Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverTurtle
what if, what if, what if... your theories are wonderful and support the dealerships so well, you might as well get a job as their spin doctor that supports them raping the customers.
you have defended screwing the customer... and you have chosen to read almost NOTHING of what I actually said in my theories and scenarios... since you didn't read it the first time, I'll give it to you again:
1) the MSRP, contrary to your belief, is sufficient to keep a dealership in business presuming that they operate efficiently and do not have an excessively high overhead... I know you dont believe that this is true, but I used to work for a dealership and I can promise you that it is true... also, dealerships make money from their service departments, so your theory that they make money just from the sale of new cars is completely inaccurate.
2) when one dealership does it, they almost all do it... so in any town, it is very likely that if one dealership is adding a markup, most of the dealerships in that town are adding markup... thus screwing the customer who probably doesn't want to, or cannot afford to, go out of the area to get a replacement car.
3) there are Auto Auctions for selling at above MSRP... dealerships should not be damaging the brand by selling above MSRP... a dealership can reserve the right not to sell a car to someone if they feel they can make more from another customer, this is true... but posting the markup on the window is blatantly damaging the brand.
it is NOT good for the brand when people who can pay thousands over MSRP get all the cars and those that cannot pay that price get nothing... if you cannot see that then you are ignorant of the reality of the situation.
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1) I worked at a dealership too, and went through nearly every department, including accounting. Yes, the dealers often get rebates to get the car's initial cost below invoice, but even then, when you consider that salesperson and finance person commission (at least enough to live on) takes up nearly the entire pre-rebate profit over invoice, you need that rebate money to cover everything else. Even then, the rebate is about enough to cover all other expenses, leaving pretty much nothing else. Sure they make profits on the service and back end of the deal, but by providing the car for you, storing it, and making sure its perfect as you drive it off the lot, they have performed a service and should be compensated. Can they stay in operation selling at MSRP or below? Yes, but the margins are slim. Having a car that they can sell for a larger margin allows for expansion, new initiatives, or a financial cushion for hard times (like now).
2) Not true. We have a list here of dealers who won't do it. My old dealership didn't do it. Our volume allowed us not to (fixed overhead could be spread over a larger sales number) and some are in similarly good financial shape that they can choose not to (see above).
3) Auto auctions are different than dealerships. Its apples to oranges. And you can't really say the brand is damaged. Do you see people hating Dodge now that the Challenger is going for $20K over MSRP? No. They hate Dodge because they have bad interiors and heavy cars...
The fact is, people vote with their dollars, and when they pay extra for a product, they're giving it extra votes. Attracting the demand to allow for huge markups means the product (and subsequently the brand) did something to attract higher than average popularity.
There is a difference between what you would like and what should really be. I would like to have free gas, but I have to pay for it, and that is how it should be. I would like all these government services and not pay taxes, but that's not life. I would certainly like for a dealer to screw himself over to give me a car for way less than the next guy is willing to pay for it (and screw that other guy over too) and in many cases, that does happen, but just because I want it that way doesn't mean the dealers have an obligation to cater to my whim. Many do, and they'll get my business, but many don't and that's fine, they'll get their business too.