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Retarded One-Legged Owl
Drives: 2010 Black Camaro 2SS
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 9,745
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartan01
Actually,
the cop CAN search your car. He may legally search around your immediate seating area. Essentially any area you can reach while sitting in the car.
Now, The cop must have a legal reason to do so. However, he can always say something to the effect of "The subject in question was making furtive movements under/around his seating area while I approached the vehicle." or "Due to my training as a law enforcement officer, the subject was acting in a suspicious and highly agitated manner leading me to believe that he was in possesion of weapons and or contraband."
Again both of these statements, or statements to the same effect are highly subjective, and very difficult to disprove.
Now, in your state of Texas, it May be legal to carry as you do, and it May be legal to not inform the officer, THAT IS YOUR RIGHT. However, AND STRICTLY SPEAKING ONLY OF MY OWN PERSONAL EXPERIENCES AND BELIEFS- that is RUDE, and IF I catch you, I am lighting you up. For the intitial infractions as well as the 6 or so other infractions I can always find. Most of which are very silly and petty, but if you are rude...
Also, from my own personal experiences and beliefs, if you let me know right up front that you are cool dude, and have a cool attitude, or you are an insanely hot chick, I am MOST LIKELY to let you go with a warning.
9 times out of 10 (excluding Parking, Accidents, Striking a Pedestrian, or Illegal Right on Red, all of which in my jurisdiction REQUIRED a ticket, i.e. NO discretion on the officer's part) attitude was everything.
Also understand that I am a HUGE supporter of 2nd ammendment rights. I am a lifetime NRA member, etc. so I am not at all anti gun.
I also worked in an extremely violent district with major gun crime issues.
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Plain sight and warrantless search are two very different things. And yes, if an officer decides to tell me he has probable cause to search my vehicle, then I will inform him what he will find.
That being said, you have to be acting 10 shades of suspicious for an officer to get to the point of a warrantless search.
If I follow all of the above procedures outlined in the OP, and act courteous to the officer, and do all of that EXCEPT tell him I have a gun in the car, then the officer has absolutely zero probable cause to perform a warrantless search of my vehicle. Period.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartan01
EXACTLY my point.
some jurisdictions informing the officer is the law, sometimes not a requirement.
BUT, PERSONALLY, if you are a LEGAL CCW holder, and are carrying, I already know you have been fingerprinted, trained atleast to some standard etc. If you let me know up front, and you have no outstanding warrants etc, I will almost always let you go.
On the other hand,
people often forget that many cops are trained to spot what is know as "printing,' i.e. giving away the fact that you are carrying a weapon (legal or illegal.) So alot of times, we will notice the weapon. If you didnt tell me upfront, the list of petty things I can hit you with is endless.
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As I understand it, "printing" is generally in reference to being able to notice where someone is concealing their firearm based on subtle bulges in their attire. That becomes a little more difficult when someone is seated inside a vehicle performing all of the OP's outlined behavioral patterns. It becomes impossible when the firearm the person has is completely concealed inside a center console.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spartan01
This ranges from "Objects hanging from mirror,' Tint violations, ANY saftey inspection issue (such as horn not functioning or burned out tail light, tire tread depth, etc. Many of which require you to personally go to an inspection station and prove the item is working which is a major pain in the a$$.)
I could even "theoretically" hit you with one of these violations, and your tail light was fine, but you would still have to prove that it was working, and GOOD LUCK proving that the officer lied- Generally, at most he would say "It was out when I pulled them over, must be a short." and get a walk. Remember, it is not your word vs. the cops word, it is your word vs. the STATE's word, and the state never, ever likes to admit it is worng or can be flawed.
Another favorite of mine was to hit you with "Failure to Turn Wheels To The Right during a Traffic Stop," This was a very little known law, that most cops never enforce, but if you pi$$ed me off..
Anyway, my whole long winded point, was that generally attitude is everything and that officers get yelled at, cussed at, spit on, etc. all day long. A little courtesy goes a LONG way.
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Believe me, I absolutely understand that your job requires you to meet all sorts of people in many cases on the worst day of their lives. And for that reason alone, I don't feel it worth my time to give you any attitude other than calm and courteous. I wouldn't want someone intentionally berating me just for doing my job. Therefore, I have no intention of berating an officer just because he caught me red-handed going a few miles over the speed limit.
That being said, if I get caught going five over, that doesn't mean I need to bring up something that is completely unrelated to the stop at hand. In my opinion, if it is legal for me to have something in my car, then what use is it to bring it up? A firearm, without my hand on it, is just a hunk of metal. If I have a baseball bat, hammer or tire iron in the back seat, should I also inform the officer of those weapons as well, even though it's perfectly legal for me to own them and have them in my vehicle?
I fully understand that you think it's considered a courtesy to inform you that I have a firearm in my car, but isn't vocally proclaiming that you have a weapon considered a crime because you are effectively "brandishing" that fact openly?
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