waste) produces less than 0.7% of the requirement.

Wood
5% Ethanol in the total gasoline stream from forrest would need to consume 650 million acres of forest per year. There are about 747 million acres of forrest in the US. Not viable as far as I'm concerned. So let's let it contribute 0.5%. 65million acres.

Switchgrass
If we want 5% Ethanol in the total gasoline stream from switchgrass, it takes 900 million acres of land by Costaka's data. That is equal to 1.4 million square miles of land, 40% of the total land area of the US, equal to the seven largest states combined Alaska, Texas, California, Montana, New Mexico, Arizona, and Nevada.

Now we have 1% from 100% of household garbage, from 0.7% from 100% of used tires (still made from fossil fuels by the way), 0.5% from forrests, and need 2.8% from switchgrass.

The US has 3.5 million square miles of land, 1.4 million in agriculture, 1.1 million square miles of land is forrested, 0.75 million square miles of land is in switchgrass for EtOH production, leaving 250 thousand square miles for people to live on, including roads, commercial businesses, homes, etc.

All that to get to E5. Makes E10 or E85 unfathomable.

Celluosic EtOH can contribute, and we should. But, the scale needed for it to be a major contributor is mindboggling.

05-23-2008, 03:53 PM	#11
blaSSt Drives: 98 SS, 15 COPO, 09 ZR1 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 442 View My Garage	Basically my response to Dragoneye earlier. It's easy to see converting food crop is bad. People say celluosic Ethanol can displace a LOT. How much is a LOT? How about 5%? How can we get there? Household Garbage Ethanol from 'garbage' has extremely low yield. Typical household garbage is expected to yield 4-10 gallons per ton. Waste average is 1000 lbs. per yer per person. Garbage from 300 million people 'could' generate about 1.5 billion gallons per year. There's 1%. Tires 100% of the tires sold in the US (say they each generate equivalent waste) produces less than 0.7% of the requirement. Wood 5% Ethanol in the total gasoline stream from forrest would need to consume 650 million acres of forest per year. There are about 747 million acres of forrest in the US. Not viable as far as I'm concerned. So let's let it contribute 0.5%. 65million acres. Switchgrass If we want 5% Ethanol in the total gasoline stream from switchgrass, it takes 900 million acres of land by Costaka's data. That is equal to 1.4 million square miles of land, 40% of the total land area of the US, equal to the seven largest states combined Alaska, Texas, California, Montana, New Mexico, Arizona, and Nevada. Now we have 1% from 100% of household garbage, from 0.7% from 100% of used tires (still made from fossil fuels by the way), 0.5% from forrests, and need 2.8% from switchgrass. The US has 3.5 million square miles of land, 1.4 million in agriculture, 1.1 million square miles of land is forrested, 0.75 million square miles of land is in switchgrass for EtOH production, leaving 250 thousand square miles for people to live on, including roads, commercial businesses, homes, etc. All that to get to E5. Makes E10 or E85 unfathomable. Celluosic EtOH can contribute, and we should. But, the scale needed for it to be a major contributor is mindboggling. __________________ On the internet - Anything is possible, especially when you don't know what you are talking about.